# Britains Got Talent "Faker"



## SpeedcuberJH (May 26, 2016)

So, history has repeated itself. Does anyone remember that IDIOT who got very far on (Ukrains got talent???) by faking Rubik's cube solves? He literally solved a 7x7 blindfolded (with no inspection) in less time it takes world record holders to do it. Not only that but he didn't even use any known method of solving the 7x7 which was further proof that he was a fake. So yes I will give him credit for memorizing a 7x7 but seriously!!!

If anyone wanted to see the actual video here it is:





So the part about "history repeating itself" is here. This guy has solved 3 Rubik's cube blindfolded, again with NO INSPECTION and has wowed the audiences. 

Here's the video:





I think this is a very annoying... Ugh happening??? And I think this should not be done by ANYONE. If your going to audition on a talent show for cubing do something like Rami did!

Here's the video: 





-Jetdeboss 

BTW anyone going to Connors cube day GOOD LUCK!


----------



## hamfaceman (May 26, 2016)

Let's get real here, basically every part of these talent shows are fake. And let me ask you, would a TV producer want to air an hour of 7BLD memo?


----------



## SpeedcuberJH (May 26, 2016)

hamfaceman said:


> Let's get real here, basically every part of these talent shows are fake. And let me ask you, would a TV producer want to air an hour of 7BLD memo?


Yes, I agree, a lot of these things are fake but are you proposing that the 7x7 solve was real? It's under WR time and he's using an alien method...


----------



## Isaac Lai (May 26, 2016)

He was not on Britain's Got Talent. That guy is Maxim Chechnev, the guy who supposedly did 7BLD on Ukraine's Got Talent.


----------



## AlphaSheep (May 26, 2016)

Seriously? It's an act performed on stage for an audience. If the fact that an act is fake bothers you, you probably shouldn't be watching TV.


----------



## SpeedcuberJH (May 26, 2016)

Isaac Lai said:


> He was not on Britain's Got Talent. That guy is Maxim Chechnev, the guy who supposedly did 7BLD on Ukraine's Got Talent.


I was talking about the 3BLD guy.... Sorry if I was unclear!


----------



## hamfaceman (May 26, 2016)

SpeedcuberJH said:


> Yes, I agree, a lot of these things are fake but are you proposing that the 7x7 solve was real? It's under WR time and he's using an alien method...


The day it becomes these show's job to inform the public of the widely accepted BLD method is the day the world ends. 99.9% of people won't notice these kinds of things and will just say "OMG WOW HE DID A RUBIX WITHOUT SEEING!!1!" And on the topic of the 7BLD solve being fake, of course it is. But it's no big deal. Sure, it might take a chunk out of his reputation in the community, but it's putting cubing in the mainstream. So I don't see why you're so 'annoyed' that we're getting into the public eye.


----------



## guysensei1 (May 26, 2016)

Just be glad that cubing is getting exposure, okay?


----------



## h2f (May 26, 2016)

SpeedcuberJH said:


> So the part about "history repeating itself" is here. This guy has solved 3 Rubik's cube blindfolded, again with NO INSPECTION and has wowed the audiences.


 He could memo them earlier like Maskow did in Poland's version of the show in the second part and in finals, if i'm correct. Define what fake is and it's clear if it is or not a fake.


----------



## Xtremecubing (May 26, 2016)

h2f said:


> He could memo them earlier like Maskow did in Poland's version of the show in the second part and in finals, if i'm correct. Define what fake is and it's clear if it is or not a fake.



Due to the fact that he did an OH U perm we know he didn't use regular BLD techniques. He could have done speedbld, which is unlikely, or he could have done the same scramble over and over again until he memorized it, which is the most probable theory IMO


----------



## Toddyt1 (May 26, 2016)

"Fake" 

Except he states that he is performing a show of intelligence. Memorising three cubes (regardless of what he's memorising, in the case the set of moves to solve each one) is a show of intelligence.

And he would have done a speed solve on the show if Stephen Mulhern hadn't been dicking about.


----------



## whauk (May 26, 2016)

guysensei1 said:


> Just be glad that cubing is getting exposure, okay?


The point is that this has not much to do with cubing.

*A little technical analysis:*
Has someone noticed that both the second solve and the additional in the end finished with an H-perm? The second solve seems to finish with random PLL, <R,U,L>-J-perm, Hperm. And in the additional solve we clearly have a cut towards the end (also the audio doesn't match up), but still one can see something like U L' as in the solve before (finish of J-perm) and then the H-perm. I didn't look for more, but I am 90% confident, that those two solves were identical.
When watching it again, I also saw, that the first and second scramble seem to be identical up to a rotation (look at 3:13) and the last move in the first solve was also an M2.
Conclusion: This person's blind method seems to be only ONE memorized solution for 2-handed, and potentially something different for onehanded (not enough data here).

*Discussion of the situation:*
We had this discussion before with Maxim Chechnev's performance. Here are some of the key aspects for your consideration (as I remember them):

It is possible to impress an audience without faking anything. E.g. Rami Sbahi and Simon Westlund did this. Simon Westlund even won Sweden's talent show. (I don't know about Rami though).
This is a fraud, since he makes people believe, that the cubes were randomly scrambled and that the performance could be repeated similarly with different scrambles, which is a lie.
This is not comparable to a magic show, because the key aspect of a magic show is an illusion, i.e. the audience knows (little children excluded), that the magician did not _really_ make a dove appear out of nothing. His talent is apparently to solve Rubik's cubes blind, the magician's talent is to make one believe he accomplished something physically impossible. The magician succeeds at this. This guy can however not really solve any Rubik's cube blind in a similar setting.
It DOES matter. Performances like this degrade the hours of hard work that honest speedcubers have put into their hobby. A conversation like this might happen in the future:


> Person: So you can solve the Rubik's cube?
> Speedcuber: Yeah.
> Person: How long does it take you?
> Speedcuber: Well maybe 15-20 seconds... It depends
> ...


and suddenly the speedcuber is the dumb guy.​This was maybe all, that I have to contribute.


----------



## AlphaSheep (May 26, 2016)

This is the same guy who was part of the group of three on Romania's Got Talent who solved cubes selected from 100 scrambles. They were quite open afterwards that all 100 were variations on the same scramble, so I'm pretty sure that this is the same idea.

Regarding the idea that this degrades all of the work that honest speedcubers have put into their hobbies... That's ridiculous. I've put those hours in because I enjoy it. if you're putting those hours in purely for recognition from others, then that's really sad.

Again, this is a rehearsed act for a show, and it creates interest in cubing from the general public, which in my opinion is a very good thing. The fact that people are somehow offended by that is just silly.


----------



## JanW (May 26, 2016)

Third cube is almost the same. Only down center and down right differ from first 2 cubes. He starts all solves with a D' move, this move reveals same faces on third cube as on the first two cubes (relative to colors on the visible face). Probably most of the solve is the same, with some little difference somewhere.


----------



## shadowslice e (May 26, 2016)

AlphaSheep said:


> This is the same guy who was part of the group of three on Romania's Got Talent who solved cubes selected from 100 scrambles. They were quite open afterwards that all 100 were variations on the same scramble, so I'm pretty sure that this is the same idea.
> 
> Regarding the idea that this degrades all of the work that honest speedcubers have put into their hobbies... That's ridiculous. I've put those hours in because I enjoy it. if you're putting those hours in purely for recognition from others, then that's really sad.
> 
> Again, this is a rehearsed act for a show, and it creates interest in cubing from the general public, which in my opinion is a very good thing. The fact that people are somehow offended by that is just silly.


i do agree that you should be doing it for fun rather than recognition, however, this


> Person: So you can solve the Rubik's cube?
> Speedcuber: Yeah.
> Person: How long does it take you?
> Speedcuber: Well maybe 15-20 seconds... It depends
> ...


can get very, very annoying.


----------



## CuBouz (May 26, 2016)

I don't think his intention was "blind/speed solving" as we define it in the first place so I don't see much point in criticizing him for not doing it in accordance with WCA regulations (although it would have been nice if he had.)


----------



## Toddyt1 (May 26, 2016)

CuBouz said:


> I don't think his intention was "blind/speed solving" as we define it in the first place so I don't see much point in criticizing him for not doing it in accordance with WCA regulations (although it would have been nice if he had.)


The acts are time limited and wouldn't have been very interesting if he had.


----------



## Ordway Persyn (May 26, 2016)

You may not understand but no one would wan't to sit through a Legitimate 3/3 Mbld as It takes quite a bit of time (unless your really fast) and you may mess up as well.


----------



## Toddyt1 (May 26, 2016)

Ordway Persyn said:


> You may not understand but no one would wan't to sit through a Legitimate 3/3 Mbld as It takes quite a bit of time (unless your really fast) and you may mess up as well.



Though, you could argue that he could've pre-memorised the cubes and then used conventional blind solving methods. They can be executed pretty quickly. 


Still think being mad about this is stupid.


----------



## SpeedCuber71 (May 26, 2016)

Yes, he is making cubing gain more popularity but HE is also gaining it. He is being praised and being viewed by millions of people online. Don't you think he shouldn't get all this for basically nothing? Yeah yeah he prepared an act it takes courage he put work into it blah blah blah cubing is not a F*cking illusion like magic. Its gotta be real. Magicians master illusion and faking. Not cubers. They practice sitting at home to get better while some other random cuber puts a tiny bit of effort and does a couple of algorithms on 3 cubes on live TV.

This is my solution - Make someone else (you could call the commentators who introduce the contestants, or even make judges do it after kinda doing it yourself as they won't waste time) scramble the puzzles without you looking at the start of your act/ performance,


AlphaSheep said:


> Seriously? It's an act performed on stage for an audience. If the fact that an act is fake bothers you, you probably shouldn't be watching TV.


Cubing is not something that is supposed to be faked like magic and isn't as popular as stuff like WWE that faking it won't matter. The communtiy needs to be presented/ popularised with legit stuff. Otherwise we will have more of those non-cbers saying "hey! you're just following a pattern You are cheating" etc.


----------



## Thatoneguy2 (May 26, 2016)

While people like Maskow who did bld solves for real don't usually do it for recognition, this guy is. The fast people have put tons of practice in to do something that almost nobody else in the world can, while this guy just spent a small amount to time to decieve people to get attention. It seems a bit unfair, although I guess life is unfair too.


----------



## Toddyt1 (May 26, 2016)

SpeedCuber71 said:


> Yes, he is making cubing gain more popularity but HE is also gaining it. He is being praised and being viewed by millions of people online. Don't you think he shouldn't get all this for basically nothing? Yeah yeah he prepared an act it takes courage he put work into it blah blah blah cubing is not a F*cking illusion like magic. Its gotta be real. Magicians master illusion and faking. Not cubers. They practice sitting at home to get better while some other random cuber puts a tiny bit of effort and does a couple of algorithms on 3 cubes on live TV.
> 
> This is my solution - Make someone else (you could call the commentators who introduce the contestants, or even make judges do it after kinda doing it yourself as they won't waste time) scramble the puzzles without you looking at the start of your act/ performance,
> 
> Cubing is not something that is supposed to be faked like magic and isn't as popular as stuff like WWE that faking it won't matter. The communtiy needs to be presented/ popularised with legit stuff. Otherwise we will have more of those non-cbers saying "hey! you're just following a pattern You are cheating" etc.



You are just following a pattern though. That's what the methods are.


----------



## Darja (May 26, 2016)

It's an entertainment show, not a cubing competition. The point is to perform the most entertaining act. It's not entertaining to watch some guy do memo for over a minute. I think that goes without saying. Sure, you can do legit big cube/MBLD if you're Mascow. If you're not in that ballpark, you might as well plan the best act possible with the tools you have. It's not the contestants responsibility to provide a realistic view of cubing. It's to entertain with the motivation of money. While some cubers might not consider revised BLD solves ethical, it can be used to expose more people to cubing. 

The acts aren't going to be policed, don't get too uptight.


----------



## adimare (May 26, 2016)

He really did solve those cubes blindfolded tho. I bet that if you tell a member of the audience that the method he used to do so is different from what's used at competitions they'd still be similarly impressed.


----------



## Toddyt1 (May 26, 2016)

adimare said:


> He really did solve those cubes blindfolded tho. I bet that if you tell a member of the audience that the method he used to do so is different from what's used at competitions they'd still be similarly impressed.


Exactly, he memorised moves instead of normal memorisation technique and solve.


----------



## JanW (May 26, 2016)

adimare said:


> He really did solve those cubes blindfolded tho. I bet that if you tell a member of the audience that the method he used to do so is different from what's used at competitions they'd still be similarly impressed.


Though would they be equally impressed if you told them he didn't solve three cubes, but solved pretty much the same cube 3 times? Kind of odd that he didn't even bother to rotate the cubes on the table to hide the fact that he was using the same scramble. It wouldn't have been so hard to pick up the second cube with a x rotation. And compared to the effort put in to some other acts on the show, it would not be that much work to memorize three completely different solves either.

Anyway, I don't blame him for taking advantage of the format of the competition. It is what it is, and he does what needs to be done there to get through to the next round. A lot of acts on those talent shows look bad or mediocre at best to those who know more about whatever art they are performing. But since the judges aren't experts in those fields, they are still impressed. It's more about being impressive to the layman than showcasing extraordinary skills.


----------



## tx789 (May 27, 2016)

I question why a Romanian is on Britian's got Talent. 

The cheating thing does undermine people who can do it for real. This has been discussed before. However this time the cheating is on Britian got Talent.


----------



## Mikel (May 27, 2016)

We should petition to the World Got Talent Association to contract WCA officials to watch over their stinkin competitions. The fakery and cheatery going on here is an outrage that needs to be doused.


----------



## SpeedcuberJH (May 27, 2016)

These fakers are misrepresenting what cubing actually is.


----------



## Toddyt1 (May 27, 2016)

tx789 said:


> I question why a Romanian is on Britian's got Talent.
> 
> The cheating thing does undermine people who can do it for real. This has been discussed before. However this time the cheating is on Britian got Talent.






Mikel said:


> We should petition to the World Got Talent Association to contract WCA officials to watch over their stinkin competitions. The fakery and cheatery going on here is an outrage that needs to be doused.



You're both being enormously stupid.


----------



## SpeedcuberJH (May 27, 2016)

Toddyt1 said:


> You're both being enormously stupid.


Lets try not to start a feud here.


----------



## Toddyt1 (May 27, 2016)

SpeedcuberJH said:


> Lets try not to start a feud here.



Haha. Feud over what? The fact that this forum is full of idiots who think it's not prohibitively expensive to have WCA reps (who are volunteers) at talent shows.

Haha the community at this forum is full of idiotic children. Not sure why I started coming back here TBH.


----------



## SpeedCuber71 (May 27, 2016)

Toddyt1 said:


> You are just following a pattern though. That's what the methods are.



You clearly don't have much cubing knowledge and aren't very good at speedcubing. Also, you didn't understand what i meant


----------



## Toddyt1 (May 27, 2016)

SpeedCuber71 said:


> You clearly don't have much cubing knowledge and aren't very good at speedcubing. Also, you didn't understand what i meant



Better than you. You do understand what a pattern is right?

PATTERN: the regular and repeated way in which something happens or is done

Speedcubing methods and other solving methods very much for the definition of pattern.

You're only further proving the perpetual idiocy of the majority of member of this forum.


----------



## SpeedCuber71 (May 27, 2016)

Toddyt1 said:


> Better than you. You do understand what a pattern is right?
> 
> PATTERN: the regular and repeated way in which something happens or is done
> 
> ...


 Ummm you do realise that i was referring to Non cubers sayig that we follow just a pattern for each scramble and don't actually use our brains/ intuition? I get what you're saying. Of course we follow the same steps for each solve. That is obvious. Try and understand what i meant.


----------



## SpeedCuber71 (May 27, 2016)

I'm out of this discussion, bye.


----------



## tx789 (May 27, 2016)

Toddyt1 said:


> You're both being enormously stupid.


I don't think I'm being stupid. This topic has been discussed before however since this is on Britain's got Talent, there's more potential people watching it since it's in English. That's all I have to say.


----------



## Toddyt1 (May 27, 2016)

SpeedCuber71 said:


> Ummm you do realise that i was referring to Non cubers sayig that we follow just a pattern for each scramble and don't actually use our brains/ intuition? I get what you're saying. Of course we follow the same steps for each solve. That is obvious. Try and understand what i meant.



Hurr durr. Try and actually understand what things mean


----------



## Toddyt1 (May 27, 2016)

tx789 said:


> I don't think I'm being stupid. This topic has been discussed before however since this is on Britain's got Talent, there's more potential people watching it since it's in English. That's all I have to say.



Clearly you don't understand the format of the show. To which it is not there responsibility to make cubing recognised. It's a tiny hobby. If you want recognition go play a major sport or something.


----------



## mark49152 (May 27, 2016)

My favourite reaction: "How can he solve that thing without looking? It must have braille on it or something".


----------



## SpeedcuberJH (May 27, 2016)

mark49152 said:


> My favourite reaction: "How can he solve that thing without looking? It must have braille on it or something".


Haha!


----------



## JohnnyReggae (May 27, 2016)

SpeedCuber71 said:


> ... Otherwise we will have more of those non-cbers saying "hey! you're just following a pattern You are cheating" etc.



To be honest you will always get those comments because some people believe it to be impossible so therefore no one can actually do it, and if you can you are cheating somehow. Do I care ... no. 

I watched the BGT show with the 3bld and obviously is was faked but I still carried on watching it, mostly to see the judges reactions which were as I expected. Did it upset me, no ... the show was just that a show. Certainly within the cubing community we know that the solves were fake, but the audience did not and so in the end the show was a hit .... fake or not.


----------



## tx789 (May 27, 2016)

Toddyt1 said:


> Clearly you don't understand the format of the show. To which it is not there responsibility to make cubing recognised. It's a tiny hobby. If you want recognition go play a major sport or something.



Speedcubing revives recognition by being on the show. Maybe not much but a little.

This guy faking bld solves undermines those who seriously practice, this is mainly problem due to non-cuber ignorance. He is going on TV and faking these stunts, on a talent show. Think of it as you will.

I can't bothered arguing. This topic has been discussed before. I have nothing too add.


----------



## shadowslice e (May 27, 2016)

The only problem I have that when non-cubers talk to me about it they always compare whatever I say to whatever fake videos they see. This is not really a big problem but it can get very, very annoying when they say I'm just jealous when I tell them it's fake.

While I don't think that this undermines anyone's efforts when the person is open about it like this guy, the 20 sec juggling guy insisting it's real is quite annoying and rather poor on their part.

Certainly, it is more important to have the respect of people who know what they are talking about and just having fun than what the general public thinks but it does get very annoying.

However, these are not worth having an argument over and especially not worth insulting others over especially on an open forum where I think those who have resorted to such methods in order to get their "point" across are seriously pushing what us acceptable. In this way, I find the biggest problem on this thread not to be the fake solves (and personally, I do find it impressive that he memorised all those moves whether he did it with a conventional BLD method or (almost certainly as he seems to indicate) not) but rather the people who have turned this into a thread filled with the lowest form of verbal taunting.


----------



## SiTeMaRo (May 27, 2016)

Flavian Glont's solves weren't fake. He memorized them before entering the stage.


----------



## Dene (May 27, 2016)

I agree with Toddyt1, at least as far as calling a lot of people out for saying stupid stuff.

Anyway, it's a shame he isn't much of a performer. Doesn't look like he made it far, based on the wiki page.


----------



## AlphaSheep (May 27, 2016)

SpeedcuberJH said:


> Well that can be proven wrong quite easily by the way he solved it. He didn't use a known method.


CFOP isn't a known method? News to me.

Anyway, a lot of people are talking about this guy as if he isn't a speedcuber. He actually has a sub-10 single and a mid 10 average in an official comp, and has had several BLD successes in competition, so it's not like he doesn't know how to do it legitimately. He obviously just felt his performance would be better the way he did it.



shadowslice e said:


> I find the biggest problem on this thread not to be the fake solves (and personally, I do find it impressive that he memorised all those moves whether he did it with a conventional BLD method or (almost certainly as he seems to indicate) not) but rather the people who have turned this into a thread filled with the lowest form of verbal taunting.


Agreed.


----------



## SpeedcuberJH (May 27, 2016)

AlphaSheep said:


> CFOP isn't a known method? News to me.
> 
> Anyway, a lot of people are talking about this guy as if he isn't a speedcuber. He actually has a sub-10 single and a mid 10 average in an official comp, and has had several BLD successes in competition, so it's not like he doesn't know how to do it legitimately. He obviously just felt his performance would be better the way he did it.
> 
> ...


Oh. I got the guys mixed up there. And he must be terrible at 2x2 because he went hype for getting a 3 second solve...


----------



## bulletpal (May 29, 2016)

So, here is my take on it:
(warning, a large comment)


Spoiler: The Facts



He could have had someone else scramble it before hand, as well as doing the memo. As far as speed goes, we have no idea how long it really took him, because it was not airing live, and there were edits. For example, the cut at 6:30 clearly cut out a large portion of the solve. Also, he is clearly a legit speed cuber judging by his tps. So, he obviously knows about the speedcubing community, and how we can bust fake solves etc. IMO, if he was faking it, he would not have memorized the same scramble twice. That would be dumb, in this community. And, he would have had plenty of time to memo 3 cubes legit. Sure, he could have done the memo on stage, but that would have taken probably at least ten minutes.

However... Imo, his solves did not seem right to me. First of all, if you can do multi blind, you would most likely use the same orientation each time. Also, in the first solve, at 3:51, you can clearly see that f2l is done, indicating that he is using cfop or at least lbl. On the second solve at 4:15, you can see that the f2l is clearly done, as well as OLL. I worked it out, and in fact, the cube looks exactly like this:








a G-Perm with a U' AUF. but... instead he did a Jb perm indicating that he is using something like OP, the Yellow/Orange piece being the buffer. but then a U-Perm clockwise. normally, you would target UF>UL, but this works too. But if he was doing CFOP, then why not a G-Perm? Well, first of all, it is a G-Perm. doing one of those without looking is kinda risky. However, it is possible that he may have been permuting the corners then edges, but unlikely that he would use a J-perm. Personally, i think he just didn't want to do a G-perm blindfolded. If so, then that takes *planning ahead of time*. *cough**cough* cheating. And on the third cube, there wasn't much footage, but he clearly did sideways CFOP - almost Petrus style - with a U-perm at the end. He did it sideways, because apparently that is how he does OH. Now... were 2 or more of the solves identical? Three, no. Two, maybe. The 3rd solve was a counterclockwise U perm, while the other two were clockwise U perms. If one solve was different, the chances are, the other two are different as well, agreeing with my assumption above.



So, were the solves fake? Most likely. Whatever method he was using was not a blind method, but instead one that takes planning ahead of time... at home... on a scramble generator...

The Real Question is Why? Did you really have to fake it?


----------



## Renox (May 29, 2016)

I think that the annoying thing about this is that it's a talent show. That means you show off your talent. If memorising three almost identical solves is a skill, while not even trying to hide it because you believe you have a shot at winning money by deceiving people with your talentless "skills", then I don't even understand why I bother anymore.


----------



## stoic (May 29, 2016)

I'm also in the "don't really mind" camp. If it brings cubing to a bigger audience, I find it hard to object to this.
A slightly different perspective: I know a singing act who did reasonably well on one of these competitions recently. In order to get to the "on stage in front of an audience" part of the show, they had to pass multiple auditions in front of producers etc. (They had failed to get past this stage several times previously.) By the time they were singing live on TV in the following round, they were forced by the production team to sing a song they didn't even like. They were absolutely furious about this, but were told in no uncertain terms that they weren't allowed any input into the format and that if they didn't toe the line they'd be dropped.


----------



## Dene (May 30, 2016)

bulletpal said:


> So, here is my take on it:
> ...
> So, were the solves fake? Most likely. Whatever method he was using was not a blind method, but instead one that takes planning ahead of time... at home... on a scramble generator...
> 
> The Real Question is Why? Did you really have to fake it?



Could you please define "fake"?


----------



## Sion (Jun 4, 2016)

I noticed that the first two cubes had the exact same scramble, but on different faces, so to non-cubers it looked like an entirely different scramble.


----------



## tseitsei (Jun 8, 2016)

I didn't really read all of the thread but I'm just gonna throw in my 2 cents here...

This kind of guys disgust and annoy me immensely because of one simple reason:
It makes actual BLD solvers who have practised hundreds of hours look bad and really ridicules and undermines their efforts. I don't like that one bit. If you want to be able to do something amazing then learn to actually do it. 

Now doing different kind of tricks and stuff that involves rubiks cube is totally fine and ok as long as you are letting the audience know that it is exactly that. Tricks. And not actually legit solves. Good example about this is this awesome guy:


----------

