# Do commutators use setup moves?



## MCrazy (May 23, 2018)

I know about a few commutators but I need to do setup moves to solve the cube. They make my time go down drastically so my question is: Are there commutators for every 3-cycle or do i have to know all the setup moves from memory.


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## adimare (May 23, 2018)

Some 3-cycles require setup moves and there's no way to avoid them. They shouldn't drastically affect your times tho, if you're using good setups and commutators it should only cost around 2-4 extra moves per comm.

Any particular cycles you're having trouble with?


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## h2f (May 23, 2018)

Sometimes it's better to do setup and make easier case instead of direct 3cycle.


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## MCrazy (May 23, 2018)

Thanks for the answers! I guess i'll just have to do a couple hundred solves and work on my muscle memory.


adimare said:


> Some 3-cycles require setup moves and there's no way to avoid them. They shouldn't drastically affect your times tho, if you're using good setups and commutators it should only cost around 2-4 extra moves per comm.
> 
> Any particular cycles you're having trouble with?


 Not really. My problem is with coming up with setup moves on the spot. Also im a beginer to using comms so are there comms that i should learn firstthat will save some Time?


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## h2f (May 23, 2018)

MCrazy said:


> I guess i'll just have to do a couple hundred solves and work on my muscle memory.



Much, much more. Doing sessions with cycles help a lot: for example you do all comms going through UBR, than UFR etc.


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## abunickabhi (May 29, 2018)

Commutators are a complex concept, for 3BLD we only use 3-cycle commutators, and the simplest ones do not use setup moves. But the complicated ones ,and the fingertricky ones (the ones that use R,U,D) generally always have a setup move.


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