# "Fewest" Moves



## Kit Clement (Aug 10, 2009)

http://www.worldcubeassociation.org/results/c.php?i=DauphineOpen2009&allResults=1#333fm

I lol'd.


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## Kian (Aug 10, 2009)

kippy33 said:


> http://www.worldcubeassociation.org/results/c.php?i=DauphineOpen2009&allResults=1#333fm
> 
> I lol'd.



ugh. If that's not a typo than the guy is pretty inconsiderate of the judges.


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## trying-to-speedcube... (Aug 10, 2009)

Yeah, Kai did something similar a few months ago. He got 376 moves. Someone tried that at Czech Open as well, but DNF'ed, I guess 535 is now the new "world record".


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## waffle=ijm (Aug 10, 2009)

this made my day


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## jcuber (Aug 10, 2009)

At the next comp hosting this event I'm going to use a "secret weapon" and break this big time!


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## dbax0999 (Aug 10, 2009)

This seems like something that would belong in a "How to annoy the WCA" list


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## clement (Aug 10, 2009)

I told him that I wouldn't check his solution, and that he would have to find someone to do it.


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## coolmission (Aug 10, 2009)

clement said:


> I told him that I wouldn't check his solution, and that he would have to find someone to do it.



That was the right thing to do.


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## Kian (Aug 10, 2009)

coolmission said:


> clement said:
> 
> 
> > I told him that I wouldn't check his solution, and that he would have to find someone to do it.
> ...



Absolutely.

I think it would suit other tournaments to have an FMC cutoff just like we cutoff other events.


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## Bryan (Aug 10, 2009)

coolmission said:


> clement said:
> 
> 
> > I told him that I wouldn't check his solution, and that he would have to find someone to do it.
> ...



Actually, first I would've made absolutely sure the solution was written clearly. Anything sloppy and it would've been disqualified immediately. Then I would require him to give a clear explanation of the solution. Again, anything vague, and he's disqualified.


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## DavidWoner (Aug 10, 2009)

jcuber said:


> At the next comp hosting this event I'm going to use a "secret weapon" and break this big time!



Good luck with that, and have fun being automatically DNF'ed. If you have Tyson or Bob as your delegate (which you will) then neither of them will put up with that sort of thing. There's a 50 move cutoff at Nationals for a reason.


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## Kian (Aug 10, 2009)

Vault312 said:


> jcuber said:
> 
> 
> > At the next comp hosting this event I'm going to use a "secret weapon" and break this big time!
> ...



And if they forget to announce a cutoff I will make sure your solution is "lost."


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## Bob (Aug 11, 2009)

I don't typically hold Fewest moves, but rest assured, I will not judge a solution if it is a waste of my time. If it takes more moves than a typical Fridrich solve, it's pointless.


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## Sa967St (Aug 11, 2009)

now I'm curious as to what his solution was...


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## Faz (Aug 11, 2009)

Lol at his WCA profile pic


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## LNZ (Aug 11, 2009)

I am really amazed. For a 3x3x3, that is really bad. Even a cuber like me whos PB (1:20, really, really, lucky) and average (2:00) is not pro standard can do a 3x3x3 in at worst 2:30 and use about 70 turns. 

That amount of turns (535) would be roughly the amount of turns I would use to solve a 7x7.


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## Edmund (Aug 11, 2009)

fazrulz said:


> Lol at his WCA profile pic



ha ha ha. I love you faz. I was waiting til someone said that.


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## Kit Clement (Aug 11, 2009)

Sa967St said:


> now I'm curious as to what his solution was...



R2 * 500 [insert solution here]

=p


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## Zaxef (Aug 11, 2009)

LOL that's hilarious..
Even more hilarious that they actually accepted it and took the time to check his solution
I really do hope it was a joke though 

Maybe this guy really didn't know how to solve a cube and it takes him like an hour to solve it (FMC time limit) and he couldn't compete in the 3x3 competition like that since it's 10min cutoff, so he did FMC and wrote down every move he did ... and it just happened to take him over 500 moves?


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## Sa967St (Aug 11, 2009)

Zaxef said:


> LOL that's hilarious..
> Even more hilarious that they actually accepted it and took the time to check his solution
> I really do hope it was a joke though
> 
> Maybe this guy really didn't know how to solve a cube and it takes him like an hour to solve it (FMC time limit) and he couldn't compete in the 3x3 competition like that since it's 10min cutoff, so he did FMC and wrote down every move he did ... and it just happened to take him over 500 moves?


look at his other times, he has an official sub20 3x3x3 average


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## shelley (Aug 11, 2009)

How inconsiderate. Unless his 500 move solution was something easily verifiable (like R2*500 or whatever) this was nothing more than wasting a judge's time. Pulling crap like this should result in an auto-DNF (as it will be at Nationals).


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## DavidWoner (Aug 11, 2009)

Sa967St said:


> Zaxef said:
> 
> 
> > LOL that's hilarious..
> ...



Or maybe we can just make unreasonable and easily debunked speculations instead of taking 15 seconds to verify anything.


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## clement (Aug 11, 2009)

He solved using only J PLL

Scramble : F2 U2 R2 B F2 L2 U2 F R2 U2 R2 D' F U L' F' U R2 B L F'

Solution :
Cross :
[RU'] J [F] J Jsym [R'] J Jsym [RU'] J [R] Jsym J [F'] J [F' U2] J [R] Jsym [F' U'] J Jsym

F2L :
[R U2] J [R'] J [U'] Jsym [F' U] Jsym [F' U2] J [F' U2] J [R U] J  J [R] J [U'] Jsym [R'] J [R2 F] Jsym [F' U] Jsym

OLL :
[R'] J [R] Jsym [R'] J
[F' U'] J [R' U'] J [F' U'] Jsym [R U] J

PLL :
[F' U2] J Jsym

Alignement :
(J )x6


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## 4Chan (Aug 11, 2009)

clement said:


> He solved using only J PLL
> 
> Scramble : F2 U2 R2 B F2 L2 U2 F R2 U2 R2 D' F U L' F' U R2 B L F'
> 
> ...




Wow, you're up against a master here. 
Thats rather cool actually.

But still, a hassle for the judges.

EDIT: Lol, this guy is pretty cool.


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## Edam (Aug 11, 2009)

Gael is lovely! 

At the lyon open this year I'm pretty sure he came up with a 330+ solution for the 1st fewest moves round. (but either it was wrong or never checked as it's listed as DNF)
The paper was headed 'WR for most fewest moves' if I remember right, Clément probably remembers. 

He can also juggle quite well and play a large variety of musical instruments.

here's a picture of him sitting on some public art:http://asimonch.free.fr/cube/lyon.spring.open.2009/slides/IMG_2221.html


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## tim (Aug 11, 2009)

shelley said:


> How inconsiderate. Unless his 500 move solution was something easily verifiable (like R2*500 or whatever) this was nothing more than wasting a judge's time. Pulling crap like this should result in an auto-DNF (as it will be at Nationals).



I would be careful with dnfing such a solution, since there's no official WCA rule for it.


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## KJiptner (Aug 11, 2009)

High five, Gael!


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## FredM (Aug 12, 2009)

Actually, Gaël is a very cool guy, and he wanted to go for WR for Most Moves in an event. Clément told him he would not check his solutions but another competitor said he would gladly do it. I checked the solution as well and it didn't take that long.

As Clément said, Gaël solved the cube with J-Perm only.

In the end, he had fun and his WR, everybody laughed and had fun. 
Where's the big deal ?


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## Kian (Aug 12, 2009)

FredM said:


> Actually, Gaël is a very cool guy, and he wanted to go for WR for Most Moves in an event. Clément told him he would not check his solutions but another competitor said he would gladly do it. I checked the solution as well and it didn't take that long.
> 
> As Clément said, Gaël solved the cube with J-Perm only.
> 
> ...



The problem we have with it is that it's obviously obnoxious. It's childish and silly to try and get this "record", especially at the expense of time the judges might not have.

To avoid this, I think tournaments with FMC should just announce a limit (as US nationals has at 50) to prevent people from abusing this.

Basically, it's not in the spirit of real competition and I don't see how it has any place at a WCA event.


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## Bryan (Aug 12, 2009)

FredM said:


> As Clément said, Gaël solved the cube with J-Perm only.



If by only, you mean J perm with other turns included, then yes.


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## StachuK1992 (Aug 12, 2009)

Bryan said:


> FredM said:
> 
> 
> > As Clément said, Gaël solved the cube with J-Perm only.
> ...


yeah...'only J perms' would be like
x J y' J z2 J etc.


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## Kit Clement (Aug 12, 2009)

Just curious, which J-perms did Gael use in that solution?


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## jcuber (Aug 12, 2009)

kippy33 said:


> Just curious, which J-perms did Gael use in that solution?



Me too, I tried the cross then realized I don't use the same algs.


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## Tim Reynolds (Aug 12, 2009)

Bryan said:


> FredM said:
> 
> 
> > As Clément said, Gaël solved the cube with J-Perm only.
> ...



Actually, it looks to me like all those other moves are cube rotations (ex. [R] = x)

While I'm tempted to like something such as 50-move limit, I'm always afraid that a slower person who's actually trying to do well will get just over whatever limit we set. Of course, at Nationals, it's completely reasonable, but at smaller competitions, I don't like the idea of setting cutoffs that might actually be too strict for someone trying their best. But then you get people who like to waste your time with stuff like this, or 2 people who got 9:xx.xx and >10:00:00 2x2 solves at Armonk, using up a third of our timers for 10 minutes, when we were already behind schedule. But I'm not going to let people waste time with stuff like that at any future competitions I run.


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## Kit Clement (Aug 12, 2009)

I assume the J he used switches the UF/UR edges and UFR/UBR corners, but what is Jsym? I tried J flipped across the M slice, but that didn't work.


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## FredM (Aug 12, 2009)

Yes, [R] = x , as allowed by the regulations.

J = RUR'F'RUR'U'R'FR2U'R'U'
Jsym = R'U2RUR'U2LU'RUL'


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## mati rubik (Aug 12, 2009)

jajaj, nice WR (worst record )

I'll try something like this


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