# Cubing generations



## shadowslice e (Jan 1, 2016)

This sort of came as a spin off of the natural talent vs practise thread but I was just wondering what generation would people consider themselves? First? Second? First "revival" generation after the slump in the 1990s-early 2000s? Something altogether different?

I would be interested to hear peoples opinions on the topic.

I'm gonna stick my neck out and and say that we're mostly third/fourth generation: initial early 2000s revival/ the competitive generation after that. (First would be the first cubers- includes people like Rubik himself, petrus and similar, second could be the "lost " generation of the 1990s where cubing seemed to have died down-could include people like Fridirch). Note that your generation does not necessarily reflect your age.

What are other people's thoughts? 

I would also be interested to hear your thoughts on the "fifth" generation and what charicteristics define each generation.


----------



## SenorJuan (Jan 1, 2016)

I'm undoubtably first generation, having started during the big craze in 1980. And for inspiration, there was local schoolboy Nicolas Hammond, who set some early records and made a few TV appearances:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicolas_Hammond


----------



## cmhardw (Jan 1, 2016)

I consider myself second generation. I was in the first generation that learned cubing from online resources rather than having to develop your own system (for 3x3). We still had to develop for big cubes and other puzzles though. I started in 1998, during the end of the "cubing dark ages" where the craze was still dead.

I think each generation uses the knowledge gained by all the previous generations to improve techniques and methods a step further. I think as each generation tries new things, those things that work well lead the people who use them to get really fast. The next generation takes note of that and makes those changes the new standard.

Also, with each improvement in cubing hardware comes a new generation. Once new hardware allows for newer "styles" a new generation is created, I think. This is a neat thing to think about! I think I would actually argue that generational divides in cubing more closely correlate to development of new hardware than any other characteristic.


----------



## DGCubes (Jan 1, 2016)

I see generations of cubing like this:
1st generation: 1980s, like you described
2nd generation: cubing "dark ages", as described by cmhardw
3rd generation: the revival, from around 2003 to 2008. Pretty much when cubing was starting up again and there weren't too many advancements hardware-wise.
4th generation: I'm going to call this the DaYan generation, from 2009 to 2012, when the DaYan cubes got big, there were some okay speedcubes for other events (like SS big cubes, etc.), and cubing was getting faster and more well-known.
5th generation: the explosion; when cubing got WAY bigger, from 2013 to now. It could be characterized by the release of many modern (non-DaYan) speedcubes, cubing YouTubers getting a lot bigger (I remember around the beginning of this time period when 30K or 40K was about the maximum, and look at people like CBC and RedKB now), and many more competitions and new competitors around the world (2013 had 359 competitions and 2015 had 572).

According to this, I'd be part of the 4th generation. I remember very well seeing the first videos of non-DaYan 3x3s (like the ShuangRen and HuanYing) right when they were released, although I was pretty new to cubing at that point. I started in mid-2012, so I'm late 4th gen.


----------



## molarmanful (Jan 1, 2016)

DGCubes said:


> I see generations of cubing like this:
> 1st generation: 1980s, like you described
> 2nd generation: cubing "dark ages", as described by cmhardw
> 3rd generation: the revival, from around 2003 to 2008. Pretty much when cubing was starting up again and there weren't too many advancements hardware-wise.
> ...


The "Moyu generation" probably belongs at the beginning of the 5th generation, because they really were starting to dominate the speedcube market for a bit there.


----------



## Tyler Comfy Hat (Jan 1, 2016)

DGCubes said:


> I see generations of cubing like this:
> [stuff]



Even though I'd consider myself 5th Gen (as I only started getting into speedsolving/ engaging with the community/ going to comps this year), I first learned to solve a cube during the 3rd Gen (around 07-08), when I first became interested in the Rubiks cube and got all my first twisty puzzles. Interesting.

Cool thread.


----------



## mark49152 (Jan 1, 2016)

I'm first generation I guess, having started around 1981-82, although I lost interest for a few decades and came back to it in the 4th generation circa 2012.


----------



## Sajwo (Jan 1, 2016)

DGCubes said:


> I see generations of cubing like this:
> 1st generation: 1980s, like you described
> 2nd generation: cubing "dark ages", as described by cmhardw
> 3rd generation: the revival, from around 2003 to 2008. Pretty much when cubing was starting up again and there weren't too many advancements hardware-wise.
> ...



Mine is better  You consider youtube channels and speedcubes as a major factor, which is quite silly..

1st generation: Before WCA has been created
2nd generation: Erik's generation (2003-2009). Times when Erik ruled all the speedcubing scene. I consider myself this generation, since I started quite a long time ago. 
3rd generation: Feliks generation (2010-2014). When Feliks started setting whole lot of new WR's.
4th generation: Modern cubing (2014-20xy). When a lot of people started getting ridiculously fast (sub8 3x3 averages and sub6 singles).


----------



## shadowslice e (Jan 1, 2016)

Sajwo said:


> Mine is better
> 
> 1st generation: Before WCA has been created
> 2nd generation: Erik's generation (2003-2009). Times when Erik ruled all the speedcubing scene. I consider myself this generation, since I started quite a long time ago.
> ...



I would still say you're missing the "lost" generation after the cubing craze but before the revival/WCA


----------



## Tyler Comfy Hat (Jan 1, 2016)

^Eh, I prefer DGCube's distinctions. Yours is similar, but with the first two gens lumped together.

In my opinion. See sig.


----------



## shadowslice e (Jan 1, 2016)

Hmm... Actually, now I rethink all of this, I can see 3 different ways to classify generations: hardware, cube theory/methods/meta, cubing community size. Though all of them have the same first two generations:


Spoiler: 1) Hardware



1) Cubing craze generation: first basic rubiks cubes, still some other cubes first being made to satiate demands. Other variations are also being made such as other n*n*n and megaminx etc
2) The lost generation/dark ages- not much progress here.
3) Chinese generation: emergence of the dominance of Chinese companies on the cube market.
4) Dayan generation: Now not just the Chinese companies in general, Dayan begins to crush all other competitors.
5) Modern era: Dayan begins to lost it's grip though is still a powerful force. Emergence of Yuxin may be seen as the start of this era.





Spoiler: 2) Cube theory



1) Cubing craze: first basic methods are created to solve the cube. Notable cubers include Singmaster (I apologise if I misspelled that)
2) dark ages: not much happens here and not many new methods created though there are notable exceptions (mostly based around puzzle theory such as Kociemba.
3) the revival: establishment of the WCA and cubing forums lead to new important methods such as ZZ and Roux being created.
4) Modern: Methods become based on more abstract concepts. ZZ could actually be seen as the start of this era.





Spoiler: 3) community size



1) The cubing craze where everyone loves cubing
2) "Lost" generation: where most people seem to go off cubing
3) The revival: where cubing becomes more popular again culminating in the creation of the WCA.
4) Static: community grows slowly and is in a period of stagnation compared to the periods around it.
5) Modern: cubing explodes and many, many more people join.



All of the generations actually line up pretty well and all share the first two generations in common: The cubing craze and the "dark ages"/"lost generation"


----------



## Johnny (Jan 1, 2016)

I started in the late fourth generation, and from here on out I think the cutoff between generations is which brand is dominant

4th generation- Dayan is dominant, Dayan is the only major company that is innovating
end of 4th gen- ShuangRen and HuanYing are released

5th gen- MoYu is dominant (this really began with the release of the WeiLong). MoYu is driving innovation
end of 5th gen- MoYu's monopoly evaporates

6th gen (current)- No brand dominates, there are several brands with large market share (MoYu, YuXin, QiYi). Competition between brands is driving innovation


----------



## Sajwo (Jan 1, 2016)

Johnny said:


> 6th gen (current)- No brand dominates, there are several brands with large market share (MoYu, YuXin, QiYi). Competition between brands is driving innovation



Moyu still dominates... The only thing that has changed is release of the 5x5 Yuxin and 3x3 Thunderclap


----------



## shadowslice e (Jan 1, 2016)

Sajwo said:


> Moyu still dominates... The only thing that has changed is release of the 5x5 Yuxin and 3x3 Thunderclap



Maybe that's the future then.


----------



## Sajwo (Jan 1, 2016)

shadowslice e said:


> Maybe that's the future then.



But that's only maybe  Johnny is not a clairvoyant, so he shouldn't assume such a thing


----------



## Johnny (Jan 1, 2016)

Sajwo said:


> Moyu still dominates... The only thing that has changed is release of the 5x5 Yuxin and 3x3 Thunderclap



I disagree. 3x3 is basically the signature event of cubing and the fact that MoYu isn't dominant there means that something has changed fundamentally.


----------



## Johnny (Jan 1, 2016)

Sajwo said:


> But that's only maybe  Johnny is not a clairvoyant, so he shouldn't assume such a thing



m8, have you seen what they've released lately? The AoLong GT and TangLong are good but they're not innovative at all. The fact that they have 2 other GT cubes coming out tells me that they have run out of good ideas, at least for now. Not to mention the LingPo and TangPo, which have identical mechanisms and are not great (the LingPo was terrible IMO). Like, the Dayan is still the top 2x2. That's insane.


----------



## Sajwo (Jan 1, 2016)

Johnny said:


> I disagree. 3x3 is basically the signature event of cubing and the fact that MoYu isn't dominant there means that something has changed fundamentally.



How can you disagree with a fact? Almost everybody uses Moyu cubes in 3x3, WR holders too. When Dayan was "dominant" also not everybody was using dayan cubes.


----------



## Johnny (Jan 1, 2016)

Sajwo said:


> How can you disagree with a fact? Almost everybody used Moyu cubes in 3x3, WR holders too. When Dayan was "dominant" also not everybody was using dayan cubes.



wr holders =/= everybody

A WR comes down to luck, several people are fast enough to get it


----------



## Sajwo (Jan 1, 2016)

Johnny said:


> wr holders =/= everybody



Why did you related only to this part of my statement?



Johnny said:


> A WR comes down to luck



I think I can stop a discussion with you at this point.


----------



## Johnny (Jan 1, 2016)

Sajwo said:


> Why did you related only to this part of my statement?
> 
> 
> 
> I think I can stop a discussion with you at this point.



so you think that the scramble is not a factor in who gets wr? It totally is.


----------



## sqAree (Jan 1, 2016)

It's maybe not useful to look at 3x3 because the current hardware is already almost perfect. Who dominates at other events hardware-wise? Also, the fact that many other events are trained and available in comps tells something about the current generation, compared to the past where it was only 3x3.


----------



## Johnny (Jan 1, 2016)

sqAree said:


> It's maybe not useful to look at 3x3 because the current hardware is already almost perfect. Who dominates at other events hardware-wise? Also, the fact that many other events are trained and available in comps tells something about the current generation, compared to the past where it was only 3x3.



I think it's perfect by our current standards. There are certainly other possible mechanisms that are much better that we haven't figured out yet.


----------



## Sajwo (Jan 1, 2016)

Johnny said:


> so you think that the scramble is not a factor in who gets wr? It totally is.



- Brand is dominant when 100% of cubers use the cube from only one brand (never happened in cubing history).
- The scramble is the major factor in getting a WR.

I love your reasoning.


----------



## Johnny (Jan 1, 2016)

Sajwo said:


> - Brand is dominant when 100% of cubers use the cube from only one brand (never happened in cubing history).
> - The scramble is the major factor in getting a WR.
> 
> I love your reasoning.



1. A brand is dominant when a significant and easily recognizable majority use cubes from one brand
2. Obviously a 10 second solver isn't getting a WR, but amongst people who average the same it's going to come down to the scramble


----------



## Johnny (Jan 1, 2016)

Ultimately though this is just my opinion, I don't have a particularly notable level of credibility so I'm definitely aware that I could be wrong


----------



## Sajwo (Jan 1, 2016)

Johnny said:


> 1. A brand is dominant when a significant and easily recognizable majority use cubes from one brand
> 2. Obviously a 10 second solver isn't getting a WR, but amongst people who average the same it's going to come down to the scramble



1. 3x3 Moyu is fitting into this definition
2. It comes down to solution and tps. Scramble may be a trash


----------



## Johnny (Jan 1, 2016)

Sajwo said:


> 1. 3x3 Moyu is fitting into this definition
> 2. It comes down to solution and tps. Scramble may be a trash



IDK, I think the thunderclap is popular enough to challenge the notion that MoYu has a significant and visible majority

And I want to mention that Lucas Etter is slower than Feliks on average, so if Lucas got a trash scramble he wouldn't have gotten WR


----------



## Johnny (Jan 1, 2016)

And he got the WR on an average that wasn't particularly fast for him


----------



## Sajwo (Jan 1, 2016)

Johnny said:


> IDK, I think the thunderclap is popular enough to challenge the notion that MoYu has a significant and visible majority
> 
> And I want to mention that Lucas Etter is slower than Feliks on average, so if Lucas got a trash scramble he wouldn't have gotten WR



Getting a scramble that is not a trash isn't considered lucky. And that's what you said - you have to get lucky. 4.90's scramble was nothing special, the major factor was Lucas's skill


----------



## Johnny (Jan 1, 2016)

Sajwo said:


> Getting a scramble that is not a trash isn't considered lucky. And that's what you said - you have to get lucky. 4.90's scramble was nothing special, the major factor was Lucas's skill



His WR time was over a second faster than all of his other solves at that comp, over 2 seconds faster than all but 1 of his other solves

That is a statistical anomaly


----------



## qwertycuber (Jan 1, 2016)

I wonder if this is a cycle, and a lot of people will start losing interest in cubing, because records are becoming harder to beat, and cubing will come back years later.


----------



## miningchr1s (Jan 1, 2016)

qwertycuber said:


> I wonder if this is a cycle, and a lot of people will start losing interest in cubing, because records are becoming harder to beat, and cubing will come back years later.



The last cube craze only last for about 5 years. The one we're in has been going on for about 9+ years


----------



## Dene (Jan 2, 2016)

I'm gonna do something unusual and completely disagree with Mr. Hardwick. I don't think it makes any sense to tie each generation to a new hardware development. It might kinda work for 3x3 developments, and certainly there have been a couple of huge shifts in 3x3 hardware (Rubik's -> the old numbered types (A3; F2; etc.); and then from those types -> Dayan). But then ignoring things like the introduction of ES, and V-cubes, and shengshou, doesn't seem to make any sense to me. Because these things didn't all nicely come out in synchronisation, it'd be difficult to come up with distinct generations.

I also disagree with people that think the shift from Dayan to Moyu was significant. Moyu isn't really that much better, and certainly didn't represent a total conceptual shift. Anyone who was around before before Dayan would understand what I mean. I understand the idea that most people were using Dayan, and now they're using Moyu, but in terms of hardware development there isn't really much difference.

I think a model that is more flexible makes sense. Here I've come up with something based around periods of time, which are deliberately vague, and built around developments in number of participants, the WCA, hardware, and significant contributors.


*Generation 1:* Those who got involved when the Rubik's Cube was first introduced, during the initial craze of the early 1980's.
*Significant Moments:* The Rubiks Cube was introduced; The original 1982 WCs; Fridrich and Petrus became the first big names​
*Generation 2:* Those who started cubing when the Rubik's Cube was dead, starting from the end of the initial craze, up until around about the year 2000.
*Significant Moments:* Dene was born​
*Generation 3:* Those who began cubing during the resurrection of the Rubik's Cube in the early-to-mid 2000's.
*Significant Moments:* The Yahoo group was formed and eventually started growing massively; The 2003 WCs; The formation of the WCA; Competitions began occurring frequently throughout the USA and Europe​
*Generation 4:* Those who came into cubing in the first post-resurrection boom from around 2006-2010.
*Significant Moments:* Speedsolving.com took over from the Yahoo group; YouTube tutorials started going up; Erik and Matyas dominated for a period; Matyas was banned for cheating; Numbers of competitions and competitors grew significantly; WCA Delegate numbers started growing; WCA regulations underwent major developments; Cube hardware improved for speed; V-Cubes revolutionised bigcubes and heavily influenced the design for the dominant Dayan Guhong​
*Generation 5:* Those who came into cubing in the second post-resurrection boom from around 2010-present.
*Significant Moments:* The WCA had major structural changes, with a regulations committee overhauling the regulations, and the introduction of the disciplinary committee; Tyson Mao resigned from the WCA Board, which lead to a number of changes within the Board, with Ron van Bruchem being the only "original" remaining; The Rubik's Cube got significant exposure in the media, leading to more and more people getting involved, causing a total blow-out of competitions and competitor numbers; Feliks smashed through barriers and completely dominated​


Based on this list, I kind of belong in Generation 2, as I learnt to cube in the 90's. In saying that, I was slow and had no external involvement. I eventually got more involved, and fully into speedcubing in 2007, which would make me gen4. But the only reason I got more into it is because my friend told me about something he had seen in the news, and the reason he told me was because he knew I was into the Rubik's Cube. I can also say with near certainty that, had there been a cubing competition in New Zealand before 2007, I most likely would have gone. As such I put myself into the rare gen2 category.


----------



## henrysavich (Jan 2, 2016)

5 generations definitely makes the most sense, and I'm inclined to best agree with Dene's model. Here's my very similar structure with some notes.

*Generation 1: The Originals (Conception - 1983)*
The people who started during the initial craze. It's hard to differentiate non-cuber from cuber during this time period, but certainly some people were notably more devoted. World championships 1982 can be seen as this generation's final hurrah.

Speedsolving theory: The formation of the idea of step based methods using algorithms, which is now realized as an essential central idea in all methods. Corner's first proved most popular, perhaps due to it being the most intuitive?

Hardware: Rubik's brands cubes were pretty much the only cube on the market, excluding poor quality knockoffs.

*Generation 2: The Dark Ages (1983-2003)*
The winds of popular culture were no longer at the backs of cubers, and there had not yet been an organization established to give a strong sense of legitimacy to the sport. The dark ages are the gap between the original craze and the WCA where the Rubik's cube experienced its least popularity since its conception.

Speedsolving theory: Most of the methods we use for speedsolving today were formed, though seemingly lacking compared to the theory-filled methods we have today. 

Hardware: Still Rubik's, more experimentation with modding

*Generation 3: The Revival (2003-2008)*
The formation of the WCA gave a second wind to the hobby, one that has carried on to present day. If we were to divide the history of cubing in half, B.C./A.C. style, I think this would be the point. Competitions began being held, the WCA became synonymous with official, and times decreased rapidly.

Speedsolving theory: CFOP/ Fridrich had become the strong favorite of speedsolvers, and the theory started becoming more populated with tiny time-saves and tricks. Roux was conceived by Gilles Roux, which would lay dormant for a while until years later.

Hardware: First speedcubes, but still significantly worse than modern day cubes. Modding was often required to improve quality to competetive levels.

*Generation 4: The NewCubers (2009-2012) *
Feliks Zemdegs enters the scene and rapidly pushes the limits of cubing. Competitions exploded in number, and hardware significantly improved. The popularit of speedsolving booms, prompting changes within the WCA and their regulations to accommodate the higher amounts of people.

Speedsolving theory: Roux and ZZ start gaining popularity, though still dwarfed by CFOP. Lots of effort goes into optimizing algs, mainly OLL/PLL

Hardware: Enter Dayan, whose cubes represented a drastic jump in quality from its predecessors. Shengshou also releases cubes that dominate the market for pretty much every event besides 3x3, though they often require modding. 

*Generation 5: Modern Era (2013-Present) *
An perioddefined by competitiveness, both in speedcubing and speedcube manufacturing. Feliks starts to lose records to more specialized cubers, which perhaps indicates a future without "all-rounders". The number of competitors and competitions remains rapidly increasing

Speedsolving theory: Methods diversify, Roux and ZZ are generally accepted as having roughly equal merit to CFOP, though CFOP remains most popular. Supplementary alg sets for seemingly anything are generated, as well as people who have put in the effort to learn them. Overall, it seems the community has shifted towards a more exploratory approach to speedsolving

Hardware:The market explodes, Dayan loses it's dominance to Moyu, which now seems to be losing it's dominance to various other manufacturers. Modding puzzles has become a thing of the past, except perhaps for the Shengshou megaminx. Quality wise we no longer see huge improvements, rather slow shifts to accommodate personal preference.


----------



## cmhardw (Jan 2, 2016)

Wow, Dene and henrysavich those are good models. Thanks to all those contributing a model to the discussion, as discussion in a thread like this builds on the ideas in the earlier posts.


----------



## Matt11111 (Jan 2, 2016)

Without a doubt, cubing has gotten a ton bigger since 2013 or so. I would say I'm a fifth generation cuber, and so would some of my friends, who I got into cubing (actually, a few picked up the hobby before I met them). When I started getting into speedcubing, I had no idea how popular the hobby was. As DG said, there were over 500 competitions last year, over ten per weekend. That is a ton when you think about it, especially when you consider that few competitions take place during the week, if any at all (well, Worlds and Nats start on a Friday, but does that really count?). And I live in New York City. Competitions around here have 100 competitors regularly. The fact that there are over 100 people willing to come out to get together and compete, even though they know they'll most likely lose, just goes to show you how big of a community speedcubing really is. And competitions definitely don't have too much of a competitive feel, it's just a lot of really nice people showing off their skills. 2003's Rubik's Cube World Championship had 83 competitors. 2015 saw over 400 competitors, so cubing has undoubtedly become a much more popular sport. 

As for hardware, DaYan was definitely the most popular before MoYu came along, but then what? Is MoYu still the best? Or have QiYi and YuXin and the likes taken them down? Welp, I guess it all comes down to personal preference. I think that by now, the speedcubes of today aren't going to become much better (although I bet people said that back in the days of DaYan's dominance), but the slight differences in how each cube feels and how people perform with each one will probably give us the answer to this question. If I had a MoYu AoLong v1 and I got the best times with it, compared to the QiYi Thunderclap and the YuXin 3x3, I'm not going to let other people's mains dictate what cube I choose to use. With the wide variety of cubes on the market today, there are more than enough for someone to find the cube that fits their turning style the best. So at the end of the day, it really comes down to what kind of turning style do most people have, and which cube can they agree fits their needs?

Welp, those are just some thoughts of mine about cubing today. Feel free to tell me how badly all this crud was written. Good night everybody.


----------



## qwertycuber (Jan 2, 2016)

Do any of you think there will be a generation where the records are really impossible to beat?


----------



## nvpendsey (Jan 2, 2016)

How is this classification hardware wise (read market dominance wise)? (I don't know the years since I am a cuber from the fifth henrysavich-ic* generation cuber.Someone plz provide the dates.)


*1. The Rubiks Era* : Starts from the invention of the Rubiks cube upto the invention on V-Cubes.

*2. The Verdes Era *: Starts from the invention/manufracturing of V-Cubes to the start of dayan.This is also the start of speedcubing and speedcubes.This era hard a negative feeling about knockoffs like Shengshou and later dayan.

*3. The Dayan Era* : The 'knockoffs' now become popular and much more faster.People lose interest in vcubes and other manufactures of the previous era.There is an explosion in the speedcubing markets and cubing world. Speedcubes are now available to the general public.

*4. The Moyu Era *: This should be divided into two parts 
4-A) The Domination : The new company Moyu starts to dominate the markets, and it soon dominates the entire market unlike dayan which only managed to dominate the 3x3. At this point, probably every second cube is a Moyu.(someone plz confirm this)
4-B) The fumble (2014-15) : Some small companies like qiyi and yuxin now become QiYi and Yuxin by there releases of 3x3 and 5x5(&11x11) respectively. QiYi begins to dominate the side-puzzles like square 1.

Some of these eras would overlap.Also from somewhere in the dayan era, Shengshou tightens it grip on the big cube market.It also occupies a niche by manufacturing the only 8x8s , 9x9s and 10x10s on the market
According to me, during the Moyu era, we (humans) reach a saturation point in speedcube hardware.Almost every mechanism we can think of is already there.The Moyu era is divided into two parts for much more precise description of the market.If Moyu loses its dominance then there would be '4-C) The decline' part of this era.


PS:Note the capitalization of company names.
*=Can we please refer the generation according the the username of the person who (first) posted them.Also which sounds much better henrysavich-ic or henrysavich-ion.


----------



## Sajwo (Jan 2, 2016)

qwertycuber said:


> Do any of you think there will be a generation where the records are really impossible to beat?



I think it might be possible in ~50 years. Sad thing is that we don't even know if WCA will survive such a long time


----------



## shadowslice e (Jan 2, 2016)

Sajwo said:


> I think it might be possible in ~50 years. Sad thing is that we don't even know if WCA will survive such a long time



It probably will though it may go through a cyclic rebirth as cubing goes in and out of fashion. It may be interesting to see if cubers of this generation (and maybe gen 4) would be very encouraging of their kids to five from a young age because that would be a first that has not really happened en force as there weren't really enough people who could speedsolve properly (in gen 1 everyone was crazy about cubes but not all (in fact most did not) have a relatively effective speedcubing method.

Actually, that links quite nicely to the second part of my disscussion point: what do you think future generations will be defined by? And how long will each of them last/ persist?


----------



## tx789 (Jan 2, 2016)

I think a better way to cater use is by who the newer cubers look up to. When they start the world record holders. This only replies to post 2003. 

I also think hardware can only really be in two caterioes for 3x3. Old style and mordern. The first mordern cube is the GuHong. Which was completely new at the time.


----------



## DGCubes (Jan 2, 2016)

I really like this thread. Honestly, something I'm noticing is that all of these proposals for generations, despite having different reasoning, all point to around the same thing. This just shows that these 5 basic generations are all the more real, because they stand out from each other for more than one reason. We can argue about the reasoning behind our particular variations (hardware, speed, community size, etc.), but I think we should be going towards compiling everyone's reasons for each generation, and giving very general years that they each take place in. This would pretty much make a perfectly elaborate list of the generations.

I'm currently too lazy, considering it's 7:44 in the morning where I live, but I'd be interested in working on that soon.


----------



## AlphaSheep (Jan 2, 2016)

I'd say that the generations vary by region. In South Africa specifically, I'd say there are only four generations. There's the first generation who started during the 1981 craze, the second generation who started in the 1990's and 2000's. Then there's the generation who started in 2010-2013 who make up the majority of experienced cubers in South Africa. Finally there's the current generation which are getting into cubing thanks to more media exposure (especially after Mats and Feliks visit at the end of 2014) and more frequent competitions.


----------



## Matt11111 (Jan 2, 2016)

qwertycuber said:


> Do any of you think there will be a generation where the records are really impossible to beat?



Absolutely. If they could always be broken, all the records would eventually be close to 0 seconds. There has to be a point where people reach a plateau and the records can no longer be broken. I just don't know how long that'll be.


----------



## shadowslice e (Jan 2, 2016)

AlphaSheep said:


> I'd say that the generations vary by region. In South Africa specifically, I'd say there are only four generations. There's the first generation who started during the 1981 craze, the second generation who started in the 1990's and 2000's. Then there's the generation who started in 2010-2013 who make up the majority of experienced cubers in South Africa. Finally there's the current generation which are getting into cubing thanks to more media exposure (especially after Mats and Feliks visit at the end of 2014) and more frequent competitions.



Actually, that's a really good point that I never really considered.

I wonder what the other regional variations might look like.


----------



## newtonbase (Jan 2, 2016)

I got my first cube during the initial craze but didn't learn to solve until 2 years ago. What generation does that make me?


----------



## muchacho (Jan 2, 2016)

newtonbase said:


> I got my first cube during the initial craze but didn't learn to solve until 2 years ago. What generation does that make me?



Me too (but I learned last year), the 1+5 generation?


----------



## shadowslice e (Jan 2, 2016)

newtonbase said:


> I got my first cube during the initial craze but didn't learn to solve until 2 years ago. What generation does that make me?





muchacho said:


> Me too (but I learned last year), the 1+5 generation?



Personally, I would put you in the 5th generation cause that's when you started to take cubing as a proper hobby.


----------



## muchacho (Jan 2, 2016)

It was a fun hobby... for a few days, I built a layer before rage quiting and decided to peel the stickers


----------



## bubbagrub (Jan 2, 2016)

I'm similar... I got my first cube in 1981 (here's the proof...  I was seven).

At that time I learned just to solve a side. In 2007 I decided to learn to solve the cube, but gave up on learning the last layer algorithms. I finally learned to solve the whole thing around 2011/2012. So I guess I could claim membership of a few generations, depending on how it's defined...


----------



## shadowslice e (Jan 3, 2016)

bubbagrub said:


> I'm similar... I got my first cube in 1981 (here's the proof...  I was seven).
> 
> At that time I learned just to solve a side. In 2007 I decided to learn to solve the cube, but gave up on learning the last layer algorithms. I finally learned to solve the whole thing around 2011/2012. So I guess I could claim membership of a few generations, depending on how it's defined...



Personally I would put you in gen 4 cause that's when you properly decided to cube and didn't give up.

I think there are actually very few gen-1 or 2 cubers cause there were many that thought it was awesome to solve but there weren't many widely known methods and even fewer actually learned them.


----------



## SenorJuan (Jan 3, 2016)

"I think there are actually very few gen-1 ... cubers 'cause .... there weren't many widely known methods and even fewer actually learned them"
There were huge numbers of 'gen-1' cubers back then, it was a national obsession (in the U.K), and the lack of methods wasn't really a problem, most people used 'easy to learn' beginners methods (usually LBL/ keyhole + 4LLL; or 'corners then edges'), and you could get down into the 30's that way. There were plenty of books published at the time, too, if you were interested, some of which contained some more advanced techniques.
It's the ease of remembering/re-learning a beginners method that kept me cubing.


----------



## shadowslice e (Jan 3, 2016)

SenorJuan said:


> "I think there are actually very few gen-1 ... cubers 'cause .... there weren't many widely known methods and even fewer actually learned them"
> There were huge numbers of 'gen-1' cubers back then, it was a national obsession (in the U.K), and the lack of methods wasn't really a problem, most people used 'easy to learn' beginners methods (usually LBL/ keyhole + 4LLL; or 'corners then edges'), and you could get down into the 30's that way. There were plenty of books published at the time, too, if you were interested, some of which contained some more advanced techniques.
> It's the ease of remembering/re-learning a beginners method that kept me cubing.



My reasoning was that there weren't really many people who tried for speed. They just knew how to solve it and that was enough.

I wasn't alive then so I guess I could be wrong tho


----------



## SenorJuan (Jan 3, 2016)

A significant percentage tried for speed. Not many tried hard at actually solving it, as a puzzle. And those would usually give up, especially as there were widely-distributed crib-sheets of key algorithms to tempt you, and always some kid who could sub-50 to give you some incentive. So dozens of us would gather in head-to-head races, maybe sharing a few 'hot' moves you'd picked up from someone else (or keeping them to yourself if they were really good!).
As an example of how obsessed we were: Our Art class was set a project to design some 'retail packaging' for a product of our choice. I'm sure 20 out of 30 chose the cube as their 'product'.


----------



## Deleted member 19792 (Jan 3, 2016)

If I looked into DGCubes and Sajwo's distinctions:

DG: 3rd gen
Sajwo: 2nd gen

I started in about 2008 and kept working with puzzles from there. I didn't start speedcubing like a maniac until 2012.


----------



## mark49152 (Jan 4, 2016)

Interesting thread. Here's my thoughts. Generations should be defined by what motivated the people (in general) and what they strove for and achieved. Hardware shouldn't define it; good hardware is an outcome not a cause.

First gen were driven by the consumer boom in the early 80s. I don't really see someone who started in 1990 belonging in another generation, since there was nothing new going on then. They were just late gen1.

Second gen were the people in the 90s who were passionate and visionary enough to get connected, develop cubing both theoretically and as a competitive sport, and work together to eventually establish the 2003 WC and the WCA. I'm not sure when that started, but to me that's the most important phase in cubing and those people deserve a generation of their own.

Third gen are people who joined when there is already a competitive framework set up with a governing body and organised competitions. The sport and events have been established, records have been set as targets, the framework is already there for them to compete and get involved. They are (mostly) only participating, not building or breaking new ground like gen2. 

Not much is really different between say 2006 and 2016 except for scale and accessibility, which are hard things to use to define generational boundaries, so that's it, just the 3 generations for me


----------



## MattMcConaha (Jan 4, 2016)

I would call myself 2nd gen of revival.

1st gen is the 80s or whatever. 2nd gen is the lost years.

Then there's revival

1st gen is the founding of WCA. 2nd gen is around first sub 10, so starting in like 2007, which was a wee bit after I started really getting into it; modding preexisting slow puzzles for speed was still a huge deal and dedicated speedcubes were in their early years. 3rd gen is Dayan revolutionizing 3x3 cube technology and continuing explosion in popularity. Now we may still be 3rd gen or maybe there's a 4th gen, with the fall of Dayan.


----------



## mafergut (Jan 26, 2016)

I got my 1st cube in like 1984. I loved to race against my friends to see who would solve a face faster. Then I learned to solve the whole cube and I was around 1:15 more or less with beginners method. My best time was 48 seconds with a partial LL skip. After some years enjoying it, life got in the middle and I lost my two Rubik's cubes, probably at my parents' house. Now I'm 45 and 2,5 years ago, in 2013, I started to get interested in cubing again, after watching some videos so I decided to buy a couple Zhanchi's for me and my son. We both learned CFOP, but I'm the only one of the two that persisted and now I can call myself a speedcuber (even though I have never been to a comp).

So, I'd say I'm from the old days but really started to get serious during the "Feliks" era.


----------



## teboecubes (May 3, 2016)

DGCubes said:


> I see generations of cubing like this:
> 1st generation: 1980s, like you described
> 2nd generation: cubing "dark ages", as described by cmhardw
> 3rd generation: the revival, from around 2003 to 2008. Pretty much when cubing was starting up again and there weren't too many advancements hardware-wise.
> ...



According to this model, I started in early 5th generaton ( I'm a relatively new cuber), then I took a half year break, and right now I'd call late 5th generation' maybe 5 1/2 generation with new wr holders like Collin Burns (former wr 5.25) Rami Sbahi (former 2x2 wr 0.58) and later on, Lucas Etter ( 4.9 3x3 single and 2x2 average 1.51). In this 5 1/2th generation, we see new puzzles on the market like Cong's Design puzzles or GuoGuan cubes. We might be coming to a 6th generation soon, with more sub-5 singles hopefully, people who are new cubers now becoming world class champions, and someone maybe, just maybe breaking Felik's long-standing 6.54 3x3 world record average. A sixth generation might also mean advances in hardware and pushing limits in big cube design. Recently Corenpuzzle made a 22x22, let's see if we can go bigger. Moyu has a mass- produced 13x13, I'll be excited for bigger cubes by them or other companies like Yuxin, Shengshou,or even V-cube. Let's see if there will be a new-coming sixth generation. Who knows?


----------



## Cubeaddiction (May 16, 2016)

I started cubing in 2008. This was about a year before dayan got popular (thrid gen I think)


----------



## Isaac VM (Jun 16, 2016)

DGCubes said:


> 4th generation: I'm going to call this the DaYan generation, from 2009 to 2012, when the DaYan cubes got big, there were some okay speedcubes for other events (like SS big cubes, etc.), and cubing was getting faster and more well-known.
> 5th generation: the explosion; when cubing got WAY bigger, from 2013 to now. It could be characterized by the release of many modern (non-DaYan) speedcubes, cubing YouTubers getting a lot bigger (I remember around the beginning of this time period when 30K or 40K was about the maximum, and look at people like CBC and RedKB now), and many more competitions and new competitors around the world (2013 had 359 competitions and 2015 had 572).



Well, I learned to solve the cube back in 2010, but I did not speedsolved it until a year ago, so I guess I am a 4th generation cuber but a 5th generation speedcuber.


----------



## bazmonkey (Jun 16, 2016)

I learned in the mid-90's, so... I'm part of the third "lost" generation?

I very much hope this isn't the case, but I fear the next "generation" (5-10 more years) may be the beginning of a dark time again. 3x3 times have improved threefold from when I first got a cube, and somewhere around 4 seconds is probably the hard limit of solve times. Technology has helped about as much as it can: I can't imagine a cube innovation that would drastically affect top solve times as this point. Record-breaking can only get more and more rare. Years may go by in between records that just eek a few hundredths of a second off the previous. Do you all think the "sport" will survive in its current form when the prospect of breaking a record is all but nil?


----------



## AlphaSheep (Jun 17, 2016)

bazmonkey said:


> Do you all think the "sport" will survive in its current form when the prospect of breaking a record is all but nil?



But the prospect of breaking a record is practically nil for at least 99% of cubers already and it seems to be fine... Funny how people somehow seem to enjoy cubing even when they have no hope of breaking records.


----------



## mafergut (Jun 17, 2016)

AlphaSheep said:


> But the prospect of breaking a record is practically nil for at least 99% of cubers already and it seems to be fine... Funny how people somehow seem to enjoy cubing even when they have no hope of breaking records.


I don't find it strange nor funny that people can enjoy cubing with no prospect of breaking any records. People play basketball, or football or chess with no hope of being in the big leagues or beating Magnus Carlsen or even getting an ELO ranking. It's very easy: people enjoy doing those things just for the sake of it.

For me, cubing is a lot of fun and a personal challenge. So I am breaking records almost every week: my own records and PBs. In fact, I got into big cubes, skewb, pyra, etc. because I was starting to get stuck at 3x3 and PBs were more scarce. Now I'm happy that I can improve at 4x4, 5x5... and even at 3x3 every now and then.


----------



## bazmonkey (Jun 17, 2016)

AlphaSheep said:


> Funny how people somehow seem to enjoy cubing even when they have no hope of breaking records.



No doubt, I'm one of those people. But you don't think overall enthusiasm for it won't die down at least a little when it starts going 3 or more years in between any new records? The passionate die-hands will always be around, but I can't imagine it not taking a hit to its popularity at all


----------



## mafergut (Jun 17, 2016)

bazmonkey said:


> No doubt, I'm one of those people. But you don't think overall enthusiasm for it won't die down at least a little when it starts going 3 or more years in between any new records? The passionate die-hands will always be around, but I can't imagine it not taking a hit to its popularity at all


WCA might decide to change the rules again and restart records from scratch on some events, like, for example, counting the inspection time in speedsolving events, because, right now, it takes more time to inspect 2x2 and 3x3 than to solve them


----------



## wir3sandfir3s (Jun 23, 2016)

DGCubes said:


> I see generations of cubing like this:
> 1st generation: 1980s, like you described
> 2nd generation: cubing "dark ages", as described by cmhardw
> 3rd generation: the revival, from around 2003 to 2008. Pretty much when cubing was starting up again and there weren't too many advancements hardware-wise.
> ...


I'm 5th gen then.


----------



## Ordway Persyn (Jun 23, 2016)

AlphaSheep said:


> But the prospect of breaking a record is practically nil for at least 99% of cubers already and it seems to be fine... Funny how people somehow seem to enjoy cubing even when they have no hope of breaking records.


I think a lot of cubers focus on just going up the world rankings as we'll as some wan't to go up sum of ranks.
Also for some people like me, state records.


----------



## One Wheel (Jun 23, 2016)

mafergut said:


> WCA might decide to change the rules again and restart records from scratch on some events, like, for example, counting the inspection time in speedsolving events, because, right now, it takes more time to inspect 2x2 and 3x3 than to solve them



I rather like this idea, if for no other reason than that it's confusing to people who don't know the rules the way it is right now. How many videos have you seen where someone has a scrambled cube, hands it to somebody who knows how to solve it, and says "you can solve it in 15 seconds? 1 . . . 2 . . . 3 . . ." Of course, eliminating inspection time would virtually eliminate the advantage of color neutrality, and would result in many more very bad solves.

As far as losing popularity as records get harder to break, it could go either way. I'm in no danger of breaking any records in the near future (or ever, really) and to be honest I find 2x2 and even 3x3 a little boring, but big cubes are fascinating, and I believe that longer events may be the way to go. It seems that big blind is gaining popularity, and I would love to see things like gigaminx, 6 and 7 bld, and 4 or 5 mbld offered. When the records for big blind are 1 hour+ big mbld is absurd, but this year over half of the people who have completed 4 bld have done it under 10 minutes, and over half of 5 bld records this year are under 20 minutes, why not offer a mbld option for those? The thing with scheduling mbld is that you always know exactly how long the event is going to take, so it's going to be easier to fit around stuff. 4x4 FMC has also been mentioned, and it would have the same advantages as bmbld (great acronym, btw).


----------



## xchippy (Jun 28, 2016)

One Wheel said:


> I would love to see things like gigaminx, 6 and 7 bld, and 4 or 5 mbld offered. When the records for big blind are 1 hour+ big mbld is absurd, but this year over half of the people who have completed 4 bld have done it under 10 minutes, and over half of 5 bld records this year are under 20 minutes, why not offer a mbld option for those? The thing with scheduling mbld is that you always know exactly how long the event is going to take, so it's going to be easier to fit around stuff. 4x4 FMC has also been mentioned, and it would have the same advantages as bmbld (great acronym, btw).


I don't think that events that are super hard like 6bld or 7bld would be good for getting people into the community because then it would seem like all of us are like nerds who have no life. Also I don't know of many competitions that would have the time to run these events


----------



## One Wheel (Jun 28, 2016)

xchippy said:


> I don't think that events that are super hard like 6bld or 7bld would be good for getting people into the community because then it would seem like all of us are like nerds who have no life. Also I don't know of many competitions that would have the time to run these events



You're probably quite right that very few competitions would run these events, but I don't think that should be a disqualification. Out of 99 upcoming competitions on the WCA site right now only 30 offer 5BLD, and 32 offer feet. Even US Nationals doesn't have feet, but it's still an event, and its comedic value means that it is important to retain, to dilute the natural "nerd alert" response to a Rubik's cube competition.

As to the argument that it would make us seem like nerds who have no life, well, in a very real sense I started cubing because I am a nerd who has no life, and I was not under the impression that I was alone in that . In all seriousness, though, people already assume that if you can solve a Rubik's cube you're either a nerd who has no life, or at the very least possess superhuman intelligence. You and I know that at least the second one isn't necessarily true, but not everybody knows that. Furthermore, and more importantly, Not everyone would do 6BLD and 7BLD. It wouldn't help the few people who compete in those events, but everybody else can make themselves seem much more relatable to the general public by saying something to the effect of "yes, I can solve a Rubik's cube, but there are people who competitively solve a 7x7 Rubik's cube blindfolded! And who do 5 5x5 Rubik's cubes blindfolded at one time!" Makes you seem almost human right away.


----------



## Tony Fisher (Oct 22, 2016)

qwertycuber said:


> I wonder if this is a cycle, and a lot of people will start losing interest in cubing, because records are becoming harder to beat, and cubing will come back years later.


I doubt that very much. With the internet / social media hobbies are far more likely to continue. Back in my day what people did was far more influenced by their (real world) friends. So if a few lost interest in a craze it would quickly disappear. Now the ones still interested will keep in touch and feed off each other. That in turn brings in new fans who before would never have considered it since the craze would hardly have been mentioned again. All my school friends loved the cube in 1980 but by 1983 or so I was the only one.
I would also challenge the claim that records are harder to beat. I haven't done the maths but it seems to me that they are broken more often now than ever. That might be due to a greater number of cubers but it's still relevant.


----------



## One Wheel (Oct 24, 2016)

Tony Fisher said:


> I doubt that very much. With the internet / social media hobbies are far more likely to continue. Back in my day what people did was far more influenced by their (real world) friends. So if a few lost interest in a craze it would quickly disappear. Now the ones still interested will keep in touch and feed off each other. That in turn brings in new fans who before would never have considered it since the craze would hardly have been mentioned again. All my school friends loved the cube in 1980 but by 1983 or so I was the only one.
> I would also challenge the claim that records are harder to beat. I haven't done the maths but it seems to me that they are broken more often now than ever. That might be due to a greater number of cubers but it's still relevant.



The impact of social media is interesting, and you are most likely right. I wonder though if it isn't possible that at some point there could be a significant wane. Probably not because records are hard to break, but because if current growth rates continue the ability to solve a Rubik's cube will no longer be anything special in another decade or two.


----------



## efattah (Oct 24, 2016)

I started cubing in 1980 with a Hungarian Rubik's cube my dad brought back from a business trip in Budapest. Shortly after that, the cubes became available at every store in North America. The peak of my cubing was actually in the dark ages (1984-87) where at times I felt like I was chasing an invisible record (In '87 I got a 19.8 single but I figured the record had to be way lower than that, since 5 years had elapsed since the 22.95, yet the Guinness records book still listed 22.95)

In terms of the 'end' of records, this has already happened in freediving. As a competitive freediver I predicted (in 2001) that depth records would stop around 125-130m (in constant weight diving) and this is exactly what happened. Despite the 'end' of records (for men's constant weight and static apnea at least) participation in competitions is higher than ever before-- even to the point that in many countries even national records have 'ended.' Most national constant weight records are at least 5 years old or more. So I don't think the inability to set records will stop people from participating as they are mostly competing against themselves.


Eric Fattah
BC, Canada


----------



## asacuber (Dec 26, 2016)

Cubing has grown alot now


----------



## conanthewarrior (Apr 5, 2017)

I am unsure exactly being fairly new to speedcubing.

I got my first cube from a friend when I was around 18-19, so that would of been 2008-2009. I learnt the beginner method then stopped for some reason. 

I am now 26, 27 this month, and recently found my old cube, and I have some memory problems due to illness and thought it may help a bit, if not it is still fun. I got myself a thunderclap to use for now, so started again this year so I guess you could say I fall into two different generations in a sense.


----------



## shadowslice e (Apr 14, 2017)

I made a video which attempts to detail some of the models proposed in this thread so I thought I would post it here. Hope that those people who's models I used don't think I misrepresented their views too much.


----------



## DGCubes (Apr 14, 2017)

shadowslice e said:


> I made a video which attempts to detail some of the models proposed in this thread so I thought I would post it here. Hope that those people who's models I used don't think I misrepresented their views too much.



Whoa that's so weird... I just thought about making a video about cubing generations this morning. Guess not now. 

I'll watch the video when I get home. I'm excited to see it.


----------



## Sajwo (Apr 14, 2017)

I am pretty sure that we are approaching whole next stage. I'd like to be consistent and say "Max Park Generation", but nah.. Speedcubing is on it's way to become a real sport. Big companies like Moyu, Gans, MFG or Yuxin are recruiting world-class cubers to promote their cubes. They are now getting paid for using their flagship cubes, wearing their apparel and they travel worldwide. It's so much bigger than before. People now finally have a real motivation to break records, it's not a pointless hobby anymore. I also like the idea of rivalry between countries on Worlds this year. I hope that WCA will come up with some more exciting ideas in the future. Or will it be RSA?


----------



## Luke8 (Apr 24, 2017)

I would be the last generation, I started 2 months ago.


----------



## asacuber (Apr 24, 2017)

Sajwo said:


> I am pretty sure that we are approaching whole next stage. I'd like to be consistent and say *"Max Park Generation"*, but nah.. Speedcubing is on it's way to become a real sport. Big companies like Moyu, Gans, MFG or Yuxin are recruiting world-class cubers to promote their cubes. They are now getting paid for using their flagship cubes, wearing their apparel and they travel worldwide. It's so much bigger than before. People now finally have a real motivation to break records, it's not a pointless hobby anymore. I also like the idea of rivalry between countries on Worlds this year. I hope that WCA will come up with some more exciting ideas in the future. Or will it be RSA?



Did you just predict the future?


----------



## JustinTimeCuber (Apr 24, 2017)

I'd just like to point out that my WCA ID looks kinda old-fashioned compared to you kids' IDs.


----------



## cubing master (Oct 15, 2017)

Probably the 5th generation. I started around 2013.


----------



## Zerksies (Oct 16, 2017)

This is a weird unfair question. I would be considered 1st gen since I touched a cube in the early 80's. But that's not a fare answer, I first solved a cube and would consider myself a "cuber" in the 3rd generation. I'm a older cuber and it was one of them things I wanted todo in my life


----------



## mitja (Oct 16, 2017)

I am 1st gen. Competing in 1980-1982 but after that stopped untill 2014-15. We were doing F2L, half of Oll, and 2look PLL. People were crazy about cubes. The only lube was Nivea creme


----------



## shadowslice e (Oct 16, 2017)

Zerksies said:


> This is a weird unfair question.


That's definitely an interesting way of phrasing it and I'm not entirely sure what you mean by "unfair"?


> I would be considered 1st gen since I touched a cube in the early 80's. But that's not a fare answer, I first solved a cube and would consider myself a "cuber" in the 3rd generation. I'm a older cuber and it was one of them things I wanted todo in my life


There are some people who are in multiple (usually 2) generations because they properly started in one generation but then stopped and started in a later one. They denote themselves as the x/y generation.

I would probably say you're just 3rd gen though if that's when you started cubing properly rather than just fiddling around with it every now and then.


----------



## Gomorrite (Oct 16, 2017)

henrysavich said:


> 5 generations definitely makes the most sense, and I'm inclined to best agree with Dene's model. Here's my very similar structure with some notes.
> 
> *Generation 1: The Originals (Conception - 1983)*
> The people who started during the initial craze. It's hard to differentiate non-cuber from cuber during this time period, but certainly some people were notably more devoted. World championships 1982 can be seen as this generation's final hurrah.
> ...


I think this is the most sensible and comprehensible model presented in this thread.

Interestingly, way into the "Modern Era", most top cubers are still from the 4th Generation or even late 3rd. This includes Max Park and possibly Seung Hyuk-Nahm. The exception is BLD, where a bunch of 5th generation cubers have already reached "elite level".

There will probably be a 6th generation coming in a few years in which records become much less frequent, while winning championships rather than just breaking records should become more prestigious. In general, cubing might become more similar to many other sports in many aspects.


----------



## 1001010101001 (Jan 7, 2018)

5th gen. Thanks GAN!!


----------



## Hazel (Jan 7, 2018)

I think I started in 2013, so I'm part of the 4th generation


----------



## greentgoatgal (Jan 8, 2018)

I'm definitely generation 5.


----------



## Vadim Melnikov (May 1, 2018)

I am generation 5 - I started cubing only half a year ago.


----------



## TomasH (May 2, 2018)

Definitely 1st generation! I got my first cube in the 80s and was solving it in around a minute using the beginner method. Without an online community, that is all I had access to. I've had a cube ever since - for the longest time it was on a shelf and I picked it up now and then. It got replaced as it wore out. I still have some on my very early ones - the colours are pretty faded! Then around 6-7 years ago I got more into cubing again and started using the Ortega method. Finally this year I decided to get more serious about getting faster, found this website and amazing community and am now solving using the Roux method and hopefully will be able to attend my first competition this month!


----------



## Megaminxer (May 5, 2018)

I'm third gen, I started in 2007 but I consider myself 1st gen because I am so interested in cube history and for a while the only cubes I had in my collection were 80s and 90s era puzzles.


----------



## BenChristman1 (May 31, 2020)

I think that this is an interesting thread, so it has been bumped.



DGCubes said:


> I see generations of cubing like this:
> 1st generation: 1980s, like you described
> 2nd generation: cubing "dark ages", as described by cmhardw
> 3rd generation: the revival, from around 2003 to 2008. Pretty much when cubing was starting up again and there weren't too many advancements hardware-wise.
> ...


Since this was written in 2016, magnets in cubes hadn't become popular yet, so I think that from whenever magnets were widely introduced to now is the 6th generation.

My updated generation list is:
1st generation: 1970s-80s, when the cube was very relevant in pop culture.
2nd generation: late 1980s to 2003, when the cube fell from popularity to when the first WCA competition was held.
3rd generation: Cubing came back from 2003-2008, when competitions got more widely held and competitions became more organized.
4th generation: From 2009-2012, when lots of people got into cubing and "speedcubes" stated becoming very readily available.
5th generation: Like DG said, when cubing exploded between 2013 and 2016, and hardware got much better, and Feliks had taken over.
6th generation: From the introduction of magnets (late 2016) to mid-2019, when a lot of new speedcubers have taken over, and there are lots of world-class people in almost every event.
7th generation: From the realease of the GuoGuan Yuexiao EDM in June 2019 to now, when customizability in tensioning and magnets became much easier and cheaper, with releases such as the Gan 356 X and XS (neither are very cheap, though), the Valk 3 Elite M, the MGC Elite, and the Tengyun v2 M.

As for me, I got my first cube on my 8th or 9th birthday (late 4th generation or early 5th), but I didn't learn how to solve it until about 2 1/2 years ago, after magnets had been introduced, so 6th generation.


----------



## Sub1Hour (May 31, 2020)

BenChristman1 said:


> I think that this is an interesting thread, so it has been bumped.
> 
> 
> Since this was written in 2016, magnets in cubes hadn't become popular yet, so I think that from whenever magnets were widely introduced to now is the 6th generation.
> ...


Very Cool! I'm mid 6th gen (April 2018) so it's very cool to see this categorized.

I would also like to propose a 7th generation, The Custom Era. Basically 2019+, marked with the release of the EDM on June 16 2019, making adjustable features not only outstanding and easy to use, but affordable as well.


----------



## BenChristman1 (May 31, 2020)

Sub1Hour said:


> I would also like to propose a 7th generation, The Custom Era. Basically 2019+, marked with the release of the EDM on June 16 2019, making adjustable features not only outstanding and easy to use, but affordable as well.


I have added that.


----------



## Hazel (May 31, 2020)

I wonder if enough people picked up cubing as a result of quarantine to have created a new generation...


----------



## ProStar (May 31, 2020)

Aerma said:


> I wonder if enough people picked up cubing as a result of quarantine to have created a new generation...



I think the best way to see that would be the amount of new competitors we get after this all ends. I believe we'll see a petty big spikes in the couple months after comps start taking place


----------



## One Wheel (May 31, 2020)

Sub1Hour said:


> I would also like to propose a 7th generation, The Custom Era. Basically 2019+, marked with the release of the EDM on June 16 2019, making adjustable features not only outstanding and easy to use, but affordable as well.



I disagree. I believe that magnets are a significant change, but I am unconvinced by the idea that pre-set "customization" options are a meaningful change. The current hardware era is better defined by the fact that at least for 2-5 cubic events there are multiple equally-well performing puzzles at multiple price points, and there is no single best puzzle for any of them.


----------



## EngiNerdBrian (May 31, 2020)

@BenChristman1 - quality bump.

I guess I'm 3rd/4th gen having been introduced to cubing in 2008 and walked away right before the great hardware explosion circa 2012-2013, I used to main a ghost hand cube in m first wave of cubing. It's the amazing hardware of the late 6th and 7th that's responsible for my new found interest in cubing.


----------



## Ordway Persyn (Jun 1, 2020)

I categorize 5 generations currently. These are similar to Ben's except I consider his Gens 4&5 to be one generation and disagree with S1H about there being an additional generation starting in 2019

*1st gen: 1980-1990, First wave:*
cubing is born and becomes big quickly. Worlds 1982 occurs.
*2nd gen: 1990-2003, Dark ages:*
cubing wanes in popularity. early online communities around cubing form.
*3rd gen: 2003-2010, WCA gen:*
2003 worlds occur, WCA is formed, Type A-F cubes are released. People start getting much faster than before.
*4th Gen: 2010-2015, Cubing Boom:*
Cubing grows significantly in popularity. The Dayan Guhong is released. Feliks Zemdegs dominates 3x3. The Aosu 4x4 comes out. Skewb becomes an event.
*5th Gen: 2015-Present, Current gen:*
Qiyi Square-1 is released. Lucas Etter gets the first sub-5 in competition. Magnetic cubes become a thing. 3x3 Hardware plateaus. Max Park Rivals Felik's. People get really fast with Roux.


----------



## semiprime799 (Aug 9, 2020)

One Wheel said:


> I disagree. I believe that magnets are a significant change, but I am unconvinced by the idea that pre-set "customization" options are a meaningful change. The current hardware era is better defined by the fact that at least for 2-5 cubic events there are multiple equally-well performing puzzles at multiple price points, and there is no single best puzzle for any of them.


I'm not sure on the magnets bit, but...

I think customizable cubes will lower the bar of entry for new-gen cubers. Another categorization I think we have missed is the idea of sub-X eras.
Where we have people averaging sub-10 etc.


----------



## One Wheel (Aug 9, 2020)

semiprime799 said:


> I think customizable cubes will lower the bar of entry for new-gen cubers.


I disagree. You can buy excellent cubes that need little or no setup very cheap, "customizable" cubes are more expensive. It's still a relatively cheap hobby, but customizable cubes do nothing to lower the entry barrier and actually raise it. 



semiprime799 said:


> Another categorization I think we have missed is the idea of sub-X eras.
> Where we have people averaging sub-10 etc.


This is an incremental change, not a "generational" change.


----------



## EngiNerdBrian (Aug 10, 2020)

semiprime799 said:


> I'm not sure on the magnets bit, but...
> 
> I think customizable cubes will lower the bar of entry for new-gen cubers. Another categorization I think we have missed is the idea of sub-X eras.
> Where we have people averaging sub-10 etc.





One Wheel said:


> I disagree. You can buy excellent cubes that need little or no setup very cheap, "customizable" cubes are more expensive. It's still a relatively cheap hobby, but customizable cubes do nothing to lower the entry barrier and actually raise it.
> 
> 
> This is an incremental change, not a "generational" change.


Agreed. Sub-x is not “generation” of cubers since you could reach say sub-30 and be a cuber from the 80s, early 2000s, or current gen. Times are irrelevant to this grouping.


----------



## semiprime799 (Aug 10, 2020)

EngineeringBrian said:


> Agreed. Sub-x is not “generation” of cubers since you could reach say sub-30 and be a cuber from the 80s, early 2000s, or current gen. Times are irrelevant to this grouping.


When I was saying times I think I was referring to world records. idk


----------



## zslane (Aug 10, 2020)

I'm a 1st Gen cuber who has picked up cubing three different times in his life. First time was in 1981 when the cube first hit big in the U.S.. Second time was in 2007 when I got curious about it again, but lost interest again after a couple of months. And then most recently, two months ago when I got curious about it yet again. This is the first time, however, that I've ever progressed beyond a beginner method on the 3x3, and the first time I've ever tried something other than the classic 3x3 (I recently learned how to solve a 5x5).

In fact, I still have 1980s-era Rubik's cube lying about somewhere.


----------



## BenChristman1 (Aug 10, 2020)

zslane said:


> In fact, I still have 1980s-era Rubik's cube lying about somewhere.


Are you looking for a new cube? That would make you a lot faster.


----------



## zslane (Aug 10, 2020)

Back in 2007 I bought a pair of Rubik's DIY cubes and a stickerless Dayan Zhanchi, which were way better than the original cube. Now I have many new cubes--some budget-level and some flagship-level--and have been slowly improving my solve times.


----------



## EngiNerdBrian (Aug 10, 2020)

zslane said:


> This is the first time, however, that I've ever progressed beyond a beginner method on the 3x3, and the first time I've ever tried something other than the classic 3x3 (I recently learned how to solve a 5x5.


And down the rabbit hole we go; exploring new puzzles is my favorite part of this pastime.


----------



## BenChristman1 (Aug 10, 2020)

EngineeringBrian said:


> And down the rabbit hole we go; exploring new puzzles is my favorite part of this pastime.


That’s another cool thing about cubing. You can focus on collecting and solving new puzzles, you can speedcube, and more!


----------

