# My PLLs Broken Down w/ Fingertricks explained (WIP) (Video)



## jskyler91 (Jan 7, 2013)

Hey Guys and Gals and everything inbetween,

So as the title says I am finally doing a video tutorial on all of my PLLs and OLLs. This section will be specifically for my PLLs. I have been asked to make this video for over a year now, but I honestly didn't really feel comfortable making it until I had truly settled on my algs, their execution and how many angles I do them from. As many of you know i update my algs as often as possible and alway try to have the most ergonomic and fastest executions I can and so it wasn't really until the last few months that all of my PLLs have really fully settled. Now that they have, at least for the present, I plan on making those videos!!

I will be splitting these into individual videos for each of my perms so that I can take appropriate time to fully explain my fingertricks and how/why I do them as well as give multiple examples. I think this will be far more useful than one long video with sparse explanation and only one execution. Let me know if you agree, but this is likely how they will go. I will be bunching a few algs together if they are just mirrors or very similar, but in general each separate alg will get its own video. Algs are in the description of the videos.

Here are the ones I have so far, more to come (some may still be processing at time of upload):



Spoiler: T-Perm



[youtubehd]h9WCA7LineY[/youtubehd]





Spoiler: Y-Perm



[youtubehd]R52VOcrphwI[/youtubehd]





Spoiler: A-Perms



[youtubehd]EFgVPrVVtRA[/youtubehd]





Spoiler: U-perms






Spoiler: U-Perm A Angle 1



[youtubehd]KKiL8uRI6OE[/youtubehd]





Spoiler: U-Perm A Angle 2



[youtubehd]-Yr-wnmkKNQ[/youtubehd]





Spoiler: U-Perm A Angle 3



[youtubehd]nreglvNeJ9E[/youtubehd]





Spoiler: U-Perm A Angle 4



[youtubehd]Ixdn6QZBiII[/youtubehd]





Spoiler: U-Perm B Angle 1



[youtubehd]9fX3dh6G1zY[/youtubehd]





Spoiler: Part 5: U- Perm B Angle 2













Spoiler: Part 5: U- Perm B Angle 3













Spoiler: Part 5: U-Perm B Angle 4
















Spoiler: N-perm






Spoiler: Part 6: N-perm A













Spoiler: Part 7: N-Perm B
















Spoiler: Part 8: H-Perm













Spoiler: Part 9: Z-Perm













Spoiler: Part 10: E-Perm











I messed up just as I thought I would, but luckily you get multiple examples lol.


----------



## Escher (Jan 7, 2013)

Whoa, read the video posting rules - no more than 3 per page - otherwise people on slow bandwidths can't view it. Just re-edit your OP with links and not embeds


----------



## MarcelP (Jan 7, 2013)

Escher said:


> otherwise people on slow bandwidths can't view it. Just re-edit your OP with links and not embeds



I don't think people with slow internet connections are interested in Youtube video's anyway. I think he should leave it like this.


----------



## Gordon (Jan 7, 2013)

That will be some videos I'll watch. I think this could help me. I'm especially waiting for the G and N perms.

You could put them all in a playlist on youtube, which would make finding them easier.


----------



## Escher (Jan 7, 2013)

MarcelP said:


> I don't think people with slow internet connections are interested in Youtube video's anyway. I think he should leave it like this.



Although I don't think that's necessarily true, regardless, it's part of the forum rules, and when you get posts in between the videos (like these) then it makes it harder to locate each one.


----------



## Stefan (Jan 7, 2013)

Stopped watching after first minute of first video because I'm still not told how fast you are so I can't judge whether I might benefit from this and I don't want to waste my time.


----------



## MarcelP (Jan 7, 2013)

Stefan said:


> I'm still not told how fast you are so I can't judge whether I might benefit from this and I don't want to waste my time.



His signature says 1/5/100 6.53(NL),9.43,11.14 

That is pretty fast


----------



## Kirjava (Jan 7, 2013)

I don't believe his times, never have ^_^

Watching his youtube channel and looking at his WCA times is what made me think this.


----------



## A Leman (Jan 7, 2013)

Stefan said:


> Stopped watching after first minute of first video because I'm still not told how fast you are so I can't judge whether I might benefit from this and I don't want to waste my time.





MarcelP said:


> His signature says 1/5/100 6.53(NL),9.43,11.14
> 
> That is pretty fast



His WCA profile says

Joseph Skyler
--------------- NR CR WR Single Average WR CR NR
Rubik's Cube 149 183 1006 11.41 14.74 1485 260 213

He has been cubing for years as his join date proves, but that last average was from Stanford 2012 less than 2 Months ago. 14.75 is probably too unremarkable to convince someone like Stefan to stop what he is doing and change his style(which is already very good).

I am very impressed by how dedicated Skyler is to basic CFOP though.

http://worldcubeassociation.org/results/p.php?i=2011SKYL01


----------



## mark49152 (Jan 7, 2013)

I for one appreciate all the stuff he posts. Whether you like it or believe you can benefit from it, it's an impressive level of contribution and I enjoy reading and watching it. So far this year, we've had these PLL videos, the 1LLL thread, and (almost!) a video on avoiding cube rotations. That's impressive. Thanks Skyler, and keep it up!


----------



## mostafa (Jan 7, 2013)

you shouldn't judge about someone like this.his style in cubing is special and I like it .


----------



## Stefan (Jan 7, 2013)

Clarification: I don't care about solve times, as this thread is about PLL. I'm sure there are people who solve slower than me but turn PLL way faster than me, in which case I'm interested regardless of their solve times. So I'd find it helpful if Joseph listed his best/usual times for the PLLs. The alg in the Y-Perm video description is wrong, btw. Simply check your algs, especially for tutorials.


----------



## Kirjava (Jan 7, 2013)

Ah, that wasn't clear. My statement now feels out of place.


----------



## jskyler91 (Jan 7, 2013)

A Leman said:


> His WCA profile says
> 
> Joseph Skyler
> --------------- NR CR WR Single Average WR CR NR
> ...



Yup those are my official averages but I am really bad in comps and I also judge/ help organize so I tend to be very stressed and don't perform well.



Stefan said:


> Stopped watching after first minute of first video because I'm still not told how fast you are so I can't judge whether I might benefit from this and I don't want to waste my time.



wow, lol straight to the point, i average around 10 to 11 seconds. But I can sub 1 most of my PLLs so why does my average matter? Also I do say how fast I average on all of them you have to wait more than a minute to hear it though because I spend time introducing each alg lol. O and my alg for the y perm is correct check again.


----------



## Kirjava (Jan 7, 2013)

jskyler91 said:


> i average around 10 to 11 seconds



Can you make a 10.xx avg12 video?


----------



## sneaklyfox (Jan 7, 2013)

T-Perm trick instead of U2 AUF is neat. But I wonder one thing about the T-perm fingertrick.
T-Perm Alg: R U R' U' R' F R2 U' R' U' R U R' F'
There are 3 U' moves which I will refer to as #1, #2, #3. You use left middle finger instead of pulling the index finger back for #2. But isn't it better to pull back and use the left index for #2 and use middle finger for #3? #2 and #3 are only separated by one R' move while #1 and #2 are separated by three moves R' F R2?


----------



## jskyler91 (Jan 7, 2013)

sneaklyfox said:


> T-Perm trick instead of U2 AUF is neat. But I wonder one thing about the T-perm fingertrick.
> T-Perm Alg: R U R' U' R' F R2 U' R' U' R U R' F'
> There are 3 U' moves which I will refer to as #1, #2, #3. You use left middle finger instead of pulling the index finger back for #2. But isn't it better to pull back and use the left index for #2 and use middle finger for #3? #2 and #3 are only separated by one R' move while #1 and #2 are separated by three moves R' F R2?



Good point, lol I must have done it wrong in the vid because I was going too slow. I will remake it and upload again soon. Thanks for noticing.


Escher said:


> Whoa, read the video posting rules - no more than 3 per page - otherwise people on slow bandwidths can't view it. Just re-edit your OP with links and not embeds



Should I still do this even after Brest updated it or is it fine now?


----------



## Kirjava (Jan 7, 2013)

I like how he's straight up just ignoring me this time


----------



## Mollerz (Jan 7, 2013)

Can you make a 10.xx avg12 video like Kirjava said, should be easy considering you have a low 11 avg100 and have all the time to make these videos.


----------



## applemobile (Jan 7, 2013)

Stefan didn't mean your solving times, he meant the times to get on each alg. I once watched a youtube video about a certain OLL only to get to the end to see the guy 'sub 3' it.


----------



## jskyler91 (Jan 7, 2013)

Kirjava said:


> I like how he's straight up just ignoring me this time


First of all I did not see your post and second of all yes I can, but I am still working of being sub 11 so it will take a bit (If if could bust out 10 second averages all of the time I would average 10 not 10 to 11) but sure if you can't believe me I will.


Mollerz said:


> Can you make a 10.xx avg12 video like Kirjava said, should be easy considering you have a low 11 avg100 and have all the time to make these videos.


Just so you realize my PB average of 100 is my PB so that was done at my fastest and should not and is not an indication of how I solve every day. This average was one of 300 solves in a day so I was very warmed up. The same is true for all of my PB's. Do you perform at your best every day? Also I make these vids during the time I would be practicing just FYI. I work 3 jobs and I am an independent student so I actually have very little time.


----------



## Mollerz (Jan 7, 2013)

jskyler91 said:


> First of all I did not see your post and second of all yes I can, but I am still working of being sub 11 so it will take a bit (If if could bust out 10 second averages all of the time I would average 10 not 10 to 11) but sure if you can't believe me I will.
> 
> Just so you realize my PB average of 100 is my PB so that was done at my fastest and should not and is not an indication of how I solve every day. This average was one of 300 solves in a day so I was very warmed up. The same is true for all of my PB's. Do you perform at your best every day? Also I make these vids during the time I would be practicing just FYI. I work 3 jobs and I am an independent student so I actually have very little time.



Ok so do an 11 ao12.


----------



## joey (Jan 7, 2013)

Stop making excuses, just make a video.


----------



## Kirjava (Jan 7, 2013)

Ok, we don't care about the times in the video. Can you just post an avg12 for times that are average for you? It doesn't take very long to do this at all.

Doesn't have to be sub11, can be whatever you're comfortable with.


----------



## jskyler91 (Jan 7, 2013)

Mollerz said:


> Ok so do an 11 ao12.


O I can definitely make a 10 second average of 12 I was just pointing out that asking someone to be able to perform at their fastest all of the time is sort of ridiculous.


joey said:


> Stop making excuses, just make a video.


Um , no I have absolutely no need to make a video just because you say it. Also why on earth would you think that by saying this it would at all influence my decisions? I will make a vid because others asked nicely not because you commanded me to do so.


----------



## Mollerz (Jan 7, 2013)

jskyler91 said:


> O I can definitely make a 10 second average of 12 I was just pointing out that asking someone to be able to perform at their fastest all of the time is sort of ridiculous.



I asked you to make one video. You could get an average of 12 which is 10.xx on the 9th attempt for all I care, I just asked if you would do it, I didn't specify you could do it everytime, I just said it would be possible.


----------



## Stefan (Jan 7, 2013)

jskyler91 said:


> But I can sub 1 most of my PLLs so why does my average matter?



That's pretty much what I said.

Your Y-Perm is still wrong, btw.


----------



## jskyler91 (Jan 7, 2013)

Mollerz said:


> I asked you to make one video. You could get an average of 12 which is 10.xx on the 9th attempt for all I care, I just asked if you would do it, I didn't specify you could do it everytime, I just said it would be possible.



O then I must have read in mal intention where there was none. My fault, sorry


----------



## Mollerz (Jan 7, 2013)

jskyler91 said:


> O then I must have read in mal intention where there was none. My fault, sorry



No worries, also Stefan is correct, your Y perm is incorrect.


----------



## jskyler91 (Jan 7, 2013)

Stefan said:


> That's pretty much what I said.
> 
> Your Y-Perm is still wrong, btw.



How? FR'FR2U'R'U'RUR'F'RUR'U'F' is correct is it not?

Edit: Ah wait, I see i did a U' in the description thanks for pointing it out, Updated


----------



## Mollerz (Jan 7, 2013)

jskyler91 said:


> How? FR'FR2U'R'U'RUR'F'RUR'U'F' is correct is it not?



Indeed, we both know that, but your video description does not say this.


----------



## jorgeskm (Jan 8, 2013)

This fingertricks in Big cubes aren't good. And for the 3x3... a lot of lock up.


----------



## sneaklyfox (Jan 8, 2013)

About the U' moves, I looked at the video again and now noticed that you do indexU', indexU', middleU' in the fast version. Funny how going slow can mess you up.

I don't really understand all the posts requesting jskyler to make a video with Ao12 between 10-11. It's as though you want him to prove he's really as fast as he says he is. Do people really go around doubting other people's PBs in their signature line? Yes, his official averages are a few seconds off PBs but some people just don't perform as well under that kind of pressure/stress or whatever.

I usually take everything I hear with a grain of salt. jskyler seems to have thought out and planned how he will improve. Most people don't even do that. I don't necessarily agree that his methods would suit everybody, but I'm sure some people do appreciate his effort and dedication to help others improve.

@jskyler: in A-perm, I currently use D D with left ring finger but thinking of using pinky finger. You use left ring, left pinky. I think it would make more sense for me (and some people) to do left pinky, left ring. Couple thoughts about that - for OH, sometimes you do R2 with the same fingers. I don't know if anyone would use ring then pinky. When people perform U2, it is index the middle. U layer means your hand is turned upwards (fingers are on an upward slant). The index finger is closer to the outside. For D2, your hand is turned slightly downwards so pinky is closer to the outside. Personally, I have a long ring finger and a short pinky. If I were to do ring then pinky, I would have to move my hand away from the cube slightly to push the BDL sticker (the way I do it now) with my ring but then my pinky can't reach the cube in that position. In the end, I think each person should decide which order is easier for themselves. All hands are made differently.


----------



## amostay2004 (Jan 8, 2013)

jskyler91 said:


> Um , no I have absolutely no need to make a video just because you say it. Also why on earth would you think that by saying this it would at all influence my decisions? I will make a vid because others asked nicely not because you commanded me to do so.



After all the videos that you made, I would like to see how you actually apply them in solves, therefore I would like to request a simple 3x3 average video =)


----------



## Kirjava (Jan 8, 2013)

sneaklyfox said:


> I don't really understand all the posts requesting jskyler to make a video with Ao12 between 10-11. It's as though you want him to prove he's really as fast as he says he is. Do people really go around doubting other people's PBs in their signature line? Yes, his official averages are a few seconds off PBs but some people just don't perform as well under that kind of pressure/stress or whatever.



I've been wary of his times for a while. It spawned from a while ago when I compared his sig to his youtube video which also seemed wildly disproportionate at the time.

It's understandable that people don't do as well in competition, but he has an average of 100 faster than his comp single - you really think this is just a case of stress?

I'm just curious to see if he's actually truthful about his times, there are several things that have made me doubt the claims made and there's nothing wrong with disbelief when this is what I'm presented with. You can forgive my skepticism given the circumstance.


----------



## jskyler91 (Jan 8, 2013)

Kirjava said:


> I've been wary of his times for a while. It spawned from a while ago when I compared his sig to his youtube video which also seemed wildly disproportionate at the time.
> 
> It's understandable that people don't do as well in competition, but he has an average of 100 faster than his comp single - you really think this is just a case of stress?
> 
> I'm just curious to see if he's actually truthful about his times, there are several things that have made me doubt the claims made and there's nothing wrong with disbelief when this is what I'm presented with. You can forgive my skepticism given the circumstance.



Its cool dude, I will make an average when I get home after work. I just realized that I haven't uploaded an average in forever anyway so might as well do it now. I was going to wait til I hit sub 10 but whatevs. Also, I have only been to 5 comps total and I have helped organize all of them so ya it is stress, but I also only averaged like 12-13 at my last comp so a 14 average is not that crazy. My current pb was at home after much warm up and with 0 stress.



jorgeskm said:


> This fingertricks in Big cubes aren't good. And for the 3x3... a lot of lock up.



Practice practice practice, you are retraining your fingers what do you expect lol and ya for big cubes these might be harder.


----------



## CarlBrannen (Jan 8, 2013)

I appreciate the videos and don't give a rats patootie whether you post a sub 10 video or not. If the stress at competitions is slowing you down you might consider wearing ear muffs or something. In any case, you have to practice in a situation similar to your competition, so try practicing in a higher stress environment.

As it turns out, it seems that being stressed and having high blood pressure improves my times.


----------



## MarcelP (Jan 8, 2013)

sneaklyfox said:


> Do people really go around doubting other people's PBs in their signature line? Yes, his official averages are a few seconds off PBs but some people just don't perform as well under that kind of pressure/stress or whatever.



Yes, I have been wondering this myself too. I for one really appreciate his video's and never even looked at his signature untill some one asked about his times. I have a single official of 34 seconds. My signature says something else. I am not a liar eighter, I have just recently improved a lot. However, I will never have such great times at competitions since I can't perform on the spot. I get very shaky hands.


----------



## Noahaha (Jan 8, 2013)

Spoiler



My sig is a lie. I periodically make up times so that internet people think I'm better at solving Rubik's cubes than I actually am, and this makes me feel good about myself because they think I'm fast even if I'm not. I especially enjoy posting new PBs when I'm lonely or I've had a bad day. My videos are fake too. I hacked together a version of qqtimer that gives me whatever scrambles I want, and in competition I wear a tiny earpiece. I also make instructional videos. These are fake too. If you learned from one of my videos, go ahead and forget that stuff right now. Even if I know what I'm talking about, it's useless if I'm a phony.



Spoiler: Clicky



Not really of course






In all seriousness though, can you guys just argue with what his video says, rather than arguing that he shouldn't be teaching people??? That has got to be the laziest kind of flaming.



MarcelP said:


> I get very shaky hands.



I promise you this will go away. Once competitions become a normal thing for you, you'll be able to relax and enjoy yourself, and then solves will just be this thing you do in between talking to interesting people.


----------



## MarcelP (Jan 8, 2013)

Noahaha said:


> I promise you this will go away. Once competitions become a normal thing for you, you'll be able to relax and enjoy yourself, and then solves will just be this thing you do in between talking to interesting people.



Yes, I hope so. I also have this when I make a speed video. Let's say I want to film an Ao5. I get so nervous that I do not even come close to my normal times.. But when I just let the camera run during timed train sessions I might get lucky and get a PB on film


----------



## mark49152 (Jan 8, 2013)

MarcelP said:


> Yes, I hope so. I also have this when I make a speed video. Let's say I want to film an Ao5. I get so nervous that I do not even come close to my normal times.


Yeah I get like that when the timer's running. I'm sure I'm already sub-30 when it's not


----------



## Kirjava (Jan 8, 2013)

jskyler91 said:


> but I also only averaged like 12-13 at my last comp



You dropped two seconds from your average in the last two months?! 



Noahaha said:


> In all seriousness though, can you guys just argue with what his video says, rather than arguing that he shouldn't be teaching people???



We're not arguing that he shouldn't be teaching people? We're not even arguing at all.

I'm just curious to see if his times are what he says, because that would be pretty weird considering the current evidence.


----------



## Petro Leum (Jan 8, 2013)

Kirjava said:


> You dropped two seconds from your average in the last two months?!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You're right, but it's still pretty OT in this Thread...it's probably too late now, but one can do this via PM.

anyway, B2T: I really like your turning style, I often unintentionally use my Thumbs, and your videos give an extra portion of reflection about when "special" finger tricks make sense. I will definately go over my 2H algs again soon and probably incorporate a lot more index/middle switching and thumb flicking.
Thanks for the contribution


----------



## Kirjava (Jan 14, 2013)

jskyler91 said:


> Its cool dude, I will make an average when I get home after work.



Just wondering if you forgot to make it or something, was looking forward to watching!


----------



## Mollerz (Jan 16, 2013)

Eagerly awaiting the average still.


----------



## jskyler91 (Jan 16, 2013)

Hey guys, I have been ridiculously busy as of late, but I will be making more vids over the next week or so. I have been working and doing birthday related stuff all week and I haven't had any time to cube let alone make vids. I will make that average as soon as I get a chance and I will be making more vids on avoiding cube rotations, PLL's and more lol. Just a quick update for you all. Sorry about the wait, but sometimes life gets crazy.

O and to Kir, I didn't really drop 2 seconds, I was just out of practice for the whole summer so I gained a second or so and then I have lost around 1- 1.5 seconds in those two months. I haven't been practicing recently though so I need to get back at it. I still want to be 10 or sub 10 by the end of my 2nd year which I am sort of on track for.


----------



## jskyler91 (Jan 24, 2013)

More vids!!! Also I made a quick sub 10 average of 5 vid which should be up soon. I am still working on getting that sub 10 average of 12 though, I am really out of practice and whenever I turn on the camera I mess up or I go sup 10 lol, but I will make it soon. I just figured you guys wanted more tutorials than for me to spend days trying to beat my pb.


----------



## mark49152 (Jan 24, 2013)

Yeah I just enjoy watching cubing-related stuff and frankly don't care about your times. You're way more experienced than me and I'll follow your ideas based on whether they're appealing and make sense rather than whether you're sub-10. Thanks!


----------



## jskyler91 (Jan 24, 2013)

mark49152 said:


> Yeah I just enjoy watching cubing-related stuff and frankly don't care about your times. You're way more experienced than me and I'll follow your ideas based on whether they're appealing and make sense rather than whether you're sub-10. Thanks!



Thanks, good to know im not hated by everyone lol


----------



## Antikrister (Feb 5, 2013)

I like your fingertricks, I use a couple of them in my solves now thank's for posting them!


----------



## CarlBrannen (Feb 6, 2013)

I modified the Prisma Puzzle Timer to help me figure out where I'm at with my PLLs. The modifications keep track of exactly which PLL you've solved and computes the averages for each type.

This has been quite useful. I'm using 2-look PLL. I discovered that my Ab solves are much much slower than my Aa. When I saw the data I immediately knew it was a problem with recognition. I hadn't noticed that I didn't use the Ab algorithm as much as I should.

There are 72 PLL cases, counting orientation. With four colors and four cube orientations there are a total of 4x4x72 = 1152 possible PLL situations. The software gives you all 1152 in your first 1152 PLL solves. The next 1152 are the same but in a different (pseudorandom) order. As you solve situations in the second 1152, it removes that situation from your average. So your average always shows an even balance of all the PLL cases that are possible with the appropriate probabilities for each.

I'm still in early use / testing of this software. There are a lot of features I'd like to add to it. I should have it running well enough to share in a week or two. One of the things I want to add is a message when you've set a new PB for a PLL case. As in "Congratulations, new best for Ab". And I've added a bunch of other things I think a timer should have such as an "oops" button which allows you to restart the solve.


----------



## Bestsimple (Feb 7, 2013)

PLL stands for permutation of last layer and is seperate to orientation.


----------



## CarlBrannen (Feb 7, 2013)

Oh, by "cube orientation" I mean orientation of the whole cube, not orientation of an edge or corner. There are six sides to a cube and any of them could be up. Then you can rotate it four ways. So for any given situation, there are 24 ways to hold the cube. But with PLL and OLL, you begin with your cross on the bottom. That means there are 4 ways to orient. People talk about this regularly on speedsolving.com, for example:
_
I think the cube should be provided in an undetermined orientation. It should definitely NOT be possible for a competitor to claim the cube was in the wrong orientation and be able to get a new scramble.

It would be nice if we tried to provide the cube in a random orientation, but that might be impractical. We could have the scrambler toss the cube in the air after scrambling and before placing it with the competitor's scorecard, but I'm not sure it's really necessary._
http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showthread.php?36691-Competitor-requested-orientation

What the software I've got does is to avoid the necessity of tossing the cube in the air to randomize it. The usual scrambles are a sequence of stuff in the set {U,U2,U',R,R2,R', ... D,D2,D'}. What I've done is add code to change the orientation of the cube. For the PLL and OLL scrambles, this means that a scramble can end with one of {y,y2,y'}. You won't always start a PLL scramble with the green center pointing towards you.

Of course you should scramble the cube without watching it. And I did a bunch of other changes. For instance, there's automatically no "inspection" time when you're in PLL mode now.

They could make the change to the definition of the WCA scrambles. I think it would be an (insignificant) improvement.


----------

