# Speedcubing and its public image



## AlGoreRhythm (Oct 22, 2014)

Hey guys! I just got an email from Bay Area Speedcubin' saying that the competition will be filmed, and may end up on TV. This made me wonder, how is speedcubing's public image. Any thoughts? Is speed cubing getting 'Bigger'?


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## ketchuphater999 (Oct 22, 2014)

I think so. The community has gotten bigger, as far as I can tell, and cubes are getting more appearances in media lately.

I hope I get 1-move x-cross+easy f2l+LL skip... while live on the news... and get wr

If that actually happened I could bet on being below 5.55


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## donal56 (Oct 22, 2014)

Do you know there are competitions of rock, paper, scissors? I think the way we see em its the way they see us, as a weird but amazing event. And yes, I think speedcubing is growing even in non first world countries


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## Yarco (Oct 22, 2014)

"What's speedcubing?" "Oh, you must be good at math!"

I think its growing, but nowhere near mainstream and not a fad like Pokemon cards , pogs, or yo-yos yet.


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## IRNjuggle28 (Oct 22, 2014)

I don't think cubing will ever get there, and I don't feel strongly about that. I don't have any issue with cubing becoming "mainstream" or any hipster BS, but I also think that it's just not that fun. *I* love it, of course, but cubing isn't a common hobby, and a lot of cubers quit because they don't like it enough. I think most people will get way more enjoyment out of, say, basketball. Cubing is an acquired taste, and looking at it from outside my own emotions toward cubing, I can see that it's not likely to become popular, and for good reason.


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## dougthecube (Oct 22, 2014)

I think one thing that massively helps the growth of speedcubing is that it is not a fad as someone mentioned. This means that people do cube for a very long time unlike Pokemon cards, and also how people throw a lot of time at it as well.


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## TDM (Oct 22, 2014)

Gallifrey said:


> I hope I get 1-move x-cross+easy f2l+LL skip... while live on the news... and get wr
> 
> If that actually happened I could bet on being below 5.55


Unlikely at your speed... you'd have to get much more lucky than that. Even at my speed (high 13) an easy F2L is ~5 seconds, and I'd probably AUF about three times when I got the LL skip before stopping the timer. Unless I expected it to be coming and didn't panic I don't think I could get a sub-WR time until I improved a bit more.


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## guysensei1 (Oct 22, 2014)

TDM said:


> Unlikely at your speed... you'd have to get much more lucky than that. Even at my speed (high 13) an easy F2L is ~5 seconds, and I'd probably AUF about three times when I got the LL skip before stopping the timer. Unless I expected it to be coming and didn't panic I don't think I could get a sub-WR time until I improved a bit more.



It's gonna pop too.


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## ElectricDoodie (Oct 22, 2014)

IRNjuggle28 said:


> I don't think cubing will ever get there, and I don't feel strongly about that. I don't have any issue with cubing becoming "mainstream" or any hipster BS, but I also think that it's just not that fun. *I* love it, of course, but cubing isn't a common hobby, and a lot of cubers quit because they don't like it enough. I think most people will get way more enjoyment out of, say, basketball. Cubing is an acquired taste, and looking at it from outside my own emotions toward cubing, I can see that it's not likely to become popular, and for good reason.



Yeah, that's how I feel. A lot of people who find out I speedcube, ask to see it. When I show them, they are amazed, but none of them ever want to actually learn to speedcube. Maybe they get an interest, but I've never had anyone follow through past learning F2L. In fact, most people just say, "Why would you want to keep solving the same thing over and over again? Isn't that just boring?"


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## AlGoreRhythm (Oct 22, 2014)

Good points. Just found out about competitive yo-yoing, found out the competitors are called "throwers". Was about to laugh then i thought, "well, that's.. how we look to everybody else..."


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## brian724080 (Oct 23, 2014)

ElectricDoodie said:


> "Why would you want to keep solving the same thing over and over again? Isn't that just boring?"



To deal with people who do other sports: well, don't you just do ____ over and over again? Exactly, that's why I like doing this.


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## Hypocrism (Oct 23, 2014)

I'd love for cubing to go mainstream. However I think people have the impression that you need to be intelligent, or even that you really need to think to solve (obviously wrong), so avoid it because they don't think they can put in the work. That's what's going to stop people doing it. Maybe we need a really dumb representative of cubing to get past this image...


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## Silverspeed (Oct 24, 2014)

Hypocrism said:


> I'd love for cubing to go mainstream. However I think people have the impression that you need to be intelligent, or even that you really need to think to solve (obviously wrong), so avoid it because they don't think they can put in the work. That's what's going to stop people doing it. Maybe we need a really dumb representative of cubing to get past this image...



I see where you're coming from , however,
it does take thinking to do things such as sub-7 move cross, xCross, CLL recognition, and other advanced substeps.


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## XTowncuber (Oct 24, 2014)

Silverspeed said:


> I see where you're coming from , however,
> it does take thinking to do things such as sub-7 move cross, xCross, CLL recognition, and other advanced substeps.



Not if you're good at it.


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## AlGoreRhythm (Oct 24, 2014)

> > I see where you're coming from , however,
> > it does take thinking to do things such as sub-7 move cross, xCross, CLL recognition, and other advanced substeps.
> 
> 
> Not if you're good at it.



lol.


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## JediJupiter (Oct 24, 2014)

AlGoreRhythm said:


> Good points. Just found out about competitive yo-yoing, found out the competitors are called "throwers". Was about to laugh then i thought, "well, that's.. how we look to everybody else..."


Oh, I laughed. Is throwing as big as cubing?


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## Kirjava (Oct 24, 2014)

XTowncuber said:


> Not if you're good at it.



and thinking is required to become good at it


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## goodatthis (Oct 24, 2014)

I think part of the appeal of speedcubing is the assumption of unobtainability of the skill. Yoyoing seems like it could be done with some practice, same with fast clapping, cup stacking, talking, etc. Being able to turn fast is only the half of the appeal, the fact that you're even able to solve it is the cool part for most people. I get more shocked faces when I do a single solve than when I do an 100 move challenge in 7 seconds. (And I tell them it's 100 moves)


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## Rcuber123 (Oct 25, 2014)

Hypocrism said:


> I'd love for cubing to go mainstream. However I think people have the impression that you need to be intelligent, or even that you really need to think to solve (obviously wrong), so avoid it because they don't think they can put in the work. That's what's going to stop people doing it. Maybe we need a really dumb representative of cubing to get past this image...


Justin Beiber


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## guysensei1 (Oct 25, 2014)

Rcuber123 said:


> Justin Beiber



Heh. Also... There's a Justin Beaver in the WCA.


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## Tim Major (Oct 25, 2014)

Gallifrey said:


> I think so. The community has gotten bigger, as far as I can tell, and cubes are getting more appearances in media lately.



I've been cubing since 2009 and I disagree. Cubing is getting far bigger, but it's gone from thousands to thousands, it's still tiny, I don't think media appearances are increasing


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## AlGoreRhythm (Oct 25, 2014)

> I don't think media appearances are increasing


http://www.cubingusa.com/basc4/


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## ElectricDoodie (Oct 28, 2014)

AlGoreRhythm said:


> http://www.cubingusa.com/basc4/



I don't get what this is proving, or what the point of your post was...

He didn't say there is NO media appearance. He just said it's not increasing.


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## Par0dy (Oct 30, 2014)

I'm not sure but if you go on YJ's website. Besides cubes they also sell yo-yos.


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## PokeCuberAlex (Nov 8, 2014)

Tim Major said:


> I've been cubing since 2009 and I disagree. Cubing is getting far bigger, but it's gone from thousands to thousands, it's still tiny


Yes but in fact this has been the first year to have over 10 thousand competitors. Every year there are far more people and events to the last year and the difference in growth is getting bigger, so yes it is becoming ever the more closer to the main stream. There will eventually be over 100000 total by the next 10 years and 100000 yearly by the next 18 years as more and more competitions continue to pore in. Tunisia is soon having their first event in just over a months time and eventually Algeria another developed African country will get theirs + a number of others as the growth of the community continues to speed up every year, so watch this space. It will eventually reach mainstream growth.


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## TDM (Nov 8, 2014)

PokeCuberAlex said:


> There will eventually be over 100000 total by the next 10 years and 100000 yearly by the next 18 years


How do you know that?


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## PokeCuberAlex (Nov 8, 2014)

TDM said:


> How do you know that?



Because the amount is growing and like is said at a quicker pace every year in 11 years it has gone from being barely over 100 a year to over 10000 a year and more and more are constantly getting into it due to the ever increasing notice of new competitions going on every year. Think about it if it has already grown this fast then it is only going to carry on from here onwards. Thing can only get better from here.


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## tx789 (Nov 8, 2014)

PokeCuberAlex said:


> Because the amount is growing and like is said at a quicker pace every year in 11 years it has gone from being barely over 100 a year to over 10000 a year and more and more are constantly getting into it due to the ever increasing notice of new competitions going on every year. Think about it if it has already grown this fast then it is only going to carry on from here onwards. Thing can only get better from here.



It could start decreasing in popularity. It might just stop growing. Only time will tell. It could also slow in its growth.


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## Kirjava (Nov 8, 2014)

idk

there are negatives to popularity

in the uk competitions are more frequent, so attendance becomes fragmented for many people

I don't know if this means certain people see each other less, but I feel it might

also the signal to noise ratio has been getting more and more skewed, but I don't think that's a valid complaint ("/b/ was never good")


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## PokeCuberAlex (Nov 8, 2014)

tx789 said:


> It could start decreasing in popularity. It might just stop growing. Only time will tell. It could also slow in its growth.


Well next year is looking to be even bigger. With 9 competitions already planned over another month of this year with the rest to build up so again the trend is show no signs of stopping so unlikely chance of that being the case, but like you said only time will well it it's clearly that the growth is not going to stop for a very long time to come.


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## PokeCuberAlex (Nov 8, 2014)

Kirjava said:


> idk
> 
> there are negatives to popularity
> 
> ...



True it can get too noisy and that more people can get in the why of your registration opportunities, but then they can do it in larger rooms where the noise of everyone can be a lot more distant from everyone. Also they can do larger turnouts of 100 or more and bring those events back more often so that more long time competitors can have the chance to compete.


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## PokeCuberAlex (Nov 8, 2014)

Also Kirjava I was the one who was at the same table as you on day 2 at this weekends Leicester event and asked if you was a brownie. It's ok I can handle some one being into something unusual each to our own where all unique in our own ways.


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## minstorm340 (Nov 9, 2014)

It is definitely growing in popularity, with more and more youcubers, cubing making the news, and the rubiks speedcube making more and more people that know about cubing. Even though they don't all take it up, most people still think it's awesome. I think we're all going to be seeing it more often.


But at least the people that already cube will have a huge head start times-wise if it becomes mainstream.


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## Stefan (Nov 9, 2014)

PokeCuberAlex said:


> Yes but in fact this has been the first year to have over 10 thousand competitors.



False.



PokeCuberAlex said:


> Every year there are far more *people* and *events* to the last year and *the difference in growth is getting bigger*



Depends (*), false, false.

(*) on your definition of "far".



PokeCuberAlex said:


> the growth of the community [speeds] up every year



False.


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## PokeCuberAlex (Nov 9, 2014)

Stefan said:


> False.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Stefan said:


> False.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The WCA has all the proof you need to know If you check and compete the total number of competitors for each and every year, you will find everything I've said to be true. to date nearly 33000 competitors thanks the now 100s of joining in the many weekly competitions to go on each week. Also how would more world wide competitions not add up to more world wide competitors? Again all my proof here in writing. Next time please don't try to claim that someone's wrong without checking first.


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## Stefan (Nov 9, 2014)

PokeCuberAlex said:


> The WCA has all the proof you need to know If you check and compete the total number of competitors for each and every year, you will find everything I've said to be true. to date nearly 33000 competitors thanks the now 100s of joining in the many weekly competitions to go on each week. Also how would more world wide competitions not add up to more world wide competitors? Again all my proof here in writing. Next time please don't try to claim that someone's wrong without checking first.



I *had* checked, and you *are* wrong (also about the new claim "nearly 33000 competitors").


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## PokeCuberAlex (Nov 9, 2014)

Stefan said:


> You have no clue who I am, do you?
> 
> I *had* checked, and you *are* wrong (also about the new claim "nearly 33000 competitors").



Link me the proof then Because the total amount of entered Cubers for all years combined clearly reaches just under 33000 it's even noted in on it's wiki page.


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## Stefan (Nov 9, 2014)

PokeCuberAlex said:


> Link me the proof then Because the total amount of entered Cubers for all years combined clearly reaches just under 33000 it's even noted in on it's wiki page.



https://www.worldcubeassociation.org/results/misc/export.html

=> 34287 competitors


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## PokeCuberAlex (Nov 9, 2014)

Stefan said:


> https://www.worldcubeassociation.org/results/misc/export.html
> 
> => 34287 competitors


Thank you for giving me the EXACT total amount that even accounted for those who did not compete in 3x3 or who only got DNF's. It was very unclear that you was telling me this due to the way you worded it. You worded it as if I was wrong about the fact that it was growing when all you needed to tell me was that it was much more then those only counted for completing the 3x3 sloves and that you knew how to find that total out. Thanks for very clear on was you meant by the word "false". =)


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## Stefan (Nov 9, 2014)

PokeCuberAlex said:


> You worded it as if I was wrong about the fact that it was growing



I never said you were wrong about it (the number of competitors, or cubing) growing. But you didn't just say that. You said stuff about the growth of the growth, and even about the growth of the growth of the growth. And I pointed out that you're wrong about those. You're also wrong about the number of events (as well as about the number of competitions, in case that's what you actually meant).

Why don't you show us your statistics on which you based your statements? Then we can maybe find the problem. I don't want to guess what you did.

Edit: Oh well, here's mine regarding your _"the difference in growth is getting bigger"_:



Spoiler: Growth



Using data from WCA_export504_20141109 and Stefan's WCA Statistics Tools.


*Year**Competitors**Growth**Difference
in growth**How much the
difference
in growth
got bigger*19821920039071.02004205115.044.02005548343.0228.0184.02006844296.0-47.0-275.020071498654.0358.0405.0200830181520.0866.0508.0200951012083.0563.0-303.0201062941193.0-890.0-1453.0201173161022.0-171.0719.020127912596.0-426.0-255.02013102692357.01761.02187.02014 (so far)124122143.0-214.0-1975.0



Spoiler: SQL





```
[NOPARSE]set @c := @g := @gg := @ggg := Null;
select y Year, c Competitors, g Growth, gg 'Difference\nin growth', ggg 'How much the\ndifference\nin growth\ngot bigger' from (
select y, @ggg:[email protected] ggg, @gg:=gg gg, @g:=g g, @c:=c c from (
select y, @gg:[email protected] gg, @g:=g g, @c:=c c from (
select y, @g:[email protected] g, @c:=c c from (
select year y, count(distinct personId) c
from Results join Competitions on id=competitionId
group by year
order by year) tmp) tmp2) tmp3) tmp4;[/NOPARSE]
```







Edit 2: In case you meant number of all-time competitors, i.e., including people who don't compete anymore (didn't sound like it, and it's not a good measure of the size of cubing), you're only wrong about the growth of the growth of the growth:



Spoiler: Growth 2



Using data from WCA_export504_20141109 and Stefan's WCA Statistics Tools.


*Until and
including**Competitors**Growth**Difference
in growth**How much the
difference
in growth
got bigger*198219200310788.02004281174.086.02005698417.0243.0157.020061278580.0163.0-80.0200722931015.0435.0272.0200844672174.01159.0724.0200980653598.01424.0265.02010120523987.0389.0-1035.02011163594307.0320.0-69.02012207394380.073.0-247.02013269076168.01788.01715.02014 (so far)342877380.01212.0-576.0



Spoiler: SQL





```
[NOPARSE]set @c := @g := @gg := @ggg := Null;

create table YearlyCompetitors
select distinct year, personId from Results join Competitions on Competitions.id=competitionId;

select y 'Until and\including', c Competitors, g Growth, gg 'Difference\nin growth', ggg 'How much the\ndifference\nin growth\ngot bigger' from (
select y, @ggg:[email protected] ggg, @gg:=gg gg, @g:=g g, @c:=c c from (
select y, @gg:[email protected] gg, @g:=g g, @c:=c c from (
select y, @g:[email protected] g, @c:=c c from (
select y, count(distinct b.personId) c
from (select distinct year y from YearlyCompetitors) a, YearlyCompetitors b
WHERE b.year <= y
group by y
order by y) tmp) tmp2) tmp3) tmp4;

drop table YearlyCompetitors;[/NOPARSE]
```


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## PokeCuberAlex (Nov 9, 2014)

Stefan said:


> I never said you were wrong about it (the number of competitors, or cubing) growing. But you didn't just say that. You said stuff about the growth of the growth, and even about the growth of the growth of the growth. And I pointed out that you're wrong about those. You're also wrong about the number of events (as well as about the number of competitions, in case that's what you actually meant).
> 
> Why don't you show us your statistics on which you based your statements? Then we can maybe find the problem. I'm not just gonna guess what you did.
> 
> ...



I am only giving rough numbers on where the growth is heading. The chart doesn't seem to make any sense out of a years increase of events and competitors but you what? It doesn't matter as long as it's growing that's all we need to know and if I can have an event to return to Leeds which as you'd know has been gone for nearly a decade, and if I can being another 20 to 40 into the scene then that would be another lot adding to the total. It's clear though that it still continues to grow and as long as that carry's things are most certainly looking good.


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