# color scheme research



## nickvu2 (Apr 4, 2010)

In an effort to get my cubesmith order up to $15 to qualify for free shipping, I got a sheet of nearly every color offered. I've been laying out different combinations and considering untraditional color schemes, for maximized recognition and also for aesthetics. I was looking for color theory research in hopes of identifying the 4 (sides only) or 6 (whole cube) most contrasting colors. 

It turns out that there is a field of study know as opponent process theory that is a part of color psychology. Conveniently there are 6 base colors. One could argue that these are the most distinct/contrasting colors based on the biology of the human eye. 

The contrast might then be exaggerated if you start playing with brightness, reflectiveness, etc.

I'd like to hear you thoughts, as well as about experiences with alternative color schemes.



Spoiler


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## Dene (Apr 4, 2010)

The big problem with white is that it doesn't necessarily stick out so much. It kind of disappears more. I think this is because we are used to seeing white as a natural background colour. Just think about how many things in the world use white as the background colour.

I think without a doubt bright colours are going to stick out more. However another thing to bear in mind is that you don't want any colour to be too overwhelming. It might be very hard to find the "perfect" balance...


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## DT546 (Apr 4, 2010)

that scheme seems pretty good, however, the green and blue look kinda similar, all the other colors are distinct and stand out, but the blue and green might merge slightly like the red and orange on a diansheng


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## AndyK (Apr 4, 2010)

Interesting stuff. I think you would have to consider the color of the cube itself too, thus it would be nice to see what they think the 7th most contrasting color is in that set.


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## Innocence (Apr 4, 2010)

I'm maybe considering switching to such a colour scheme, because it sounds like fun! Also, it'll give me an excuse to start over, and become colour neutral. I'll wait for more research to be done, though.


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## jaap (Apr 4, 2010)

You probably also want the colours to still look different even under yellowish indoor lighting. In that respect the traditional differ-by-yellow scheme is quite good.


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## crazymanjimbo46 (Apr 4, 2010)

I experimented with red opposite yellow, orange-white and blue-green. It gave me great times, but I'm pretty sure it was just the cube.


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## AndyK (Apr 4, 2010)

Woohoo, it's Jaap Scherphuis! Nice to see you on the forums


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## Cride5 (Apr 4, 2010)

Interesting post!

Here is an example of a cube with the colours defined in the color opponency at opposite ends.





... and with a random scramble:





There are a couple problems. The first one is in using black and white when the cube plastic is also black or white. It means that one group of stickers almost appears as a 'non-sticker' because there's no contrast with the rest of the cube.

The second problem is that it is advantageous to have similar colours opposite each other, and adjacent colours contrasting. This helps a lot in recognition of PLLs or COLLs using 'hyperorientations' or blocks or pieces with opposite colours.

Using these ideas it could be changed to the following:





... and with a random scramble:





I think the criteria for cube colours are slightly more complex than simply contrast between opposite colours. Contrast between adjacent colours is probably more important, while it is desirable for 'similarity' of opposite colours. While contrast among stickers is important, attention should also be made to contrast with the cube plastic colour. It would certainly be interesting to see some experimental research on alternative colour schemes.



EDIT: Here are some examples based on maximising separation in hue value, while maintaining brightness for contrast with the black cube plastic.





Hue evenly divided into 6





Hue evenly divided into 5 + white (starting at red)





Hue evenly divided into 5 + white (starting at orange)

None of them seem as good as the original colour scheme though. Probably because hue value in the HSV colour model is purley based on colour frequency, rather than the response of our eyes to these colours.


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## Pedro (Apr 4, 2010)

Agreed with the ones who mentioned that green and blue are too similar on your first one.

I think standard color scheme is good enough. Some people use bright orange or green or blue, but I don't think that's a must.

You can get fast no matter what color scheme you use, it's just a matter of getting used (Sarah has an awkward one).


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## Cride5 (Apr 4, 2010)

Yeah, for me this cube:




had the best combination of contrast of adjacent colours, contrast with the cube and 'similarity' of opposite colours. But I would agree that the green/blue combination are too similar. I like the idea of removing yellow to allow for a brighter orange though, and replacing it with grey. I might try out a cube with this scheme. If I tweak the cube above to make green slightly lighter and the blue slightly darker then it looks like this:





The equivalent cubesmith stickers would be:
http://cubesmith.com/3x3 white.jpg
http://cubesmith.com/3x3 Grey.jpg
http://cubesmith.com/3x3 red.jpg
http://cubesmith.com/3x3x3brightorange.JPG
http://cubesmith.com/3x3 blue.jpg
http://cubesmith.com/3x3 light green.jpg

Switching to a white cube would be as simple as swapping white for black, as all the rest look like they contrast pretty well with a white background.


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## AndyK (Apr 4, 2010)

Uh oh, this gives me an excuse to buy a whole bunch of the same cube... I have a feeling I will be buying a bunch of F-IIs and testing out a lot of these different color schemes, they look so cool.

Has anyone found a place to special order specific colored stickers? Actually wait, that might be taking things too far.


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## jms_gears1 (Apr 4, 2010)

AndyK said:


> Uh oh, this gives me an excuse to buy a whole bunch of the same cube... I have a feeling I will be buying a bunch of F-IIs and testing out a lot of these different color schemes, they look so cool.
> 
> Has anyone found a place to *special order specific colored stickers*? Actually wait, that might be taking things too far.



honestly what colors do you need that cubesmith does not offer lol.


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## Cride5 (Apr 4, 2010)

Just ordered some cubesmith stickers for the grey/white + bright orange/green colour scheme. Will upload photos when they arrive...


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## Sa967St (Apr 4, 2010)

Cride5 said:


> Hue evenly divided into 6



That looks so nice! 
The next time I'm ordering stickers I definitely want to try that colour scheme out. 



Pedro said:


> You can get fast no matter what color scheme you use, it's just a matter of getting used (Sarah has an awkward one).


Replacing orange with yellow is really easy to get used to imo. It took me literally 5 solves to get used to it. It took a bit longer (~50 solves?) to get used to the purple though.


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## jms_gears1 (Apr 4, 2010)

Sa967St said:


> Cride5 said:
> 
> 
> > Hue evenly divided into 6
> ...


I would love to try out that color scheme. 0.0


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## Pedro (Apr 4, 2010)

Cride5 said:


> Yeah, for me this cube:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Do you really like the white/grey contrast? It may be my computer screen, but they look too close to me...

Also, that doesn't look like red to me. At least not the red I have on my cubes. I'd say that one is http://www.cubesmith.com/3x3 fuschia.jpg (it's not that light as it may look from the picture...)

Let me see if I can find a picture of a "girl cube" I made once (not for me, for my ex-gf)

http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/4626/dsc00140ahc.jpg
http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/2142/dsc00139iik.jpg
http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/9997/dsc00138p.jpg
http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/1881/dsc00137mhu.jpg

Yeah, the fuschia is actually light...maybe purple would be a better fit for your image.

On a side note: At our last competition, there was this girl with a pink-plastic cube and every stickers was a shade of pink...seriously, it was scary...lol
I'll see if I can get any pics


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## Cride5 (Apr 4, 2010)

Cride5 said:


> Pedro said:
> 
> 
> >
> ...



If you convert the cube to greyscale the contrast between the grey/white side, is about the same as the greyscale contrast between the other opposite colours. I guess if it's not enough it's always possible to use a darker grey. I don't think it would be necessary to go all the way to black to achieve good enough contrast with white. I actually ordered two shades of grey from cubesmith to compare. Will post images for you..

Just as an example, here is a cube with a darker grey:


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## CubeDust (Apr 4, 2010)

wow, that's really interest me..
I think that the Japanese color scheme is a little bit better, because of the adjacent colors recognition.


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## Pedro (Apr 4, 2010)

CubeDust said:


> wow, that's really interest me..
> I think that the Japanese color scheme is a little bit better, because of the adjacent colors recognition.



I don't understand how they can use blue/green and white/yellow edges


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## gpt_kibutz (Apr 4, 2010)

I did not like the red/green combination because they look similar to each other (could be due to my color blindness or my monitor though). However the yellow/blue looks really nice to me


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## Forte (Apr 4, 2010)

Ooooh Conrad you've found something interesting for me to do 

And recognition is just a matter of getting used to. I can't do CLL on anyone else's 2x2 now LOL


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## Cride5 (Apr 4, 2010)

luisgepeto said:


> I did not like the red/green combination because they look similar to each other (could be due to my color blindness or my monitor though). However the yellow/blue looks really nice to me



This idea of opposing colours may potentially work well for dealing with colour-blind cubers. I'm no expert on this, but I believe that biological theory has it that there are three light sensing capabilities in the eye. One which differentiates between green and red, one which separates blue and yellow, and a third one which determines brightness or intensity. Colour blindness I think usually involves a deficiency in ability to differentiate in one of the two colour differentiating cell types. So it is either difficult to differentiate red/green or blue/yellow. Based on this, either of these schemes may be useful to colour blind cubers:










Both of these cubes use the one remaining colour range, and variance in colour intensity to achieve 6 different shades, so should (in theory) allow a colour-blind eye to differentiate between them..

@luisgepeto do either of these look any good to you?


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## Cyrus C. (Apr 4, 2010)

I liked the first one Cride showed, perhaps I will switch.


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## TEGTaylor (Apr 4, 2010)

I use white opposite neon yellow, orange opposite fuchsia, and neon green opposite purple. The only problems I've had with that is the white and yellow can look the same. I will definitely experiment with some of the proposed ideas, like white opposite gray or black....


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## Zubon (Apr 4, 2010)

I like the fact that opposite colors are of "similar" types. Red opposite bright orange, blue opposite bright green.
I have black opposite white. Black instead of yellow gives me more distinct colors which I have found to be good for me.


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## Radu (Apr 4, 2010)

I'm impressed. This is exactly what I have studied last week and what I was thinking about. The best color scheme I came out with, without changing the classic one is VERY similar to the one showed on wikipedia. I came to the conclusion that the best would be:

U - Yellow
F - Bright Red
L - Bright Blue
R - Bright Green
D - White
B - Black (black on black is not illegal  )

So basically just substitute the orange with black.

White-black are opposite
Red-green are opposite 
Blue - yellow almost (the opposite of yellow is purple), but I guess bright blue is ok too.

Oh, and don't place the opposite colors on opposite faces! Place the on adjacent ones. It makes the contrast more easy to recognize. My future cube will use this color scheme.


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## gpt_kibutz (Apr 4, 2010)

Cride5 said:


> Both of these cubes use the one remaining colour range, and variance in colour intensity to achieve 6 different shades, so should (in theory) allow a colour-blind eye to differentiate between them..
> 
> @luisgepeto do either of these look any good to you?


Yeah, I prefer the first one. I think Are you using gray instead of black to contrast white? I may prefer black actually, but I do not think that is a huge problem to people. But I may actually try this color scheme, too bad that cubesmith selection is rather small.


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## qqwref (Apr 4, 2010)

Does this color scheme make sense? It's a (possibly) optimized variant of the Japanese one, which seems to me to be really good for non-CN solving since one side (bottom/top) is much lighter than the rest and the other is much darker.

I think having two green values makes a lot of sense, actually, since green is much more visible to our eyes than most other colors. But any two similar values on the cube ought to have one light and one dark (here red/orange and green/green).


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## Sa967St (Apr 4, 2010)

Does this colour scheme make sense? It's what I use


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## (X) (Apr 4, 2010)

qqwref said:


> Does this color scheme make sense? It's a (possibly) optimized variant of the Japanese one, which seems to me to be really good for non-CN solving since one side (bottom/top) is much lighter than the rest and the other is much darker.
> 
> I think having two green values makes a lot of sense, actually, since green is much more visible to our eyes than most other colors. But any two similar values on the cube ought to have one light and one dark (here red/orange and green/green).



Yellow and yellow is too similar...


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## Luigimamo (Apr 5, 2010)

(X) said:


> qqwref said:
> 
> 
> > Does this color scheme make sense? It's a (possibly) optimized variant of the Japanese one, which seems to me to be really good for non-CN solving since one side (bottom/top) is much lighter than the rest and the other is much darker.
> ...


totally


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## Cride5 (Apr 5, 2010)

I'm just looking at these schemes on a different computer screen, and its amazing how different they look. This *red* from the original set of cubes looks closer to pink/purple than red from this screen.



Sa967St said:


> Does this colour scheme make sense? It's what I use



Yup it looks pretty nice. All the colours seem to contrast quite well. I think the only thing that would confuse me is white/purple not being 'similar' for PLL/COLL/ZBLL recognition, but it would only have an effect if I were fully colour neutral - which I'm not 

I think I'm going to try out this kind of scheme, but with grey instead of purple. Grey on white ftw


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## radmin (Apr 5, 2010)

Dene said:


> The big problem with white is that it doesn't necessarily stick out so much. It kind of disappears more. I think this is because we are used to seeing white as a natural background colour. Just think about how many things in the world use white as the background colour.
> 
> I think without a doubt bright colours are going to stick out more. However another thing to bear in mind is that you don't want any colour to be too overwhelming. It might be very hard to find the "perfect" balance...




The full bright scheme helped my recognition a lot. 

The theory that white "disappears" is interesting. Shiny Black really pops making my cross and f2l faster. If you combine that with white opposite it might get even faster. (You want to ignore the color opposite the cross). I will be trying that.

In the middle layers I personally find red green then orange blue make sense to me. The complimentary order made it easier to learn the color scheme


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## Sa967St (Apr 5, 2010)

I tried this colour scheme on hi-games and I like it


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## nickvu2 (Apr 6, 2010)

Cride5 said:


> This idea of opposing colours may potentially work well for dealing with colour-blind cubers. I'm no expert on this, but I believe that biological theory has it that there are three light sensing capabilities in the eye. One which differentiates between green and red, one which separates blue and yellow, and a third one which determines brightness or intensity. Colour blindness I think usually involves a deficiency in ability to differentiate in one of the two colour differentiating cell types. So it is either difficult to differentiate red/green or blue/yellow. Based on this, either of these schemes may be useful to colour blind cubers:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Wow, this is such an elegant solution, Cride! And from what I've read, you're right on with the biological description of color blindness.

Here's a crazy idea, what if there existed a color eye exam for cubers. Kind of like how eye doctors test your vision with a battery of exercises, this will help you select your individualized cube color scheme. For example, it may show you a blue color tile and place a couple hues of red on either side. It would ask which of the two reddish tiles looks more similar to the blue, and eliminate that tile since it is a weaker match, i.e. less distinct. 

It could also use Ishihara color tests, or the like, to find out what color combinations offer the best contrast. 





The system would learn how you see color, account for any deficiencies, accommodate for aesthetic preferences, and identify where each color should go on the cube. Any grad students out there looking for a thesis topic?  


Anyway, I've stickered some cubes base on the comments here. Could someone tell me how to insert thumbnail images that can click through to full size. I've seen it done! ...if nothing else I suppose I can resize.


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## Cride5 (Apr 6, 2010)

nickvu2 said:


> Here's a crazy idea, what if there existed a color eye exam for cubers. Kind of like how eye doctors test your vision with a battery of exercises, this will help you select your individualized cube color scheme. For example, it may show you a blue color tile and place a couple hues of red on either side. It would ask which of the two reddish tiles looks more similar to the blue, and eliminate that tile since it is a weaker match, i.e. less distinct.
> 
> It could also use Ishihara color tests, or the like, to find out what color combinations offer the best contrast.
> 
> ...



Sounds like a great idea. Cubers are constantly searching for new ways to gain the upper hand: modding/lubing cubes, optimising methods/fingertricks, and with something like this - optimising recognition speed ... maybe we could get cubesmith to fund the research 




nickvu2 said:


> Anyway, I've stickered some cubes base on the comments here. Could someone tell me how to insert thumbnail images that can click through to full size. I've seen it done! ...if nothing else I suppose I can resize.



When you click on reply, go into advanced mode and down below, under "Additional Options" there is a box for attaching files with a button "Manage Attachments". Use that to upload your images and they will appear as a thumbnail. I don't really use that myself because the upload quota is so small. I find dropbox better.


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## qqwref (Apr 6, 2010)

Better: upload to an image service like imageshack or photobucket. Once you have uploaded an image, they will give you the forum code for linking to the image, displaying the image, displaying a thumbnail with a link to the full image, and so on.


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## Pedro (Apr 6, 2010)

Sa967St said:


> I tried this colour scheme on hi-games and I like it



The yellow on your video looks much more like orange than yellow 

I also don't like the red/purple edge on your cube (or at least the picture, never saw your actual cube)

I found the pink cube I mentioned before: http://www.cinoto.com.br/website/images/stories/cubos/cubo13b.jpg

Now that is the ultimate color scheme!

EDIT

I had to do a video with this color scheme:





First few solves were like 40+. But I suck at computer cubes anyway...best avg12 on jfly's is like 17


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## nickvu2 (Apr 7, 2010)

Haha, I accidentally just posted this in another thread I was reading! Probably confused the hell out of those 5x5 edge pairing kids...don't worry, I deleted it.

Well, I seem to have miss placed my camera (just one of those days) where there are more photos, but I managed to uploaded these last night.

This whole thing started when I got cubes for my roommates' birthdays and let them pick out the colors that they wanted. None of them are cubers so they were just choosing fun color combinations. Here is one of the three:







This is aqua, white, dark grey, copper, orange and florescent pink (which for some reason looks purplish on the left). The color scheme will hence forth be known as _Fall of '85_; that's what Kelly named her cube 

Then here is the pallet I was working with, selecting colors based on opponent process theory in combination with your suggestions.




Starting from the left and going down each column we have chrome, silver, white, blue, light blue, bright blue, florescent green, agua, red, florescent pink, fuchsia, florescent yellow, yellow, bright orange, dark grey, and black.

So I have two more roomie cubes to show, as well as two experimental speed cubes. The camera has got to be around here somewhere...


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## megaminxwin (Apr 7, 2010)

nickvu2 said:


> This whole thing started when I got cubes for my roommates' birthdays and let them pick out the colors that they wanted. None of them are cubers so they were just choosing fun color combinations. Here is one of the three:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
LOOKS BRILLIANT.

(nights)


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## Cride5 (Apr 7, 2010)

nickvu2 said:


> Then here is the pallet I was working with, selecting colors based on opponent process theory in combination with your suggestions.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I would go for:





.. but maybe a lighter grey and darker yellow (not orange though).


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## Pedro (Apr 7, 2010)

nickvu2 said:


> Then here is the pallet I was working with, selecting colors based on opponent process theory in combination with your suggestions.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Is it just me or the 2 last ones look the same? That yellow also looks kinda weird (probably camera messing up)


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## nickvu2 (Apr 8, 2010)

...there you are camera!

Skip's cube is known as _Urban Expansion_. Sorry about the shadows.







Aqua, light green, blue, tan, red and fuchsia.

And now for the experimental speedcubing color schemes. I'll give you my impressions, and would love to hear feedback.








_Tyco_ consists of black, silver, blue, florescent green, yellow and red on a white cube.








_Opulent Temple_ consists of dark grey, white, florescent yellow, florescent pink, bright blue and florescent green on a black cube.

When selecting sticker colors, I was also considering the field color (ie cube color). For example, florescent yellow looks really nice against black but terrible against white. And blue on black seems to look darker than blue on white.

Red opposite yellow: Even though I'm still adapting to the change, I'm loving it! There is more contrast than my usual florescent orange and red. And I just really like the aesthetic. 

_Tyco_: I'm fairly new 2-sided color neutrality, and having a hard time disassociating white from bottom. So black and silver are working very nicely since there is no definite top/bottom association with these colors. Originally, the plan was to use bright blue and fuchsia, but I already had a half-bright color scheme on the cube so decided to try out blue and red for now. The blue and black are kind of similar, but I like how opposite sides have a lighter color and darker color. It makes for a very nice balance. My only complaint is that florescent green next to yellow is ugly.

_Opulent Temple_: It's so beautiful; and I can only describe the charcoal next to florescent as sexy! The pictures don't do it justice. Whereas Tyco had a balance of light/dark sides, O.T. is mostly all bright. This really causes the dark grey side to all but disappear. It is all fine and dandy if you're solving grey on bottom, but it's like I'm searching for the inverse of LL patterns when solving white down. However with white on top, O.T. is superb. The side colors stand out nicely, while not overpowering the white LL pattern. I imagine it would work well for COLL. A lighter grey would likely work better for color neutrality, but still wouldn't match the brightness of the rest of the cube.

Conclusion: I like the direction that this is going. I'm more or less sold on the new color scheme, even if the exact hues and shades still need some tweaking.


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## AndyK (Apr 8, 2010)

nickvu2 said:


> Tyco consists of black, silver, blue, florescent green, yellow and red on a white cube.




Wow! Those look great. I am definitely trying Tyco out because it is closest to the colors of the Opponent Process Theory. I have a suggestion though, I think you should name Tyco "OPP" instead after the first three letters in *Opp*onent. This will really make it catch on because we can all say "you down with OPP??" 






Also, it would go with your Opulent Temple name, since the OP in that could be the first two of *Op*ponent or the first letter of *O*pponent and *P*rocess.

Good stuff


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## qqwref (Apr 8, 2010)

How about this? I'm having a hard time getting the orange and yellow-green right (they should be relatively bright, and distinct). This cube is based around the opponent process thing and designed for Fridrich or Roux (or really any method where two opposite colors should be distinct from the other four). The idea is that the four non-U/D colors can be formed from adding one of each set of opposite hues (red+yellow, green+yellow, red+blue, green+blue) and the other two colors should be far lighter and far darker than the rest. The U/D colors should probably be clearly distinct from each other as well as clearly distinct from everything else, more so than any other colors.


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## CubeDust (Apr 8, 2010)

wow, I'm just waiting for the right color scheme to be posted so I could buy it!

im thinking about Oplunet.. should I buy it?


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## Rune (Apr 8, 2010)

CubeDust said:


> wow, I'm just waiting for the right color scheme to be posted so I could buy it!
> 
> im thinking about Oplunet.. should I buy it?


YOUR right color scheme?


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## Sa967St (Apr 8, 2010)

nickvu2 said:


> Then here is the pallet I was working with, selecting colors based on opponent process theory in combination with your suggestions.



something is missing...

purple ):


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## CubeDust (Apr 8, 2010)

Rune said:


> CubeDust said:
> 
> 
> > wow, I'm just waiting for the right color scheme to be posted so I could buy it!
> ...



i want a cool color scheme that maybe better for me..
I'm using a black cube, and CFOP user. 
my "optimal" color scheme will be very-fast recognition able and it will be very close to the regular scheme. 
any suggestions?


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## Cride5 (Apr 8, 2010)

nickvu2 said:


> _Tyco_ consists of black, silver, blue, florescent green, yellow and red on a white cube.



I like 

Nice work!


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## miniGOINGS (Apr 8, 2010)

Thanks to Gears, I really wanted to look at replacing yellow with black. Now I'm REALLY interested.


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## nickvu2 (Apr 9, 2010)

Sa967St said:


> nickvu2 said:
> 
> 
> > Then here is the pallet I was working with, selecting colors based on opponent process theory in combination with your suggestions.
> ...



Sorry Sarah, should have added a purple column for you 








AndyK said:


> I have a suggestion though, I think you should name Tyco "OPP" instead after the first three letters in Opponent. This will really make it catch on because we can all say "you down with OPP??"


Haha, it's been too long while since I've heard that song! Still playing around with names for the general color scheme. Tyco and Opulent Temple are more like variations on a grander theme. (And I had never named my cubes before, but was inspired by their new _colorful _personalities.)




CubeDust said:


> Rune said:
> 
> 
> > CubeDust said:
> ...


Dust, you've stumbled upon us slinging around theory here. As far as I know, only two cubes have been stickered based on these ideas. So it's difficult to make any recommendation at all. Not to mention we each will have unique psychological responses to color, so you'll have to figure out your own best hues and tone. Just play around with it, either on a virtual cube or with real stickers, and let us know what you find out. You may have something valuable to contribute to this experiment!


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## Forte (Apr 9, 2010)

Pedro said:


> nickvu2 said:
> 
> 
> > Then here is the pallet I was working with, selecting colors based on opponent process theory in combination with your suggestions.
> ...



Nah, the yellow is actually that odd. It's on my square-1


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## Pedro (Apr 10, 2010)

Forte said:


> Pedro said:
> 
> 
> > nickvu2 said:
> ...



I mean...doesn't look like my yellow (regular cubesmith yellow)


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## miniGOINGS (Apr 10, 2010)

Cause it's fluoro yellow?


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## Dene (Apr 10, 2010)

Of the two (Tyco and Opulent Temple) I have to say I prefer the latter. I think the brighter colours stick out much better. However the blue/dark grey colour that can be seen is a bit dodgy to me; not distinctive enough.


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## Pedro (Apr 10, 2010)

miniGOINGS said:


> Cause it's fluoro yellow?



I mean the regular yellow.


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## miniGOINGS (Apr 10, 2010)

Pedro said:


> I mean the regular yellow.



Oh.


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## Pedro (Apr 10, 2010)

Dene said:


> Of the two (Tyco and Opulent Temple) I have to say I prefer the latter. I think the brighter colours stick out much better. *However the blue/dark grey colour that can be seen is a bit dodgy to me; not distinctive enough.*



Agreed. And that's part of the reason I like the regular color scheme. All edges have distinctive color pairs. (One may complain about yellow/orange, but cubesmith orange is not that yellowish...or just get fluorescent orange)
The other part is, of course, that I'm used to it, after almost 5 years of use


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## Dene (Apr 11, 2010)

Hmm yea. I think that the best solution is to have a brighter blue, green and red, and a darker orange.

EDIT: come to think of it, a brown might work in place of the orange.


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## nickvu2 (Apr 12, 2010)

Maggie finally stickered her cube! The last roomie cube is called Robotsis.








White, silver, light blue, light green, black and light purple

And my third opponent process speedcube is named Johann. Except for the blue side, all the colors pretty closely match the true OP colors. In order to avoid the black on black problems I had with Opulent Temple, I double stickered that side with black over white. I was wanting to mimic the white tic-tac-toe pattern that appears between the stickers of a white cube. To do this, I placed white sticker on the inner edges and corners of that face's cubies. Then I covered the white stickers with black stickers, offsetting them to leave about a mm of white exposed. Granted, it adds unwanted noise to the color scheme...but it looks SO BADASS! And it does help the black side not fade away due to the matching cube color.
























Johann: White, black w/ white detailing, light blue, green, fuchsia, yellow 

I still have a bunch of stickers, but none of the colors I want to be using. So it might be a while until I have more cubes to show.

What did we do with all those old stickers? Turned the dishwasher awesome


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## Dene (Apr 12, 2010)

I don't think Johann is competition legal.



WCA regs said:


> 3d)	The colours of puzzles must be solid, the same per colour, and clearly distinct from other colours.


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## nickvu2 (Apr 12, 2010)

Dene said:


> I don't think Johann is competition legal.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That's so sad that Johann is illegitimate. 
Thanks for letting me know though.


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## CubeDust (Apr 14, 2010)

i think that the full bright set is the best i need.. thanks anyway!


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## Pedro (Apr 14, 2010)

If you remove the white stripes, it's legal, though.

That one looks cool, opposite colors are quite distinct and none of the adjacent look close (except maybe for white/yellow, which I still don't like...)


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## Cride5 (Apr 16, 2010)

My stickers arrived today, yay 


And here are the results...









Cubesmith colours used: Grey, White, Blue, Bright Green, Red, Bright Orange

Overall, very happy with it. Great differentiation between all opposites and adjacent colours. Maintains mostly the same colours as before, just with different intensities. The grey is going to take a bit of getting used to, but it seems to make sense to have it opposite white.


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## nickvu2 (Apr 16, 2010)

Wow, that looks fantastic! Grey against white looks really good, and overall there's a great balance between light and dark. 

Can you tell me about your choice to use bright orange instead of yellow or florescent yellow? Were you wanting to stay close to the original color scheme? I must admit though that your bright orange stands out a lot better that orange or florescent orange.

I was worried about grey/blue, but it looks like it could work. Are they distinct enough for you?

Well done Chride! Oh, and are you going to name it


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## Dene (Apr 16, 2010)

I think it looks nice, but I fear that the blue and grey are too easy to mix up while solving.


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## Cride5 (Apr 16, 2010)

Yeah, I chose bright orange rather than yellow to keep recognition of the red/orange sides the same as before. I guess if I was just starting out cubing I would probably go for yellow for maximum contrast, but with the original scheme engrained into my head, using yellow opposite red would probably cause too much confusion.

The grey seems to work fine against blue because the blue is just so much darker. This is why I tried to avoid using a dark grey or black. You can see the contrast if you look at the back of the U-face on the scrambled cube. The grey never gets confused with white, and if anything it could possibly do with a _slightly_ lighter grey to make it appear less like a 'non-colour'. I did try Cubesmith's light grey stickers but they are too close to white.

As for a name for the scheme, I guess I would call it 'granite'


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## Cride5 (Apr 16, 2010)

I've been using the new colour scheme for a bit, and I've just noticed something about the way I process light/dark information, and the role it plays in my solve.

When searching for bad edges during EO inspection the first trigger I get for a bad edge is either red/orange (so a warm colour) or white/yellow (a bright colour). Similarly for OLL, the first thing I seem to process is the brightness of the sticker, so instead of seeing yellow (on the original schme) I just see the direction the brightest stickers are facing in. With the new scheme these differences in brightness from the original scheme seem to be affecting my recognition. For example on OLL I seem to be seeing the bright greens and oranges before recognising the pattern on the grey stickers.

Because of this, I'm now thinking that the ideal colour scheme would use similar brightness levels for opposite faces, and maximise the contrast in brightness of adjacent faces. So something like this:




.... using opponent colours





..... and with the more traditional 'add yellow' scheme.

So I guess a general point for discussion is how brightness of stickers is used in recognition, and how brightness should be mixed with the colours in the scheme. Opinions?


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## Pedro (Apr 16, 2010)

I don't like that yellow/orange edge in the 2nd cube...

I never thought about brightness for recognizing OLL, but I did use it for EO (I don't do EO anymore). So I would get confused with the gray, I guess, when doing EO, because orange would maybe stick out more.

But I guess it's all a matter of getting used...I once stickered a cube with japanese color scheme (cube4you stickers, I think, which suck...ugly color). Got to a 17.xx average in a short time (I usually average mid-12 now, but was more like mid-13 back then). Given more time, I could probably average 15 with it.


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## AngeL (Apr 17, 2010)

Hey, sorry, I'm pretty new to this whole thing, but is there a program or something I can use to make those cube pictures you guys are posting, or do I need to just photoshop one you guys already put up?


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## AndyK (Apr 17, 2010)

They are using Conrad's VisualCube script, you can find it here: http://cube.crider.co.uk/visualcube.php

It is pretty easy to use and is also pretty incredible


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## Cride5 (Apr 17, 2010)

http://cube.crider.co.uk/visualcube.php 

EDIT: Damn, ninja'd!


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## AndyK (Apr 17, 2010)

The KungFooManchu strikes again!


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## AngeL (Apr 17, 2010)

Wow, that's a really cool tool, lol. Here's a scheme I'm thinking about ordering to put on my new F-II, wanted to get a couple of opinions.











There doesn't seem to be too much confusion in the colors, and I kinda like the overall scheme.


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## qqwref (Apr 17, 2010)

The blue and purple look very similar to me, but maybe that's just me.

Also, a lot of these 'optimal' schemes seem to be pretty dark. Maybe it's just because of computer colors, but I tend to have an easier time distinguishing lighter colors than darker ones (if the hue difference is the same in both cases), so for me a relatively dark color scheme would never be optimal.


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## Mastersonian (Apr 17, 2010)

I agree with qqwerf, my only dark color is red, the rest of my colors are just standard cubesmith stickers, but I replace the blue with light blue and green with light green.


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## AngeL (Apr 17, 2010)

Ooh, after some more playing around, I think I've settled on what I'm putting on my next cube:












It taps into basically the same scheme as the original, just with alterations to the hue. My only real worry is that the grey might get lost, but I could try a lighter shade, I guess.

White = Gray
Yellow = Gold
Orange = Fuschia
Red = Purple
Blue = Light Blue
Green = Green


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## nickvu2 (Apr 19, 2010)

Cride5 said:


> So I guess a general point for discussion is how brightness of stickers is used in recognition, and how brightness should be mixed with the colours in the scheme. Opinions?



This is a great observation/question! Before messing around with OP, I was using the half-bright color scheme. I really like the darker blue and red opposite lighter orange and green. The side colors seemed a lot more distinct than the traditional color scheme, which helped a lot with F2L. Then the bright yellow popped out for OLL recognition.

I knew there was a problem with my OP cubes when it came to OLL with black or grey on top, you you might have nailed the solution! For my style of cubing (2-side color neutral CFOP) top and bottom need to be the brightest colors. And possibly have darker/lighter shades on the sides, similar to the half-bright scheme. (Sounds like EO will have slightly different color/contrast requirements.)

I'll play around with that cube modeling script and report back.

PS: Reflectivity could be another factor, but I have difficulty with them since the appear to change brightness depending on the angle of the light source. Others may fare better though.


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## riffz (Apr 20, 2010)

AngeL said:


> Ooh, after some more playing around, I think I've settled on what I'm putting on my next cube:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I'm not sure how good it would be for speedsolving, but that scheme looks really awesome!


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## Innocence (Apr 21, 2010)

Cride, if you were to make any changes to that colour scheme of yours, what would they be?

I like the colour scheme very much, and am considering buying some stickers of those colours. Just don't want to waste any money.


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## Cride5 (Apr 21, 2010)

Innocence said:


> Cride, if you were to make any changes to that colour scheme of yours, what would they be?
> 
> I like the colour scheme very much, and am considering buying some stickers of those colours. Just don't want to waste any money.



I think if I was a colour neutral CFOP user I would probably use that exact scheme, because it keeps the 'similar' association of opposite colours the same, while maximising contrast between them.

As a ZZ user though, I think its better to have darker stickers on F, B, R and L, with lighter stickers for U and D, so I would probably go for something like the standard scheme, but with a lighter yellow, and possibly darker blue/greens and a mid-range red/orange. Cubesmith don't really do a 'dark' green, or a lighter red though. The standard scheme on my CII is pretty good though. The only thing I would change on it is to maybe make the yellow a bit lighter.

It was an interesting point which nickvu2 brought up about reflectivity. Standard vinyl stickers are fairly reflective, which means their brightness is likely to vary quite a bit in different lighting conditions. I was using a standard textured set of stickers on my main type-C1.5 speedcube for a while and it was pretty good, so it might be worth experimenting with them.


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## Dene (Apr 22, 2010)

Innocence said:


> Just don't want to waste any money.



What, like $2 or $3?


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## Faz (Apr 22, 2010)

I need that opulent temple.


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## Innocence (Apr 22, 2010)

Dene said:


> Innocence said:
> 
> 
> > Just don't want to waste any money.
> ...



No, more like $10.

So, no colour scheme switch then? I'm switching to ZZ, which is bad timing.  I wonder if there is a better colour scheme though.


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## Cride5 (Apr 22, 2010)

Innocence said:


> So, no colour scheme switch then? I'm switching to ZZ, which is bad timing.  I wonder if there is a better colour scheme though.



Not for the moment, but I will keep an eye out for better sticker sets, possibly with darker blues/greens and a brighter red which maintains good contrast with orange. This would work well for EO because its really the red/orange and white/yellow that I'm interested in, while blue/green is still used in detection it is better if it blends into the background as a 'non-colour'. Similarly, during F2L lookahead, there as a lot of scanning of the L and R sides for red and orange, as it often determines which F2L edges you're looking at.

Anyway, have fun with ZZ ... and do persevere with the EOLine


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## eastamazonantidote (Sep 7, 2010)

Bumping because I feel like it

I've been playing around with the opponent colors and I think I can post some results. I decided to be a purist and go with black and white on one cube, but that meant the cube had to be white (I'm used to white on white but no black on black). I set up a FI a week ago and have been toying around with it. Even at the very beginning, recognition was amazing. Red and green, blue and yellow, and white and black contrast very well with each other. I think the secret is the dark/light contrast, not just the colors.

Images below. Had to spoil because my camera's resolution is too &#$%ing high.


Spoiler














Light v. Dark works well. A lighter yellow and a darker blue (and a lighter green and a darker red) might help with recognition even more. Right now I have it set up so that blue and green could be mistaken for each other.

Another plus to the scheme is that now I am color neutral (well, on this cube). I could always solve white/yellow, but now yellow is not opposite to white. I started off just black/white, blue/yellow. After a while I decided I would just go for it and learn red/green. Maybe the most surprising thing about this color scheme is the speed at which it's catching up to the standard: I average sub-20 on regular and 24-25 on this.


So opponent colors really do work. The big question: should opponent colors be adjacent to each other? For example, you have white/black on U/D. On R you have a really dark green. On L you have a really light green, thus taking into effect your eye's natural darkness sensor. On F you have a really dark red and on B you have a really light red. All faces are clearly distinguishable from their opposites because of the darkness, and they are easily distinguishable from their adjacent faces because they are opponent colors.


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## Mewrius (Sep 7, 2010)

After toying around a bit here's something I have come up with and am thinking about using











any thoughts?


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## Sa967St (Sep 7, 2010)

Mewrius said:


> After toying around a bit here's something I have come up with and am thinking about using
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Two blues and a purple would be confusing.


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## Carson (Sep 7, 2010)

Sa967St said:


> Mewrius said:
> 
> 
> > After toying around a bit here's something I have come up with and am thinking about using
> ...


I agree, however... if the teal color were to lean more toward green than blue, and the purple were brighter, it may be ok.


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## Whyusosrs? (Sep 7, 2010)

I just bought about 20 bucks in stickers from cube smith. Totally going to try out that opulent color scheme posted a few pages back.


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## nickvu2 (Sep 8, 2010)

@eastamazonantidote: Why have I not considered using a white cube!? I was having the same problem with black on black, but I have no problem with white on white. Hopefully I can do some stickering tomorrow and try it out.

My latest OP (opponent process) trial used cubesmith's half bright set. I really liked the contrast in brightness. But the big problem was trying to find an alternative to black stickers on my black cube, so I haven't been using it. 

Earlier Cride suggested blue opposite green and red opposite yellow. His explanation was something like, blue/green are similar and red/yellow are similar so we would recognize these pairs as more distinct if they are opposite as opposed to adjacent. Not to mention that it's closer to the traditional color scheme. But it sounds like your setup is working well for you. Do you have any thoughts on this? It would be interesting to play with the placement of light/dark colors as well; adjacent darks vs. opposite darks.


@Mewrius: I like to squint at the cube and see if any colors blend together (difficult to distinguish). My goal is to have as little blending as possible. For me, your grey and purple look similar, as well as orange and yellow. I personally have less of a problem with blue and aqua base on my squinty test X)


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## Whyusosrs? (Sep 12, 2010)

I really wish cubesmith had a burgundy color.


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## Gavin (Sep 12, 2010)

Mewrius said:


> After toying around a bit here's something I have come up with and am thinking about using
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I could see that scheme being useful if you made the teal, purple and yellow fluorescent. Not the way it is now though.


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## ThumbsxUpx (Sep 12, 2010)

Mewrius said:


> After toying around a bit here's something I have come up with and am thinking about using
> 
> 
> 
> ...


"any thoughts?"

Yep, confusing


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## Andrew Ricci (Sep 12, 2010)

Sa967St said:


> Mewrius said:
> 
> 
> > After toying around a bit here's something I have come up with and am thinking about using
> ...



Maybe if the blue was light/bright and the green was dark...


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## StachuK1992 (Sep 12, 2010)

For a few months, this has been my main scheme. I have to order more pink stickers to replace red on my other cubes, but for jfly and my main cube, I'm loving it.


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## TrollingHard (Sep 12, 2010)

Purple is too dark to be used efficiently, IMO.


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## Sa967St (Sep 12, 2010)

TrollingHard said:


> Purple is too dark to be used efficiently, IMO.



orly?


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## Thompson (Sep 12, 2010)

I've tried out many shades of colours. I staryed off with the cubesmith standard set. I hated how close together the green and blue were so I ordered fluo green from cubesmith. Then I realized that havig only one bright colour was too distracting and I had trouble recognizing the other colours in a solve. I decided to make a big cubesmith order and got many differet shades of colours. There was bright blue, light green, bright orange, fluo colours, black, and lots more. I put different sets on different cubes (all black btw) and decidedto use a cubesmith fluorescent set. The red and orange didn't look too good for me so I used bright orange. I also swapped white with light gray. This is by far the best colour scheme I could find  
btw I can post pictures of my cube or something but I'm on my iPod at the moment


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## Whyusosrs? (Sep 12, 2010)

TrollingHard said:


> Purple is too dark to be used efficiently, IMO.



Wrong.

I like dark colors on sides and white and fluro yellow on top. Makes recognition on f2l and LL so much easier. (assuming you do white cross and yellow cross only)


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## RopedBBQ (Sep 18, 2010)

Here was my idea (made in paint, didnt know what everyone else was using in this thread  

The idea is to make cross + LL easier, while maintaining cubing ability, by making the F2L colors darker. 

For Solvers that use G/B for cross/LL:







For Solvers that use Y/W(Bl) for cross/LL: 




Optional: Change black w/ white. Probably recommended....


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## Winball (Sep 18, 2010)

I want this. But maybe not with fluorescent.


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