# Modding Service



## Michael Womack (Feb 27, 2014)

Hi I would like to start a modding service and I can mod any SS/Dayan cube for you. I will only accept from people who live in the US. See video for more info. I now have a Website for this http://mikeni.startlogic.com/


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## ChickenWrap (Feb 27, 2014)

How much are you charging for each type of cube?


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## manqiuw (Feb 27, 2014)

How about Canada?


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## Michael Womack (Feb 27, 2014)

manqiuw said:


> How about Canada?



Depends on where in Canada.



ChickenWrap said:


> How much are you charging for each type of cube?



$10


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## ChickenWrap (Feb 27, 2014)

Does that include shipping the cube back? And fully modding it? For example, a Florian mod with spring swap?


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## Michael Womack (Feb 27, 2014)

ChickenWrap said:


> Does that include shipping the cube back? And fully modding it? For example, a Florian mod with spring swap?



I don't really have extra springs and I didn't want to do that. Also the $10 covers it all.


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## ChickenWrap (Feb 27, 2014)

Michael Womack said:


> I don't really have extra springs and I didn't want to do that. Also the $10 covers it all.



So what mods are you doing, exactly?


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## Michael Womack (Feb 27, 2014)

ChickenWrap said:


> So what mods are you doing, exactly?



If you want I can do the full mod that I did to my SS 5x5 or just the florian mod.


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## Michael Womack (Mar 9, 2014)

Bump i'm still looking for people t send me there cubes to mod.


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## ChickenWrap (Mar 9, 2014)

I didn't want to be rude when you originally posted this thread, but no one will send anyone cubes when you offer a "full mod" for $10 including shipping. Assuming shipping is free (which it isn't), and minimum wage is $8/hr, we should expect you to do 1-2 hours of work on the cube. So, is this "full mod" really worth the time and money? I doubt it.

Maybe try explaining what the mod is, post pictures, etc.


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## Michael Womack (Mar 9, 2014)

Shipping is free.

http://imgur.com/KhOzIVH

This pic shows a mod I did to the Cyclone boys 3x3 and it is Based off of my Dayan cube mods so it'll give you an idea.


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## stormskater216 (Mar 9, 2014)

ChickenWrap said:


> I didn't want to be rude when you originally posted this thread, but no one will send anyone cubes when you offer a "full mod" for $10 including shipping. Assuming shipping is free (which it isn't), and minimum wage is $8/hr, we should expect you to do 1-2 hours of work on the cube. So, is this "full mod" really worth the time and money? I doubt it.
> 
> Maybe try explaining what the mod is, post pictures, etc.



I don't mean to come off as offensive, but are you trying to imply that he isn't going to do a good job or that the mod is too expensive or what? I'm not really understanding what you mean by this comment. Could you elaborate?


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## ChickenWrap (Mar 9, 2014)

stormskater216 said:


> I don't mean to come off as offensive, but are you trying to imply that he isn't going to do a good job or that the mod is too expensive or what? I'm not really understanding what you mean by this comment. Could you elaborate?



All I was saying is that a "full mod" is not a recognized mod, so he should explain what that is in the beginning of the thread rather than making someone have to ask what exactly they would be paying for. I cannot say if $10 is too expensive, in fact I think that Michael wouldn't really be making enough money off of that to make it worthwhile for him. I don't need that mod, but maybe someone else does.


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## stormskater216 (Mar 10, 2014)

ChickenWrap said:


> All I was saying is that a "full mod" is not a recognized mod, so he should explain what that is in the beginning of the thread rather than making someone have to ask what exactly they would be paying for. I cannot say if $10 is too expensive, in fact I think that Michael wouldn't really be making enough money off of that to make it worthwhile for him. I don't need that mod, but maybe someone else does.



Oh okay. That makes more sense. Thank you!


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## guinepigs rock (Mar 10, 2014)

I would never let michael mod my cubes.


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## Michael Womack (Apr 6, 2014)

Oh here is a video of a finished modded SS 5x5 for forum member Eppley12. Oh and the video was uploaded on the 2nd of April.


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## Rocky0701 (Apr 6, 2014)

Michael Womack said:


> Oh here is a video of a finished modded SS 5x5 for forum member Eppley12. Oh and the video was uploaded on the 2nd of April.


You still haven't explained why you are modding cubes and shipping them for only $10. Are you trying to make a profit and just dremeling them really quickly in like half an hour? Or are you taking your time and doing it by hand for only about 3 dollars an hour? I guess you could just do it as a hobby, but until you explain why, i don't think that many people will send you their cubes.


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## Michael Womack (Apr 7, 2014)

Rocky0701 said:


> You still haven't explained why you are modding cubes and shipping them for only $10. Are you trying to make a profit and just dremeling them really quickly in like half an hour? Or are you taking your time and doing it by hand for only about 3 dollars an hour? I guess you could just do it as a hobby, but until you explain why, i don't think that many people will send you their cubes.



No this 5x5 took me 7 hour to mod. Ok I feel like I really want to earn some extra money and I have a lot of spare time on my hands.


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## ChickenWrap (Apr 7, 2014)

Michael Womack said:


> No this 5x5 took me 7 hour to mod.



$10 is what you are charging. Shipping will cost roughly $5. Do you really want to do 7 hours of work for a $5 profit? That seems absurd.


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## Michael Womack (Apr 7, 2014)

ChickenWrap said:


> $10 is what you are charging. Shipping will cost roughly $5. Do you really want to do 7 hours of work for a $5 profit? That seems absurd.



No it's free shipping.


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## ChickenWrap (Apr 7, 2014)

Michael Womack said:


> Shipping is free.





Michael Womack said:


> No it's free shipping.



Free shipping will still cost YOU money. Understand?


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## Michael Womack (Apr 7, 2014)

ChickenWrap said:


> Free shipping will still cost YOU money. Understand?



Yes I know but it's not that much.


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## ChickenWrap (Apr 7, 2014)

Still, the math is way off. Even if your shipping costs you nothing, you will still be doing 7 hours of work for $10. That is an hourly wage of about $1.40/hr. Why not just work at McDonalds? They will pay you at least $8/hr.


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## Michael Womack (Apr 7, 2014)

ChickenWrap said:


> Still, the math is way off. Even if your shipping costs you nothing, you will still be doing 7 hours of work for $10. That is an hourly wage of about $1.40/hr. Why not just work at McDonalds? They will pay you at least $8/hr.



I'm doing this until I can find a good job. Also some people want to have a good modded cube but don't want to mod the cube themselves. While I have like 4 years of experience in modding cubes. Also some people would want to get a cube modded by me just so they can try my super mods.


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## Rocky0701 (Apr 7, 2014)

Michael Womack said:


> I'm doing this until I can find a good job. Also some people want to have a good modded cube but don't want to mod the cube themselves. While I have like 4 years of experience in modding cubes. Also some people would want to get a cube modded by me just so they can try my super mods.


This still makes no sense to me. If you want to make money until you can find a job, why don't you just mow lawns, rake leaves, etc. like other people?


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## natezach728 (Apr 7, 2014)

Why would you work to get $10 for 7 hours of work, while you can get $15 for 1 hour of work by mowing lawns and such, like Rocky0701 said?


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## Lazy Einstein (Apr 7, 2014)

Woah who cares why he is doing it for the prices he chose. Don't trust him? Don't use his service. 

Dude Clearly likes modding, wants practice, and is doing it cheap to help out others.


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## Baku (Apr 7, 2014)

Michael, I think that you need to understand that before anyone sends you their cube, they want to know exactly what you are doing to their cube. So please, state what you are doing to the cube (ie: CPM Mod, 48 Point Edge Mod, or something else).


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## IRNjuggle28 (Apr 7, 2014)

So, what exactly is the "full" mod on a SS 5x5? Florian, and what else?


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## mDiPalma (Apr 7, 2014)

I recommend you charge $17.28.


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## Michael Womack (Apr 7, 2014)

Lazy Einstein said:


> Woah who cares why he is doing it for the prices he chose. Don't trust him? Don't use his service.
> 
> Dude Clearly likes modding, wants practice, and is doing it cheap to help out others.



Exactly that's what I have been trying to tell them.


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## applemobile (Apr 7, 2014)

If I lived in Murrica, I would send my cubes to Michelle, I've seen hour long videos of his mods before, and they look fantastic. $10 is a bargain.


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## pipkiksass (Apr 7, 2014)

applemobile said:


> If I lived in Murrica, I would send my cubes to Michelle, I've seen hour long videos of his mods before, and they look fantastic. $10 is a bargain.



I couldn't possibly condone slave labour!

Seriously Michael, if it takes you 7 hours then the price should reflect that. Post exactly what mods you do, and some good YouTube footage, then increase your price to like $35.

You should place a higher value on your personal time, even if others don't.


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## Michael Womack (Apr 7, 2014)

pipkiksass said:


> I couldn't possibly condone slave labour!
> 
> Seriously Michael, if it takes you 7 hours then the price should reflect that. Post exactly what mods you do, and some good YouTube footage, then increase your price to like $35.
> 
> You should place a higher value on your personal time, even if others don't.





Michael Womack said:


> Oh here is a video of a finished modded SS 5x5 for forum member Eppley12. Oh and the video was uploaded on the 2nd of April.


see that. Also I don't want others to pay $35 for me to mod there cubes and thay don't really use the cube that much or don't like the turning of the modded cube. Also if I get more and more offers then I might raise the price.


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## Blurry (Apr 8, 2014)

I don't enjoy arguing with people. But personally I believe that If Michael want's to mod cubes, gain experience and a reputation he is doing it right.
It's the same with starting out a business. You start with your expectations low, and your prices also low. Making sure your prices give you SOME income, with no regards of time spent. Customers with good experiences with you will recommend you and your reputation as well as your consumer base will grow. Carefully over time, you will learn what takes more effort, and what you PERSONALLY believe your work hours are worth. Videos and explanations of what is needed is a must though, explaining what exactly you do. Noting all the various expenses, buying supplies and various other needed essentials for what you need, as well as covering and hopefully explaining why your prices are what they are.
That is from a business standpoint, but you don't understand if modding is simply just a hobby, or something to do with free time. I'd rather be doing something productive than just sitting here, so gaining even £/$1 profit is still a increase in the amount of money you had previously.
Dictating what somebody should do with their money and where they get it from is unacceptable.
Personal opinion and personal needs require different things.

As I said. I dislike arguing/debating, but I felt this was needed.


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## Michael Womack (Apr 8, 2014)

Blurry said:


> I don't enjoy arguing with people. But personally I believe that If Michael want's to mod cubes, gain experience and a reputation he is doing it right.
> It's the same with starting out a business. You start with your expectations low, and your prices also low. Making sure your prices give you SOME income, with no regards of time spent. Customers with good experiences with you will recommend you and your reputation as well as your consumer base will grow. Carefully over time, you will learn what takes more effort, and what you PERSONALLY believe your work hours are worth. Videos and explanations of what is needed is a must though, explaining what exactly you do. Noting all the various expenses, buying supplies and various other needed essentials for what you need, as well as covering and hopefully explaining why your prices are what they are.
> That is from a business standpoint, but you don't understand if modding is simply just a hobby, or something to do with free time. I'd rather be doing something productive than just sitting here, so gaining even £/$1 profit is still a increase in the amount of money you had previously.
> Dictating what somebody should do with their money and where they get it from is unacceptable.
> ...



I agree with you 100%. Also I had to start from somewhere.


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## pipkiksass (Apr 8, 2014)

Michael Womack said:


> I don't want others to pay $35 for me to mod there cubes and thay don't really use the cube that much or don't like the turning of the modded cube.


A good description of the mods would avoid this. If you offer e.g. a Florian mod for a fixed price, and perform the mod, they get what they asked and paid for. If they don't like it, they asked for the wrong thing. 


Blurry said:


> It's the same with starting out a business. You start with your expectations low, and your prices also low. Making sure your prices give you SOME income, with no regards of time spent.


Yes, but setting the prices this low would cause any startup business to go bankrupt very quickly. 


Blurry said:


> Dictating what somebody should do with their money and where they get it from is unacceptable.
> Personal opinion and personal needs require different things.


Who's doing this? Nobody's dictating, are they? Personally, I suggested Michael shouldn't undersell himself. Hobby or business, I don't believe anyone should operate as a loss. Except for Bugatti - they can afford it.


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## stoic (Apr 8, 2014)

pipkiksass said:


> setting the prices this low would cause any startup business to go bankrupt very quickly.


Plenty of businesses have burned cash as a route becoming successful later on. Amazon springs to mind.


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## Blurry (Apr 8, 2014)

I said as a example a business, in modding. I didn't describe what prices would be set, I said income would be received, implying that you would have a gain. I didn't say anything about how much I would personally feel they would increase, as I felt that would completely go against what I was trying to convey. 

Dictating via a negative opinion. If you're trying to help someone fix their mistakes that's fair enough, but with enough negativity comes downfall and lack of motivation. People have been complaining for a while about these prices etc, but I feel 'operating at a loss' can conflict with doing something for fun, what you enjoy to kill spare time with.
It's like say, You enjoy cycling, and you decide to help some other people get started on learning how to ride a bike, for a price, but only a very small payment, as you simply enjoy helping others.
I personally disagree with your argument against operating at a loss, I'd rather know I had helped somebody and maybe given them a positive day, than to think about making sure you have enough money.
I also believe there is a fine line between business and a hobby. Your making money to make sure you can operate at a successful rate, which could be a estimated finance, or having a unreliable 'money maker' that you enjoy doing, therefore defeating the whole point of feeling that you are forcefully needed to achieve a salary at the end of it, rather making sure you achieve a sense of satisfaction from the person you was helping willingly.


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## pipkiksass (Apr 9, 2014)

ellwd said:


> Plenty of businesses have burned cash as a route becoming successful later on. Amazon springs to mind.


Amazon operated at a loss because it was started by (among others) a very successful Wall Street banker, who had millions of dollars of his own money to invest. Also, they only operated at a loss because they had significant overheads and startup costs. They were always selling their products at a profit. 


Blurry said:


> It's like say, You enjoy cycling, and you decide to help some other people get started on learning how to ride a bike, for a price, but only a very small payment, as you simply enjoy helping others.


I've taught people to cube; juggle; coached them through A-Levels; helped them complete job applications; completed job applications for them; given running coaching; built computers for people... I could go on. I've never charged for any of these 'services' because I enjoy helping others. I did these things as hobbies.

When you start charging for a service, you move away from the hobbyist realm, and into the business realm. My concern is that Michael is exposing himself to the potential for others to take advantage of his good nature and willingness to help. I've seen several of his threads trolled in the past, and wouldn't like to see this happen here. 


Blurry said:


> I personally disagree with your argument against operating at a loss, I'd rather know I had helped somebody and maybe given them a positive day, than to think about making sure you have enough money.


You are young. In a capitalist society, only people for whom money is not a concern are not concerned about money. I do lots of things for free, but if I were to charge for something I would do so at a rate that I believe is fair and represents the value which I attribute to my time. This isn't because I want to make sure I have enough money, but rather because my time is valuable to me, as yours should be to you and Michael's should be to him. 

You have a finite amount of life to live. As soon as you place a £/$ value on your time you are offering a business service. If this service operates at a loss, then you are giving your time away for a negative amount of money; effectively valuing your personal time at less than nothing. When there is an alternative to this arrangement (i.e. not charging, or charging a sensible amount), and customers are aware of these alternatives but pay an unreasonable price regardless, this is exploitation. 

Michael, if I lived in the US I would send my 5x5 to you for modding. But I would insist on you sending me a breakdown of your costs. I would then send you cash amounting to the total of these costs, plus what I would consider to be a reasonable hourly rate.

Perhaps you could consider a pay what you want pricing strategy as an alternative? Suggest a minimum charge of e.g. $5, but if someone wants to pay you $40, they can.

Good luck in your endeavours.


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## Michael Womack (Apr 9, 2014)

pipkiksass said:


> My concern is that Michael is exposing himself to the potential for others to take advantage of his good nature and willingness to help. I've seen several of his threads trolled in the past, and wouldn't like to see this happen here.



I agree with this and everything else you said pipkiksass. BTW so you'll all are arguing over the price. Just a reminder That this is my service and I decide on the price myself. But if someone wants to pay me more then that's fine. As of right now I have 3 cubes coming my way to be modded. 1 SS 4x4 from someone on FB and 1 SS 4x4+SS 5x5 from Alexwildchild here on the forums.


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## stoic (Apr 9, 2014)

pipkiksass said:


> Amazon operated at a loss because it was started by (among others) a very successful Wall Street banker, who had millions of dollars of his own money to invest. Also, they only operated at a loss because they had significant overheads and startup costs. They were always selling their products at a profit.


That's not my recollection...Amazon took many years to reach profitability, and during that time it was renowned for selling books at a loss to build market share.
Anyway, it's not really about Amazon - I was just giving an example of a legitimate business strategy that might seem counter-intuitive.
I'm also not sure it's strictly about business...Michael isn't making a $ loss here, and it seems to me that someone with a lot of free time is getting paid to do something he enjoys to gain experience while helping others. Personally I'm fine with that.


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## DeeDubb (Apr 9, 2014)

pipkiksass said:


> A good description of the mods would avoid this. If you offer e.g. a Florian mod for a fixed price, and perform the mod, they get what they asked and paid for. If they don't like it, they asked for the wrong thing.
> 
> *Yes, but setting the prices this low would cause any startup business to go bankrupt very quickly.
> *
> Who's doing this? Nobody's dictating, are they? Personally, I suggested Michael shouldn't undersell himself. Hobby or business, I don't believe anyone should operate as a loss. Except for Bugatti - they can afford it.



Do you understand that he's doing it from home (assuming his parents) with no bills or overhead costs? How can he possibly go "bankrupt"? He's not running a fortune 500 company. He's just trying to get a little extra money for doing something really likes to do.


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## pipkiksass (Apr 9, 2014)

DeeDubb said:


> Do you understand that he's doing it from home (assuming his parents) with no bills or overhead costs? How can he possibly go "bankrupt"? He's not running a fortune 500 company. He's just trying to get a little extra money for doing something really likes to do.



Please go back and read my post in context.


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## KongShou (Apr 9, 2014)

Will you mod my cubes for free?


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## DeeDubb (Apr 9, 2014)

pipkiksass said:


> Please go back and read my post in context.



I read the whole thread, and I understand your point. You don't want to see him being underpaid for his work. However, when you compare him to a business, that's when your argument does not make sense, so I was pointing that part out.


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## JianhanC (Apr 9, 2014)

lel why don't you just buy brand new 5x5s and mod them and sell them as modded 5x5s. and send out a couple of samples and get people to advertise for you. if you're good that is.


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## Michael Womack (Apr 9, 2014)

JianhanC said:


> lel why don't you just buy brand new 5x5s and mod them and sell them as modded 5x5s. and send out a couple of samples and get people to advertise for you. if you're good that is.



Cause I don't want to. I'm saving my money up for something else ATM.


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## Michael Womack (May 29, 2014)

I updated the OP cause I made a website for this service.


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## Deleted member 19792 (May 29, 2014)

Sorry, last time I saw your modded Cubes there were too many holes to stick things in... Not interested. Id probably get a bruise because they get stuck and id hurt myself.



By the way good price. he is starting .out and.we dont know if it will be good or not....

This isnt a shengshou elite


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## Michael Womack (May 29, 2014)

strakerak said:


> Sorry, last time I saw your modded Cubes there were too many holes to stick things in... Not interested. Id probably get a bruise because they get stuck and id hurt myself.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Well I've modded a few cube for people here on the forum and they liked it allot For them I did exactly what is listed on my site.


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## kcl (May 29, 2014)

Michael Womack said:


> Well I've modded a few cube for people here on the forum and they liked it allot For them I did exactly what is listed on my site.



Get some testimonials.


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## Michael Womack (Jun 18, 2014)




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## Michael Womack (Sep 1, 2014)

Oh hey Here is a review of one of my mods from my friend Joey Shamash.


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## voidcuber (Sep 8, 2014)

sounds cool


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## Michael Womack (Sep 8, 2014)

voidcuber said:


> sounds cool



Thanks.


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