# When do you consider a cuber a master?



## kdicem (May 10, 2011)

What times would a cuber need to get in order to be considered a master? 

Also, what would you consider proficient? 

What would you call average?

Discuss.


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## Rpotts (May 10, 2011)

thread
My post from that thread-


Spoiler



Beginner - someone who is just beginning speedcubing
Common Traits: Most beginners have very slow recognition/recall and spend up to half of their solve time looking for pieces/recognizing cases. They rarely use inspection time well, maybe just find the first piece or two of cross/2x2x2/1x2x3. They make mistakes almost every solve and sometimes are forced to go back to an earlier step in their solve and start over.

Intermediate - someone who is getting better and faster, but still needs a lot of work and could easily improve in most every facet of their solve
Common Traits: Many intermediate cubers have moved on past their original beginners method to a faster method that often times means more algs. If they are a CFOP user they have probably moved on to basic, intuitive f2l and some variation of 3/4 Look LL. Intermediate cubers are better at using inspection, and can maybe plan out most of their first step, but not always. There is still a lot of time being wasted simply looking for pieces, but not as much as when they were beginners. Mistakes are made, but relatively infrequently.

Advanced - someone who is very good and very fast, and can only shave a second or two (mebe 3) off of any given step in there method
Common Traits: Advanced cubers almost always know a full speedcubing method and can recognize/recall all of their algs quickly. Most of their solves will have no long pauses, few cube rotations and almost no major mistakes. They can use inspection time to completely plan their first step, and sometimes more (track first f2l pair, xcross, 2x2x3). Many advanced cubers know additional sets of algs that can make them even faster when the situation arises (COLL/VHF2L/OLLCP/NEOPLL(lol))

Expert - someone who has nearly pushed their method to it's limits and has almost no where left to go in order to improve.
Common Traits: everything that advanced cubers do but better. Almost no recognition time, near-perfect lookahead. No pauses, almost no rotations, just perfect, fluid solves with very high, consistent TPS. Many algs are known, duplicate algs are known and experts know when to use which alg to get the best next step, i.e. an expert knows when using a certain OLL alg will force a PLL skip, or when to use a certain f2l alg to force OLL skip. There are no cases that slow them down, an expert CFOP user will know tons of advanced f2l tricks such as multislotting, using open slots, wrong slot algs etc.


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## kdicem (May 10, 2011)

Sorry about the thread. I'm not very good at searching.

But thanks for your response.


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## Tall5001 (May 10, 2011)

The only "MASTER" i would consider is felix!


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## uberCuber (May 10, 2011)

Tall5001 said:


> The only "MASTER" i would consider is felix!


 
who?


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## BigGreen (May 10, 2011)

A master is someone who becomes the very best like no one ever was.


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## Jedi5412 (May 10, 2011)

Tall5001 said:


> The only "MASTER" i would consider is felix!


 
Well yes execpt with that part about getting faster


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## Carrot (May 10, 2011)

uberCuber said:


> who?


 
Felix Lee of course... he is a true master of pyraminx in america! =D


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## tx789 (May 10, 2011)

When they have a lot of world records like faz


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## panqueque (May 10, 2011)

BigGreen said:


> A master is someone who becomes the very best like no one ever was.


 
To collect them is my real test, to solve them is my cause!


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## Godmil (May 10, 2011)

I'd widen it out to be anyone with a sub-10 average.... Mmm, actually maybe Sub-9, that puts a good few people in the category but not too many.


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## reyrey (May 10, 2011)

uberCuber said:


> who?


 
Feliks Zemdegs.

From the post of Rpotts I see that I have alot more to learn.
Just finished learning full PLL, and I am working on alot of things at the moment. (Full OLL, Improving lookahead, Practicing Dual Cross, and etc)


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## Forte (May 10, 2011)

Gaetan Guimond


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## Carrot (May 10, 2011)

Forte said:


> Gaetan Guimond


 
*thumbs up*


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## uberCuber (May 11, 2011)

reyrey said:


> Feliks


 
That is not the name he said.


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## Hershey (May 11, 2011)

Tall5001 said:


> The only "MASTER" i would consider is felix!


 
Reasons why I don't like this comment:
1) Name is misspelled
2) Statement makes you sound like a weird fan-boy 
3) Your didn't support your this statement that you posted

Rpotts had a pretty good answer that was actually supported.


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## Bob (May 11, 2011)

Master? Thénardier.


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## waffle=ijm (May 11, 2011)

I can has a master powers?


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## collinbxyz (May 11, 2011)

waffle=ijm said:


> I can has a *super duper waffle master powers?*


 
fixed


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## waffle=ijm (May 11, 2011)

ohthxcollinbxyz


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## Hershey (May 11, 2011)

collinbxyz said:


> waffle=ijm said:
> 
> 
> > I can has a *super duper waffle master powers?*
> ...


 
Fix'd. It should be "I can has a super duper *waffo* master powers?"


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## waffle=ijm (May 11, 2011)

well no. That would imply that I entrust my powers to myself.


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## ianography (May 11, 2011)

Do I get super special powers Waffo?


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## Hershey (May 11, 2011)

waffle=ijm said:


> well no.


 
kk Waffo.


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## souljahsu (May 11, 2011)

You're only a master when you know all LL cases, and can recognize and solve them under 2 seconds average


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## Phlippieskezer (May 11, 2011)

souljahsu said:


> You're only a master when you know all LL cases, and can recognize and solve them under 2 seconds average


 
No! I'm ruined! I'm a Roux solver, and don't solve in layers!


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## DavidWoner (May 11, 2011)

Phlippieskezer said:


> No! I'm ruined! I'm a Roux solver, and don't solve in layers!


 
Uhhh yes you do.


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## DavidWoner (May 11, 2011)

Phlippieskezer said:


> No! I'm ruined! I'm a Roux solver, and don't solve in layers!


 
Uhhh yes you do.


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## Cubenovice (May 11, 2011)

kdicem said:


> What times would a cuber need to get in order to be considered a master?


This is a different question than the one in your thread title...

Lars and Guus are *grand*masters but they are not fast for nowadays standards....


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## jack3256 (May 14, 2011)

I font think speed defines mastery what about FMC or multiple BLD?


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## lorki3 (May 16, 2011)

panqueque said:


> To collect them is my real test, to solve them is my cause!


 
We should write the whole pokemon song in the cube way


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## collinbxyz (May 16, 2011)

Hershey said:


> Fix'd. It should be "I can has a super duper *waffo* master powers?"


 
silly fool.


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## cubeslayer (May 16, 2011)

Dan Brown...jking, 

I would like to consider the people that were speed cubers in the 80s (Jessica Fridrich for one) b/c they were the originals. A classically modern master I would consider would be Dan Knights, b/c he followed in the original cubers " wrist " style with standard CFOP. 

But as for modern day masters, Breandon, Nakajima, Hessler, etc.


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## qqwref (May 16, 2011)

Anyone who truly understands the techniques of at least one part of cubing, to the point where they can apply them in practice, and discover and evaluate new ideas.

I really hate when people think you have to be really good at 3x3 to be a master. Not to brag, but I think I know enough (and have enough skill) in several cubing fields to deserve the title. Hell, I probably have more unofficial records than anyone else. And yet I'm extremely slow at 3x3 (partly due to tps and partly because I don't share the obsession with that event that many others have). Does not having high tps forbid me from being respected? If you say yes, I personally hate you : p


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## JyH (May 16, 2011)

wen dey are soop 10 wid snyfer


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## teller (May 16, 2011)

theanonymouscuber said:


> *Just to be forewarned, I am referring to a master of speed, not theory.*
> 
> Close to (or at) world record times.


By this logic, Dan Knights was a master in 2003, but now he's not, and he's actually IMPROVED!

No...you don't have to be Yoda. Obi Wan was a master too.


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## panqueque (May 17, 2011)

lorki3 said:


> We should write the whole pokemon song in the cube way


 
I wanna be the veery best, like no one ever was! Dun dun danuhhh
To collect them is my real test, to solve them is my cause!
I will travel across the land, competing far and wide! Dun dun danuhh
Each cube to understand, every alg to memorise!
Rubik's cube! It's you and me
I know it's my destiny
Rubik's cube! Oh, you're my best friend
Every competition we must be in!
Lubix lube! A lube so trueee!
Your courage will pull us through
You teach me and i'll teach you!
Rubik's cubeeee

 
/nerd moment


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## kdicem (May 17, 2011)

Haha. Oh I remember the days of Pokemon. Good times.


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## panqueque (May 17, 2011)

Not gonna lie, i'm still an avid pokemon playeer  though, my new love for cubing has taken over haha


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## Ltsurge (May 17, 2011)

i think we should vote on who is a master and grandmaster  every year 1 new one is elected 
One for each puzzle i.e grandmaster of magic grandmaster of 3x3 
sounds good?


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## Ricardo Kim (May 17, 2011)

When they get a WR haha


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## kdicem (May 17, 2011)

ltsurge said:


> i think we should vote on who is a master and grandmaster  every year 1 new one is elected
> One for each puzzle i.e grandmaster of magic grandmaster of 3x3
> sounds good?


 
We could do that. Although we'd need more criteria than just who holds the WR.


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## b4p (May 17, 2011)

"I'm not a master, I'm a student-master, meaning that I have the knowledge of a master and the expertise of a master, but I'm still learning, So I'm a student-master. I don't believe in the word master, I consider the master as such when they close the casket."
- Bruce Lee - Michael Scott


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## Kirjava (May 17, 2011)

'Master' isn't a title given to cubers.

So, never.


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## CubingCockney (May 17, 2011)

It shouldn't be master...it should be cubing superhero!

powers involve shooting 3x3 rubiks cubes out of every oraphis and the ability to turn girls off


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## Cool Frog (May 17, 2011)

qqwref said:


> Anyone who truly understands the techniques of at least one part of cubing, to the point where they can apply them in practice, and discover and evaluate new ideas.
> 
> I really hate when people think you have to be really good at 3x3 to be a master. ...


This


Kirjava said:


> 'Master' isn't a title given to cubers.
> 
> So, never.


 Yet

Lol at 1Look last layer in sub 2=master
M slice permutation (Forced EO earlier)


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## Joël (May 17, 2011)

Anyone who is at least as fast as me, or faster.


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## BC1997 (May 17, 2011)

When he becomes Feliks


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## panqueque (May 17, 2011)

CubingCockney said:


> It shouldn't be master...it should be cubing superhero!
> 
> powers involve shooting 3x3 rubiks cubes out of every oraphis and the ability to turn girls off


 
Quite the contrary! I'm a girl and i love when a guy could solve a cube. And i know plenty of girls who aren't into cubing and aren't turned off by it eitheer  stop cubing around stupid girlsm


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## CubingCockney (May 19, 2011)

panqueque said:


> Quite the contrary! I'm a girl and i love when a guy could solve a cube. And i know plenty of girls who aren't into cubing and aren't turned off by it eitheer  stop cubing around stupid girlsm


 
why do you love it? dont you just think "wow he clearly spends all of his time trying to get quicker and learning more algs" because to be fair. most of us do


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## Bapao (May 19, 2011)

CubingCockney said:


> why do you love it? *dont you just think "wow he clearly spends all of his time trying to get quicker and learning more algs" because to be fair. most of us do *


 
So? I would put the cube down in favor of a decent set of bewbs any day and I'm sure you would too right? Okay, maybe not on comp day, but still. She sees the man behind the curtain of stereotype geeky-ness. The world needs more girls that think that way


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## CubingCockney (May 19, 2011)

b4p4076 said:


> So? I would put the cube down in favor of a decent set of bewbs any day and I'm sure you would too right? Okay, maybe not on comp day, but still. She sees the man behind the curtain of stereotype geeky-ness. The world needs more girls that think that way



I totally agree! the world does need more girls like that but it ain't gonna happen. Saying that however some girls do in fact like a geek


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## panqueque (May 20, 2011)

b4p4076 said:


> So? I would put the cube down in favor of a decent set of bewbs any day and I'm sure you would too right? Okay, maybe not on comp day, but still. She sees the man behind the curtain of stereotype geeky-ness. The world needs more girls that think that way


 
I do infact appreciate a nerd in all their nerdiness! But i don't judge anyone based on stereotypes, so really I just think " oh yay, we have something in common!" and get all excited  there are plenty of girls who think this way, you just need to find them 
You miss out on getting to know some really great people if you judge them off the bat. So if you're trying to impress a girl with your awesome cubing skills and it doesn't work, it's her loss. Clearly, boys who cube are much much better than boys who don't !


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## emolover (May 20, 2011)

panqueque said:


> I do infact appreciate a nerd in all their nerdiness! But i don't judge anyone based on stereotypes, so really I just think " oh yay, we have something in common!" and get all excited  there are plenty of girls who think this way, you just need to find them
> You miss out on getting to know some really great people if you judge them off the bat. *So if you're trying to impress a girl with your awesome cubing skills and it doesn't work, it's her loss.* Clearly, boys who cube are much much better than boys who don't !


 
I really hope you people dont do that. Do all of you really think of yourselves as nerds? I couldn't imagine you all being nerds. If you want to not be a "nerd" then I could tell you how, says the hipster.


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## panqueque (May 20, 2011)

Pfft i'm a total nerd. And i don't impress girls with my cubing skills, i impress my boyfriend haha


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## nerd (May 21, 2011)

Tall5001 said:


> The only "MASTER" i would consider is felix!


 
relate 2 that


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## TimMc (May 21, 2011)

Good question. To follow up: What cubing related metrics would you define to determine who should be considered a master?

For example: Speed (TPS), efficiency (FMC), memorisation (BLD), methods...

And how would you weigh the degree of proficiency in each attribute?

This topic reminded me of how many times I've been referred to as a "whiz", "master", "professional" by "non-cubers".

Is there a point in creating such a title? Some of the faster competitors and contributors are already well known and somewhat distinct in their own right. Can they be easily grouped under one title? Cubers?

Tim.


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## Gaétan Guimond (May 21, 2011)

The youngest world champion was 12 years old it's Macky The youngest world champion chess master is Kasparov 22 years old.

Since the invention of the cube that teenagers are the best speed cuber


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## jakkspeedcuber (May 21, 2011)

Some people said that to master something, you need 10 000 hours of works on it. So somenone that did 10 000 of cubing, is a master, for me.


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## uberCuber (May 22, 2011)

TimMc said:


> Is there a point in creating such a title? Some of the faster competitors and contributors are already well known and somewhat distinct in their own right.


 
Master Zemdegs
sounds professional :3


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