# BLD training?



## rjohnson_8ball (Sep 26, 2008)

I was wondering what other people do to improve their BLD. Here are some training exercises I go through to work on various stages of BLD. (I use the method described at cubefreak.net for orienting first, then permuting using 3-cycles.) I have trouble memorizing all the stages of a solve, so I often practice just one or two stages rather than all 4 at the same time.

Set up and solve edge cycle (1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11). (The set up involves performing the inverse.)

Set up and solve edge cycles (1 3 5 7 9 11)(2 4 6 8 10 12).

Set up and solve corner cycle (1 2 3 4 5 6 7).

Set up and solve corner cycles (1 3 5 7)(2 4 6 8).

Set up and solve random edge orientations or corner orientations.

Here a strange exercise! Just perform a single U twist as a scramble! Now use only 3OP methods to solve (by swapping 3 edges, swapping 3 corners, then J-perm to fix the parity). Likewise, try a simple R or simple F as your scramble -- and only solve using 3OP methods. Now this time you need to worry about orienting pieces and keeping setup moves to groups <L,R,U,D,F2,B2> and <L2,R2,U,D,F2,B2>. I like these because the set up is just so easy, but the solve can be a little challenge.


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## waffle=ijm (Sep 27, 2008)

sleep delay solves (for me is more like 24 hour delay).

forces you to remember the memo for a long time. even in your sleep. I use 3OP when it comes to sleep delay, but M2 freestyle corners on regular solves.


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## rjohnson_8ball (Sep 27, 2008)

waffle=ijm said:


> sleep delay solves (for me is more like 24 hour delay).
> 
> forces you to remember the memo for a long time. even in your sleep. I use 3OP when it comes to sleep delay, but M2 freestyle corners on regular solves.



Will this strengthen your memory for a standard solve? Or will this drive things into your head so deep that an old memo might haunt you during your solve?  I often document my memo into a blog, several hours after my solve. I guess that is similar. But I am not too good yet at doing more than 1 or 2 BLD solves per day.


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## shelley (Sep 27, 2008)

I don't find delayed memo practice very helpful. In competition my objective is to memorize as quickly and accurately as I can, but I also don't want it too deeply ingrained so that it would interfere with my next solve. When I try to commit something to - not long term, but longer term? - memory, I tend to take longer, and then that messes up my pacing for normal BLD solves.


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## cmhardw (Sep 27, 2008)

Hi Robert,

I recommend a couple things. I try to take blindfoldsolving semi-seriously and I have a training program of sorts that I use.

I always focus on my solving in the morning hours, and my methods in the evening hours. The reason for this is because in competition you usually do BLD events either in the early morning or around lunch time. This gets my body used to thinking really hard shortly after waking up so that I will be used to it the day of the competition.

In the evenings I work on my methods. I sometimes do sighted solves using my method, to see if what I am doing while blindfolded is indeed what I should be doing (you can see more optimal setups/approaches/algs etc. when looking at the cube and compare it to what you would do when blindfolded). I also practice my memory letter pairs. I've made up flashcards with each of my letter pairs and I go through practicing a portion of that stack focusing on either my visual image letter pairs or my single syllable words.

I often just practice algs, especially hard cases for my method. I will practice parity with setups while blindfolded, performing double swaps with setups when needed, difficult cycles needing a "viewpoint shift" in order to see the optimal alg, etc.

I think your training program is very good. The only thing that I would add to it, is to fight through solves where you forget the memorization, or parts of it. When I forget part of my memo on a practice solve, I will literally sit there with the blindfold on for an extra minute, two minutes, even 20 minutes if necessary to try anything I can to either recall the forgotten cycle or deduce it from my knowledge of the rest of the memorization. I think this "fighting through it" is just like training a muscle to failure. If you train your brain to failure enough times, it gets stronger or I guess more capable and your "failure point" improves to be just a little bit faster than what you were doing before.

Those are some ideas that help me. I got a lot of my ideas from Daniel Beyer, and also from a girl I used to date who was really into sports and training for triathlons. She told me how she broke up her training routine into every conceivable important part of the entire race, and how I could use the same idea for cubing. So far I like training this way a lot better than just doing solve after solve after solve ad nauseum until I get faster.

Chris


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## rjohnson_8ball (Sep 27, 2008)

cmhardw said:


> I always focus on my solving in the morning hours, and my methods in the evening hours...
> 
> ...I often just practice algs, especially hard cases for my method. I will practice parity with setups while blindfolded, performing double swaps with setups when needed, difficult cycles needing a "viewpoint shift" in order to see the optimal alg, etc.
> 
> ... fight through solves where you forget the memorization, or parts of it. When I forget part of my memo on a practice solve, I will literally sit there with the blindfold on for an extra minute, two minutes, even 20 minutes if necessary to try anything I can to either recall the forgotten cycle or deduce it from my knowledge of the rest of the memorization. I think this "fighting through it" is just like training a muscle to failure. If you train your brain to failure enough times, it gets stronger or I guess more capable and your "failure point" improves to be just a little bit faster than what you were doing before.



Thanks Chris,

I've done all my BLD's in the morning because my mind is freshest after sleep. But I need to challenge myself to do it other times of the day, eventually with distractions. Ultimately, I want to be able to BLD after a couple beers at a bar where I play pool.

Yes, I practice the tougher things, such as adding a 3-cycle in order to allow an easier setup for a T-perm parity fix.

Yes, I often sit motionless fighting to recall something. Was it (1 .. 7 6)? Or (1 .. 6 7)? I try to remember any tip I can about it, like the path my eyes had moved from one piece to the next. Currently my memo is 10 or 15 min, and execution is about 15 minutes, so I must have a lot of fight in me for that much time and agony. But that adds to the reward when I succeed. I hope you are right about the "no pain, no gain" concept of improving.

The 4x4 BLD seems beyond my limits right now. But I used to think that about 3x3 BLD too.

Thanks,
-- Bob


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## cmhardw (Sep 27, 2008)

rjohnson_8ball said:


> Thanks Chris,
> 
> I've done all my BLD's in the morning because my mind is freshest after sleep. But I need to challenge myself to do it other times of the day, eventually with distractions. Ultimately, I want to be able to BLD after a couple beers at a bar where I play pool.



If you really want distraction, something Daniel and I do is to set an alarm clock for about 1-2 minutes after the time you plan to start memorizing, then try to concentrate after it starts going off. For extra practice set 2 alarm clocks (and for even extra fun set them for different times) ;-)

I do sometimes have 1 or 2 beers in the evening, and occasionally 3 or more at the end of my work week. I have found that BLD solving after 1 beer makes you looser so to speak and I can often still get fast times. After 2 beers or more your solving ability goes to hell, and everything about BLD solving gets harder. So if you do plan to pull a successful attempt after potentially 1-2 beers, make sure you are very comfortable/accurate at home without beer first. That's just my recommendation. The hardest part about solving in public, in my opinion, is realizing that the spectators couldn't possibly care less about how long you take to solve it, only whether or not you do it successfully. I've done demo sub-2 minute 3x3 BLD solves and had the audience no more impressed than when I do a 5 minute solve with multiple recall delays. Don't care at all about the time when performing, simply getting the solve is all the audience cares about. Period.



> Yes, I practice the tougher things, such as adding a 3-cycle in order to allow an easier setup for a T-perm parity fix.
> 
> Yes, I often sit motionless fighting to recall something. Was it (1 .. 7 6)? Or (1 .. 6 7)? I try to remember any tip I can about it, like the path my eyes had moved from one piece to the next. Currently my memo is 10 or 15 min, and execution is about 15 minutes, so I must have a lot of fight in me for that much time and agony. But that adds to the reward when I succeed. I hope you are right about the "no pain, no gain" concept of improving.



If it makes you feel any better, my first ever 3x3 BLD solve was over an hour and a half. It took me about 5 solves to finally get sub-1 hour. After that it took me a while to finally get sub-30 minutes. To be solving in 30 minutes including memo is not a bad thing at all. And I really do believe that the more you fight through those memory "failure" moments, the more capable you become at memorizing quickly and efficiently without those recall errors/delays. Nobody has a bad memory, that's a myth. Some people have just trained their memory more than others.



> The 4x4 BLD seems beyond my limits right now. But I used to think that about 3x3 BLD too.



All I want to say in response to that is think about how amazing it feels to get a 3x3x3 successfully. Then imagine getting a 4x4x4 successfully  The sheer elation and addiction factor of getting the solve is enough to keep you practicing it once you try it for the first couple times. Also, exactly like you said, at first it seems too much but the more you try it the more you get used to it, until eventually you're a regular addict ;-)

Good luck BLD cubing, and happy cubing!
Chris


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## rjohnson_8ball (Sep 27, 2008)

cmhardw said:


> ...spectators couldn't possibly care less about how long you take to solve it, only whether or not you do it successfully...


I've noticed. I'll feel like I have 10 thumbs after a few beers, and even if I goof up and go over a minute, the typical spectator is nearly as impressed as if I was sober and did it in half the time.



> ...Nobody has a bad memory, that's a myth. Some people have just trained their memory more than others...


Even a person with a 53 year old brain?



> ...imagine getting a 4x4x4 successfully


One reason I wanted to do 3x3 BLD was to impress people. I am not sure 4x4 BLD would be so much more impressive to typical spectators. Some spectators don't even notice when I have a 4x4 or 5x5, or they think I should be able to solve those almost as fast as 3x3. Yes, I could impress myself and cubers and be visible in the WCA database -- that would have to be my motivation. I think I have a few other things to do first before considering 4x4 BLD... like working on regular solving: F2L lookahead, finger tricks, finishing OLLs, 2x2 speed, and big cube speed. My 3x3 speed is about 44 seconds. I want it down to 30 at least.


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## Mike Hughey (Sep 27, 2008)

rjohnson_8ball said:


> > ...Nobody has a bad memory, that's a myth. Some people have just trained their memory more than others...
> 
> 
> Even a person with a 53 year old brain?


Hey, my brain is 46 years old, and I can handle a 7x7x7. How much can an extra 7 years really hurt?  Seriously, I hope to still be doing this (occasionally, at least) when I'm 90 (or maybe 100, if I make it that far).

And while I was not quite as slow as Chris when I first started, I was also quite slow. My first solve was around 45 minutes. And my first attempt at a 4x4x4 BLD was around an hour and a half. Oh, and when I did my first 4x4x4, I was probably averaging just a little under 40 seconds on 3x3x3, so not far off your ability. Still, it might be wise to do as you suggest; I think I made it harder for myself by jumping in so quickly. (But it was fun, so I don't regret it!)


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## McWizzle94 (Sep 27, 2008)

This is how I've been training for BLD in the past week or so:

BLD solve
Speedsolve

Repeat about 5 times until I have to go do something else.


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## shelley (Sep 27, 2008)

For a while when I was training (between Worlds '07 and Caltech Fall, when I finally got my in competition sub-2) I would do hour-long BLD "marathons" where I just do one BLD attempt after another, pausing only long enough to scramble between solves. My brain would start getting fried about 35 minutes in, but it was good practice.


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## blah (Sep 27, 2008)

I wanna suggest something that has worked really well for me: Instant recognition. It's helped _tremendously_ for my memorization (for permutation, that is; for orientation I just use visual).

Just by improving your recognition + memorization, you can cut a whole minute off your time, at least that's how it was for me. I went from 3:30 to 2:30 in about a week just by working on my memo, and I hope you realize this is a very large jump in a very short period of time by "not doing anything"  So it's gotta be effective, somehow.

The way I see it, there are 3 things you must know by heart for very fast recognition + memorization. Color, number (or letter?) and position of every cubie. Just drill yourself, intensively. I'll be talking about corners in the following steps, just do the same for edges.

1. Be able to look at any cubie and instantly know its assigned number or letter (I think I read somewhere that you don't use visual?). E.g. I know without consciously thinking, that yellow-red-green corresponds to 5. Take your cube apart and place the corners in a row in random order, and recite the numbers out loud, do it slowly at first, make sure you can do it at a constant pace, this aids the memorization. When you can recite any string of 8 random digits as fast as you recite your phone number, you're done with corners. (That's a little exaggeration  but twice as slow is a bit too slow, ~1.5 times slower should be just right.) Do the same thing for edges. This really shouldn't take more than a day or 2 (for each type of cubie) if you're doing it right.

2. Now work on position. Pop (is this a bad verb to use? ) the cubies back into your cube, now that you know your number/letter scheme for every cubie, you need to know to which position they correspond. E.g. for me I instantly know that blue-orange-yellow is 7 and it's at DRB. This should take even less time to master than the previous step.

3. Now you should be able to translate any cubie color to its number to its position on the cube without thinking. E.g. for me, white-red-blue = 2 = URF, I just know this, like I know D is the fourth letter of the alphabet without consciously counting. That's how fast your brain should work.

4. This is probably the hardest step - memorizing a string of numbers in just one recital. Say someone tells you their phone number, 87234516, can you reproduce that number in your head without hearing it for a second time? I know people who can, if you're one of those people, that's good. I'm not, but for some strange reason, I can reproduce it in my ear and with my mouth. I call it aural memory. And I'm very sure everyone can do this with a little practice. This is how it is for me: I hear the numbers, I can repeat them with certainty and without hesitation, but I have to _think_ to write them down, so what I'm effectively doing is memorizing the _sound_ of the numbers, not the numbers themselves, my brain doesn't have time to translate the sounds of the numbers to the numbers themselves, but it does have space to store the sounds of the numbers temporarily for about 10 seconds or so. That's how I memorize and forget instantly. Do the translation of sounds to numbers to positions during the execution, not during the memorization phase. The moment you translate the sounds to numbers during memorization, it's gonna stay in your long term memory and that's gonna affect your next solve, or even the edges.

5. I don't know if age/edge (silly pun ) is an issue, but it should at least work for corners. I'm not even 20 yet but I need 2 recitals to memorize the edges with certainty  I can memo corners in 5 seconds on average though, 3 seconds if I'm rushing. Assuming you take 2 seconds to memorize every corner, you should take at most 15 seconds to memorize that 8-digit string for corner permutation.

6. If you break into a new cycle, just say zero (or 'oh'), and add that to your string of numbers, shouldn't be a problem.

Once you can memorize your permutations with speed and certainty, you've already got a huge psychological boost. And that helps a lot in BLD, most of the time you forget your stuff because you're nervous, if you can confidently tell yourself memorization is never a problem in BLD for you, you're gonna have much fewer DNFs.

Tell me if there's anything unclear about whatever I just said up there.


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## rjohnson_8ball (Sep 27, 2008)

@shelly, thanks! Good idea, I will push my brain by doing more BLDs.

@blah, I like the idea of laying the cubies out.

I have lots of trouble remembering by sounds, but maybe I can improve. Right now, I think of the number and make story-like connections. Like 1 8 6 2 is a date in the American Civil War, or 5 10 6 7 is nickel, dime, then sequential numbers 6,7 would follow the 5 if the 10 was not there. I also tap pieces and try to pay attention to the path of the cycles. Still, I can mess up, even if I spend extra time triple checking my memory.

During memo, do you take time for sanity checks? Like whether # edges flipped is even, corner twists cancel out when you add them, cycles involve double pair swaps, and potential parity fix? Do you keep track of how many numbers you have memo'd during cycles, so you know what is remaining? It would be bad to memo a 10-cycle and not notice a 2-cycle.


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## blah (Sep 28, 2008)

As of now? No, I don't do sanity checks (is there a better name for it? ). It's all about speed for me now.

But when I started out, yes, I went from triple checking to double checking to where I am now. It's like a speed-accuracy production possibility curve (Economics, anyone? )

I'll answer each step separately, most of the stuff is _not_ what I do now, but what I did back then when the emphasis was on accuracy rather than speed:

Number of flipped edges: I plan how I'm gonna solve them during the memo phase, i.e. setup moves + algorithm. So I can't possibly mess up on this, I'd know if I had an odd number of edges during memo and I'd re-check them. It's easy to miss a bad edge, but quite impossible to miss 2. I would suggest you do the same thing with memorization too, here's why: Say you have edges (24579A) flipped, why memorize that, convert it to a hexadecimal number, and reconvert it back during execution? You can plan your solve during the memorization, something like: (R'F)(4-flipper)(F'R), (L)(2-flipper)(L'). (Note: it's just an example, I don't know your numbering scheme, so I came up with a random solve.) In fact, I used to memorize it as (R'F4), (L2), because the setdown moves (as I like to call them ) are just simply the inverse of the setup moves. Notice the drastic reduction in amount of information you have to store? And there's a plus, you already _know_ what you're gonna do, so (a)you save the thinking time during the execution, and (b)you plan while you're still sighted, which has very obvious advantages - the probability of messing up is, well, zero. By the way, I use M2 now so I don't have EO issues.

Corner twists: I plan this during memorization too. Until now, I can't tell if a corner is twisted CW or CCW, really. What I _can_ tell is where the white/yellow (my U/D) stickers are. So, visual. I highly highly highly recommend reading Lucas' (very old) page: http://cube.garron.us/BLD/CO.htm for memorizing corner orientation. It's an extremely efficient memorization method that takes about 2~3 seconds for me, and definitely less than 10 seconds for anyone with a little practice, and I mean just a little. And, there are no new algorithms to learn, you can always use more than one algorithm to solve cases whose "direct algorithm" you don't know. This, too, can't possibly go wrong unless you mess up during your execution. The memo system is just perfect for beginners, I wonder why not many know about it.

For parity, I guess it's harder for you to do what I do, because you mentioned that you've got trouble with sounds, but I'll mention it anyway: I don't have a fixed buffer, so I can't have more than 8 digits to memorize for corners (discounting zeros). Where I live telephone numbers have 8 digits, so I get a "feel" of how long a telephone number is, and when the string of digits I recite "feels" short (7 digits), I have parity, and I do double check its consistency with edge permutation, even until now, because I hate DNFs when you're forced to DNF because you mis-memorized. For anything less than 7, it's pretty obvious whether it's odd or even. Also, some things just become obvious after a while: If you have 6 digits and you see a permuted corner, the last one has to be permuted as well, so don't waste time double checking; If you have 5 digits or less, your gut would probably tell you to check the remaining corners. I mean, 8 is such a small number that it's nearly impossible to miss out on anything.

And finally, edge permutation. Everyone has bad solves when they just don't notice 2-cycles or 3-cycles somewhere, then they curse and they get back to work  It happens. So here's what I recommend: focus on accuracy first, once you've been doing BLD long enough with consistent successes, you get a "feel" of how many edges are left (yeah it's that "feel" thingy again), then only you move on to focus on speed. Another thing that's helped me with this problem (of not noticing remaining edge cycles) is 4x4x4 and 5x5x5 BLD. With 24 wings, the probability of missing 2 or 3 edges becomes very high, and once I got my "feel" for 24 edges, 12 edges became relatively much easier for me. Is this a lame excuse to motivate you to do big cubes BLD anytime soon? 

Final note, this is just what I do, I haven't read about it anywhere or seen/heard of anyone else do it: Compartmentalize your memorized data. And come up with "missing links". How do I know that I memorize 10 instead of 11 edges? I don't count. My memory system does the counting for me. I memorize in 2 groups of 6 edges. And I think Derrick Eide does 3 groups of 4 edges (did I mention I haven't heard of anyone else doing it? ). This is what I call compartmentalization. Once I know the first number in a group of 6, I know the remaining 5. Because I chop the data up into small bite-sized chunks. If you think your memory isn't that powerful, you can do 3 groups of 4 like Derrick, i.e. see the first digit, know the next 3, which is imo manageable by anyone with a little practice.

Next you need to link the separate compartments up. One major problem I faced when I started out was that I could execute every step very fast because I pre-planned both orientation steps, and compartmentalize the permutation steps. But I always had very long delays between each step trying to recall the data in the next step, so I came up with the "missing link" concept to reduce (actually, kill) this delay. For instance, invent something to link the last digit of EO to the first digit of CO, and another image to link the last digit of CO to the first of EP, just do it in the order you solve. So not only do you link every bit of data in a compartment, you also link every compartment with something, so you'd pretty much have zero lag time during execution. I believe this "hierarchical" system of linking data is much more effective than a "linear" system, if you get what I mean (you probably don't, but never mind, I find it hard to put it in words anyway).

Whew, that's a lot said


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## McWizzle94 (Sep 28, 2008)

Hey blah, I heard before that you don't double check anymore. Can you please explain to me how you switched from double checking to single checking? I'm trying to learn but its kinda difficult.

Thanks.


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## tim (Sep 28, 2008)

McWizzle94 said:


> Hey blah, I heard before that you don't double check anymore. Can you please explain to me how you switched from double checking to single checking? I'm trying to learn but its kinda difficult.
> 
> Thanks.



I don't think there's anything to learn. Just don't check? (And practice of course)


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## blah (Sep 28, 2008)

At first I thought McWizzle's post was sarcastic or something


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## fanwuq (Sep 28, 2008)

Right now, I'm still trying to find a memo method that I really like for M2 edges. Then, I'd just memo the cube without solving. When the memo gets fast enough, I'd go for 20 solves in a row.


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## McWizzle94 (Sep 28, 2008)

Sorry if I sounded like I was sarcastic.

Anyway, I meant are there any ways to practice single-checking besides doing normal solves like Tim suggested?


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## blah (Sep 28, 2008)

Uh, I take two extremes: for corners I go as fast as possible, about 4~5 seconds, so I memorize fast and ditch fast. For edges I go slow so I know the stuff stays there before I move on to my next piece. This is because I memo edges first and solve them last; the entire corners memo + solving takes about 30 seconds, fast input fast output, forget.


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## McWizzle94 (Sep 28, 2008)

blah said:


> Uh, I take two extremes: for corners I go as fast as possible, about 4~5 seconds, so I memorize fast and ditch fast. For edges I go slow so I know the stuff stays there before I move on to my next piece. This is because I memo edges first and solve them last; the entire corners memo + solving takes about 30 seconds, fast input fast output, forget.



OK that makes sense. I'm gonna try that now. Thanks for your help blah!


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## rjohnson_8ball (Sep 28, 2008)

Thanks blah for all your help! Regarding edge orientations, I don't have much trouble remembering something like "A7B" hex (expands to 1010 0111 1011 in binary for the 12 edges). It's only 3 digits. I will consider your recommendation of memorizing the solve, especially if it is just as simple. Currently I perform *corner* orientations strictly using "monoflips" as described by cubefreak.net. I either do 3 cw or 3 ccw or a cw/ccw pair at a time. But I bookmarked Lucas' CO page to look at later.

I just did a successful 3x3 BLD this morning; about 14 min memo, 12 min execution.


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## cmhardw (Sep 29, 2008)

rjohnson_8ball said:


> Currently I perform edge orientations strictly using "monoflips" as described by cubefreak.net. I either do 3 cw or 3 ccw or a cw/ccw pair at a time. But I bookmarked Lucas' CO page to look at later.



Hey Robert,

I think you mean that you do corner flips as mono-flips here? I do the same actually, but only when 3 corners twist the same way. If you're wondering why I use orientation algs, it's how I have to handle pieces that are permuted but with a twist at the beginning of the scramble.

Also, if you have not seen these algs before for twisting pairs of corners, they are super fast.

R' U2 R U R' U R L U2 L' U' L U' L'
or the other direction

L' U' L U' L' U2 L R U R' U R U2 R'

I really like Macky's mono-flip method for 3 corners though (flipping L face corners on the R face). He showed me this at the 2004 US nationals, and I have used it ever since. For pairs of corners though, his method cannot compete with 2 sunes in terms of speed, IMO of course ;-)



rjohnson_8ball said:


> I just did a successful 3x3 BLD this morning; about 14 min memo, 12 min execution.



Congrats on the success! Nice time too, sub-30 

Chris


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## blah (Sep 29, 2008)

cmhardw said:


> For pairs of corners though, his method cannot compete with 2 sunes in terms of speed, IMO of course ;-)



That's new. Which 2 Sunes?

Edit: Oh, duh, I'm like, deliberately being dumb or something, forget I ever asked that.

Edit 2: I hate being non-ambidextrous. Think I'll just have to stick to my old one which I "discovered" myself  LU'-A-L'U'-B and LU'-B-L'U'-A, where A and B are (RUR'U')*1.5 and (R'URU')*1.5 respectively.

@Chris, for 3 corners isn't Sune + U perm (Allan?) much faster?


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## cmhardw (Sep 29, 2008)

blah said:


> Edit 2: I hate being non-ambidextrous. Think I'll just have to stick to my old one which I "discovered" myself  LU'-A-L'U'-B and LU'-B-L'U'-A, where A and B are (RUR'U')*1.5 and (R'URU')*1.5 respectively.



I used to not be very good at cubing with my left hand. That 2-sune-corner-flipper alg is actually what convinced me to become cubing ambidextrous back in 2003. Now, even some PLLs are consistently faster for me with my off-hand. I can do the T, the J, and the R perm all faster lefty than I can righty, even though I am right handed.



blah said:


> @Chris, for 3 corners isn't Sune + U perm (Allan?) much faster?



I've never used the Sune + U perm because it is not supercube safe. I am lazy when it comes to 3x3x3. I only use my big cubing techniques on 3x3x3, so as to rehearse for when I solve 5x5x5. U perm is not a safe PLL for centers.

You did convince me to consider switching to Niklas + A perm though. That is very fast, and supercube safe.

I might just have to change my 3 corner flipping strategy lol, the more I try this the more I like it.

Chris


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## blah (Sep 29, 2008)

cmhardw said:


> I've never used the Sune + U perm because it is not supercube safe. I am lazy when it comes to 3x3x3.


Such a puny cube, isn't it?  I did it the other way round; I loved the Sune + U perm so much that I decided to solve centers first for big cubes 



cmhardw said:


> You did convince me to consider switching to Niklas + A perm though. That is very fast, and supercube safe.


Is the _you_ referring to me? I don't even know such an alg!


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