# melting the cube by turning



## BruceCubing28 (Sep 15, 2011)

hello people. if this has already been discussed i apologise. i was wondering if it is possible to melt a cube just by turning. sometimes after doing sexy move alot and other things i take out a piece and smell the inside of the cube. and most of the time i can smell something like burning/melting plastic. im not sure if thats because of the crc silicone or other things. my current best tps is around 30. im curious how fast one must turn to melt the cube? (if it is possible) thanks =).


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## asportking (Sep 15, 2011)

30 tps? Are you sure?


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## BruceCubing28 (Sep 15, 2011)

asportking said:


> 30 tps? Are you sure?


 
hello im luke bruce crazy tps guy =)


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## chrissyD (Sep 15, 2011)

ABS plastic will work up to about 194 F (90 c) the melting point is 221 F (105 c)

I highly doubt you will get to those temperatures just by turning


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## BruceCubing28 (Sep 15, 2011)

chrissyD said:


> ABS plastic will work up to about 194 F (90 c) the melting point is 221 F (105 c)
> 
> I highly doubt you will get to those temperatures just by turning


 
thanks for replying. and yep i know all the numbers. and i also know its highly unlikely. but im curious if its physically possible. and if it is how fast must one turn. i could sit here and figure it out myself. but its much more interesting to discuss it here =)


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## Sillas (Sep 15, 2011)

you are kidding.. If you have 30 tps(?), with CFOP u solve in 2 seconds. If the cube are melting is because any product that you put


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## chrissyD (Sep 15, 2011)

i don't think its possible for any human to do it 

also most cubes are designed to reduce friction making even more unlikely. I think the small amount of heat you do produce could maybe be enough to slightly deform the cube over a long time but I don't think it would ever melt into a pile of plastic goop.


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## BruceCubing28 (Sep 15, 2011)

chrissyD said:


> i don't think its possible for any human to do it
> 
> also most cubes are designed to reduce friction making even more unlikely. I think the small amount of heat you do produce could maybe be enough to slightly deform the cube over a long time but I don't think it would ever melt into a pile of plastic goop.


 
very true =). melting it into a pile of plastic goop is probably impossible. but deformation of the puzzle over a period of time is definitely possible. i not sure what plastic cubes are made from now. but to my knowledge heat makes the plastic expand. im sure many of you have noticed that when you solve your cube on a very hot day (around 35-40 celsius) the cube will feel slightly stiffer than usual. after doing several tps practices like 100 moves 1000 moves and so on the cube starts to feel slightly stiffer. im not sure that could be related to thermal expansion but i cant think of another reason. any ideas?


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## chrissyD (Sep 15, 2011)

BruceCubing28 said:


> very true =). melting it into a pile of plastic goop is probably impossible. but deformation of the puzzle over a period of time is definitely possible. i not sure what plastic cubes are made from now. but to my knowledge heat makes the plastic expand. im sure many of you have noticed that when you solve your cube on a very hot day (around 35-40 celsius) the cube will feel slightly stiffer than usual. after doing several tps practices like 100 moves 1000 moves and so on the cube starts to feel slightly stiffer. im not sure that could be related to thermal expansion but i cant think of another reason. any ideas?


 
well I live in Britain so our very hot is probably freezing to you so I wouldn't know about that. I guess it's plausible though


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## BruceCubing28 (Sep 15, 2011)

chrissyD said:


> well I live in Britain so our very hot is probably freezing to you so I wouldn't know about that. I guess it's plausible though


 
haha yeh. here in aus it was just winter. it was during that season that i noticed the possible affect of heat from turning. hmm any scientists on this forum??


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## ben1996123 (Sep 15, 2011)

Maybe if you can get a storebought to 1tpms


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## 5BLD (Sep 15, 2011)

I doubt it's possible to do more than deform the cube a little. I would calculate the frictio generated to get an accurate result but I can't be bothered.

Also I'd like to see a video of your 30 tps. I don't don't believe you; I'm just curious.


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## BruceCubing28 (Sep 15, 2011)

5BLD said:


> I doubt it's possible to do more than deform the cube a little. I would calculate the frictio generated to get an accurate result but I can't be bothered.
> 
> Also I'd like to see a video of your 30 tps. I don't don't believe you; I'm just curious.


 
yeh im considering doing the calculations to satisfy my need for knowledge. but i dont know if i can bothered either lol. and yes i should make a video showing tps.but im unable to make videos due to a lack of a camera. maybe one day =)


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## 4EverCuber (Sep 15, 2011)

Sounds like a case for "MythBusters" http://dsc.discovery.com/tv/mythbusters/


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## Vinny (Sep 15, 2011)

Even if you DID manage getting the cube to over 100 degrees Celsius, I doubt you would be able to hold it if it is that hot...


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## Bapao (Sep 15, 2011)

BruceCubing28 said:


> hello people. if this has already been discussed i apologise. i was wondering if it is possible to melt a cube just by turning. sometimes after doing sexy move alot and other things i take out a piece and smell the inside of the cube. and most of the time i can smell something like burning/melting plastic. im not sure if thats because of the crc silicone or other things. my current best tps is around 30. im curious how fast one must turn to melt the cube? (if it is possible) thanks =).


 
I melted a stickerless GuHong once when I abused it as a makeshift ashtray.

Your WCA photo makes me want to force-feed you my gear cube btw...


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## Rubiks560 (Sep 15, 2011)

What alg are you doing to get 30 TPS on....? I'm not believing anything till I see a video.


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## aminayuko (Sep 15, 2011)

yeah, and by the way you are going against a guy who can sub 0.7 a Jb perm


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## Ágoston Török (Sep 15, 2011)

30 tps is impossible. Show me a vid.


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## bluecloe45 (Sep 15, 2011)

You don't avg 30 tps.


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## Yuxuibbs (Sep 15, 2011)

i almost melted a cube from trying to break it in with a power drill.... that was way more than 30 tps lol so no pretty unlikely.... and 30 tps???? my tps is 20.... with sexy times 6....


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## Tim Major (Sep 15, 2011)

I've seen him do 24 moves in 1.1~ he says his best is .9, which seems just believable, because his 1.1 was when he wasn't very warmed up.
I plan to get a camera that films at 60FPS soon, so if I have that next comp, I'll film him.

Edit: more reliable, I've seen him do 100 moves in about 5-6, I think his best is 4.9.


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## Jungleterrain (Sep 15, 2011)

BruceCubing28 said:


> wow more nubs around than usual lol





BruceCubing28 said:


> my current best tps is around 30



Makes *you* sound like a newb since you have no proof (not that it matters).

I also think it's not humanly possible to melt the cube with fast tps making any noticeable deformations to the plastic.


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## qqwref (Sep 15, 2011)

BruceCubing28 said:


> hmm any scientists on this forum??


loooooooool

I've heard that the "spin one side of a cube really fast with a drill" method of wearing in a cube can actually cause parts of the pieces to melt and stick together if you do it for too long at once. I'm not sure if human-generated TPS can do it, but I have a feeling that actual melting is only going to happen if you keep turning quickly for a while - a short burst isn't going to do it.


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## izovire (Sep 15, 2011)

Even if you could do 100 tps it won't burn or deform your cube. But you will lose plastic from normal use. Having high TPS you will need less friction (lube absorbs the friction) to make it possible anyway.

Test it... that way we can all stop being nubs.


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## Yuxuibbs (Sep 16, 2011)

qqwref said:


> loooooooool
> 
> I've heard that the "spin one side of a cube really fast with a drill" method of wearing in a cube can actually cause parts of the pieces to melt and stick together if you do it for too long at once. I'm not sure if human-generated TPS can do it, but I have a feeling that actual melting is only going to happen if you keep turning quickly for a while - a short burst isn't going to do it.


 
which is why when u do use a drill u turn it for 2 to 4 seconds then wait a couple seconds then repeat


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## SoulSeeker (Sep 16, 2011)

leave out the lube, tension it to the max and try to get your 30 tps. if you will.. well maybe than theres a slight chance of melting it


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## rowehessler (Sep 16, 2011)

who the f*ck cares? Even if your 30 tps is legit (which i doubt it is), it doesn't mean sh*t. Solving the cube faster with a lower tps is far more important than doing stupid tps **** and accomplishing nothing. just saying. and about the melting, who cares. put it in a microwave if you want it to melt so bad.


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## MovingOnUp (Sep 16, 2011)

rowehessler said:


> who the f*ck cares? Even if your 30 tps is legit (which i doubt it is), it doesn't mean sh*t. Solving the cube faster with a lower tps is far more important than doing stupid tps **** and accomplishing nothing. just saying. and about the melting, who cares. put it in a microwave if you want it to melt so bad.


 
this made me lol very hard. sharing time is over


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## Sillas (Sep 16, 2011)

HSUAshaushauhua Hessler said all. This guy is just trying to show up. I doubt that in a normal resolution he does more than the average 7 tps. Gabriel dechichi I know that makes a sub 0.5 easily in case U of PLL, that I doubt that this guy does.


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## uberCuber (Sep 16, 2011)

Sillas said:


> I doubt that in a normal resolution he does more than the average 7 tps. Gabriel dechichi I know that makes a sub 0.5 easily in case U of PLL, that I doubt that this guy does.


 
I hope you realize he never said anything about averaging 30 TPS. Also, nobody ever said anything about U perms.

Reading this thread made me laugh.


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## BruceCubing28 (Sep 16, 2011)

ok look people. most of you font seem to understand the point of this. on sexy x6 and other algorithms i have had 30 tps and more. as for single plls yes i can get .5 uperm and all the other stupid stuff. also i never said that having faster tps makes you solve the cube faster. my avg tps for a solve is around 5-7. i was just wondering if one could generate enough heat in one part of the cube just by turning to melt it. and as we discussed earlier i dont mean a pile of plastic goop. more noticeable deformation of the plastic. anyway thanks to everyone who read and replied to the thread. =)


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## The Bloody Talon (Sep 16, 2011)

you can generate heat by turning but I don't think you can melt it..
maybe you should experiment it on a new cube and focus on turning and see if you could melt it.


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## Cheese11 (Sep 18, 2011)

Glue the centre cap to a cube to a drill press, and then turn it on. Going that speed will probably melt the plastic.


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## xabu1 (Sep 19, 2011)

uberCuber said:


> I hope you realize he never said anything about averaging 30 TPS. Also, nobody ever said anything about U perms.
> 
> Reading this thread made me laugh.


not averaging, but he said he could make it



BruceCubing28 said:


> hello people. if this has already been discussed i apologise. i was wondering if it is possible to melt a cube just by turning. sometimes after doing sexy move alot and other things i take out a piece and smell the inside of the cube. and most of the time i can smell something like burning/melting plastic. im not sure if thats because of the crc silicone or other things. *my current best tps is around 30.* im curious how fast one must turn to melt the cube? (if it is possible) thanks =).


on the first post


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## uberCuber (Sep 19, 2011)

xabu1 said:


> not averaging, but he said he could make it
> 
> 
> on the first post


 
I know that; I never said otherwise. I was just pointing out that "I doubt that in a normal resolution he does more than the average 7 tps" really doesn't have much of anything to do with Luke's claims, since he never made any claims regarding average TPS.


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## mdolszak (Sep 19, 2011)

Cheese11 said:


> Glue the centre cap to a cube to a drill press, and then turn it on. Going that speed will probably melt the plastic.



This:


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## kirtpro (Sep 19, 2011)

luke, play nice lol

ok.
guys trust me he has insane tps, ive been to comps with him

as for the plastic thing, my guess is that since you put crc in your cubes, that would decrease friction and it'd not be able burn
if you left it without lube and went insane tps then.... maybe it might melt slightly lol


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## AnsonL (Sep 19, 2011)

30 tps is like ruru x6 in .8 :O


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## Tim Major (Sep 19, 2011)

AnsonL said:


> 30 tps is like ruru x6 in .8 :O


 
Got a problem with that? 
But I think he can only just sub 1 that, he's better in long things like x100 where timing is also more accurate, less time is wasted on starting. 30 TPS is probably the absolute max, I'm completely sure he can at least get over 25 TPS.


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## Cubenovice (Sep 19, 2011)

OK
Here’s a polymer chemist’s point of view on the melting of ABS by turning:

*-1-*
It is perfectly possible to melt ABS plastic by spinning pieces by hand. I have personally done this up to the point where pieces were actually welded together.
This does not even require 30 TPS. See attached image where I melted the contact surface inside the cover of the product. This was not done for the purpose of this thread, the (original) image is a few years old.



*-2-*
On a *speed*cube I just cannot see this happen.

*-3-* 
Key difference between the product in -1- and a *speed*cube: tightness of assembly and type of rotation.
In -1- the melting would occur when the assembly was tight (a hand crank into the cover of the product) and you would turn the handle very fast.
During the whole operation you have the same surfaces in contact with each other.

In a *speed*cube you rotate fast too but the cubies are not pressed tightly against each other and you will typically not have the same surfaces in constant contact.
Perhaps in a *very tight* cube you could generate enough heat but how’d you get up to 30 TPS on a super tight cube? And keep it up for more than a short burst?
Regarding the pieces not being in constant contact: compare R U R’ U’ at 30 TPS (cuber) vs U U U U at 30 TPS (breaking in by some sort of drill).

*-4-*
Regarding the smell you noticed: 
I can imagine some friction heat being generated by spamming a specific alg for a long time. 
Perhaps some cube dust may just get warm enough to give some smell. But I really don’t see whole cubie-surfaces getting hot enough.


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## JLarsen (Sep 25, 2011)

I look past the title of the thread to see the true purpose;

GUISE LOOK I'M SO FAST!


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## Thompson (Sep 25, 2011)

Sillas said:


> you are kidding.. If you have 30 tps(?), with CFOP u solve in 2 seconds. If the cube are melting is because any product that you put


 
WRONG. He probably can turn that fast, but it wouldnt be possible to look ahead 60 moves in 2 seconds.


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## The Bloody Talon (Sep 26, 2011)

Thompson said:


> WRONG. He probably can turn that fast, but it wouldnt be possible to look ahead 60 moves in 2 seconds.


 
WRONG. So in 30TPS, he can't solve the cube in approximately 2seconds?
In your post, you are saying that he can't solve the cube in 30TPS. in which, i agree. 

but you can't say he is wrong if you will change the condition. 
he is saying 30tps, you are saying not 30tps.

anyway, I know it is clear that the "luke bruce crazy tps guy" said that he can't solve in 30TPS. 
although he can achieve 30 TPS
Just saying.


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## Pandadudex96 (Sep 26, 2011)

how is this thread still running?!?!? jks


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## The Bloody Talon (Sep 26, 2011)

Pandadudex96 said:


> how is this thread still running?!?!? jks


 
my bad.
ooppss. I posted again. sorry.


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## Pandadudex96 (Sep 26, 2011)

The Bloody Talon said:


> my bad.
> ooppss. I posted again. sorry.


 
lmao I love when this happens!!!!

k nobody post!!! lmao


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## Vinny (Sep 26, 2011)

The Bloody Talon said:


> WRONG. So in 30TPS, he can't solve the cube in approximately 2seconds?
> In your post, you are saying that he can't solve the cube in 30TPS. in which, i agree.
> 
> but you can't say he is wrong if you will change the condition.
> ...


 
He's trolling. In fact, he does it quite a bit.


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## gundamslicer (Sep 26, 2011)




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## Yuxuibbs (Sep 26, 2011)

^ 
THAT might melt the cube if u aren't careful. thats more than 30 tps and seriously it really doesn't matter.... almost everyone's tps is around 8 during regular solves anyway.....


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## uberCuber (Sep 26, 2011)

Yuxuibbs said:


> almost everyone's tps is around 8 during regular solves anyway.....


 
lolwat
I'm pretty sure that the majority of cubers cannot do anywhere near 8 TPS over a whole solve.


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## RaresB (Sep 26, 2011)

uberCuber said:


> lolwat
> I'm pretty sure that the majority of cubers cannot do anywhere near 8 TPS over a whole solve.


 
Pshhh yea right majority of cubers avg 6 secs and they have 15 tps get ur facts straight


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## Yuxuibbs (Sep 26, 2011)

ugh hate my keyboard i meant 6....


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## Kirjava (Oct 7, 2011)

*and here come the lols*






here we go! bruce posted a video of his mad tps skillz!

100 moves in 5.22 seconds is 19 tps - nowhere near 30

I think this shows that he's wildly exaggerating his times

I'm only posting this because in the video description it says - "have fun complaining kirjava =)"

I'm not complaining. I'm very happy because you basically showed that I was right.


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## TimMc (Oct 7, 2011)

Off-topic: How many people just read half the title of the thread and just went on a rant about TPS and how much they cube-rage at stuff?!??

On-topic: Is turning the face of a cube that's made up of questionable plastic to a point in which it might melt comparable to a bow drill? (kudos on the drill video btw)

Tim.


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## Owen (Oct 7, 2011)

30 TPS would be too fast for anyone to actually see, even with a good camera.


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## Cheese11 (Oct 8, 2011)

Owen said:


> 30 TPS would be too fast for anyone to actually see, even with a good camera.


 
You'd probably be able to see it if you had a good one.


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## ben1996123 (Oct 8, 2011)

Owen said:


> 30 TPS would be too fast for anyone to actually see, even with a good camera.



1 frame per turn.


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## RCTACameron (Oct 8, 2011)

ben1996123 said:


> 1 frame per turn.


 
I think some HD cameras can shoot 60 fps, though not sure if Youtube can play it in 60 fps. Though you could slow it down. Some expensive high-speed camera can shoot up to 256,000 fps, though in pretty bad quality.


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## Zane_C (Oct 8, 2011)

RCTACameron said:


> Some expensive high-speed camera can shoot up to 256,000 fps, though in pretty bad quality.


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## Yuxuibbs (Oct 8, 2011)

Zane_C said:


>


 
To me it looked like a bullet was going through water.... very cool.


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## BruceCubing28 (Oct 8, 2011)

Kirjava said:


> *and here come the lols*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
LOLS!! btw i said 30 tps for sexy x6. not 100 moves. 4.55 is 22 tps. i can do 4.2 without lockups. (btw your wrong) and 948 turns in 1 minute. im sure that anyone with some intelligence will know that its not possible to keep up 30 tps for a minute. a few seconds yes. but after 1 minute my arms hurt so i cant turn that fast. im training a bit and i expect to have around 1200 turns in a minute later this year. but of course when i post a vid everyones going to say ive cheated or something. anyway once again have fun complaining kirjava. =)


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## Kirjava (Oct 8, 2011)

BruceCubing28 said:


> LOLS!! btw i said 30 tps for sexy x6.


 
Anyone can get 30 tps with bad timing.

"on sexy x6 and other algorithms i have had 30 tps and more"

what other algs are these?

I *want* to see videos of these claims. I *want* to believe you. But you've posted nothing so far that indicates it.

If you provide us with any evidence of this claim of 30TPS we will believe you. 

Why would I be jealous of you? I don't think you realise how awesome I am.


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## Jaycee (Oct 8, 2011)

Kirjava said:


> I don't think you realise how awesome I am.


 
It's funny because it's true.

@Bruce : SHOW US your sexy x 6 with 30 TPS. SHOW US your "other algorithms" with 30 TPS. All we want is proof.

EDIT : I just clicked on your WCA profile. I think I FINALLY know who you are. >__>


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## Ezy Ryder (Oct 8, 2011)

Could You make a video of keeping a 30TPS tempo for one second?


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## somerandomkidmike (Oct 14, 2011)

I don't think you've been around the forums long enough to witness the pure awesomeness of Kirjava. Even if you haven't witnessed it, you should EASILY be able to tell by his profile picture. 

Anyway, I don't think it's possible to turn 30tps. That would be (Sexy) x6 in 0.8 seconds!


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