# Avoiding OLL and PLL parity



## UB (Feb 20, 2014)

Hello Guys
I came across this topic and just to give it a try, I tried this method and my use of OLL and PLL parity has reduced and it has cut 15 off my avg. (currently avg 1:45 min)






But still sometimes I use Parity algs when it is inevitable  and my OLL parity is heck slow....


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## ottozing (Feb 20, 2014)

>How to avoid OLL parity
>Doesn't work every solve

Are you kidding me? -_-


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## brian724080 (Feb 20, 2014)

Or just learn to love parity


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## AmazingCuber (Feb 20, 2014)

how does this avoid parity?
edit: ninja'd


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## UB (Feb 20, 2014)

ottozing said:


> >How to avoid OLL parity
> >Doesn't work every solve
> 
> Are you kidding me? -_-



Happened with me, but is helpful. Earlier after doing f2l if I had 1 edge oriented, I used to use OLL parity 3 times and solve the OLL, but now I do this method and do OLL Parity once and my OLL is done 
Pretty Handy Method 

Hey LACuber, waiting for your next video. You 24x7 on internet ??


AmazingCuber said:


> how does this avoid parity?
> edit: ninja'd


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## Tim Major (Feb 20, 2014)

EPIC NOOB!!


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## Goosly (Feb 20, 2014)

UB said:


> Earlier after doing f2l if I had 1 edge oriented, I used to use OLL parity 3 times and solve the OLL, but now I do this method and do OLL Parity once and my OLL is done
> Pretty Handy Method



what


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## brian724080 (Feb 20, 2014)

UB said:


> Happened with me, but is helpful. Earlier after doing f2l if I had 1 edge oriented, I used to use OLL parity 3 times and solve the OLL, but now I do this method and do OLL Parity once and my OLL is done


Use OLL parity three times?



Tim Major said:


> EPIC NOOB!!


Confirmed

Serious suggestion: learn how to deal with parity in big cubes, and this is basically it.

Also, the top right graphic in the thumbnail of the video is completely wrong, you can't swap the edges like that via turning or disassembling.


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## AmazingCuber (Feb 20, 2014)

UB said:


> Happened with me, but is helpful. Earlier after doing f2l if I had 1 edge oriented, I used to use OLL parity 3 times and solve the OLL, but now I do this method and do OLL Parity once and my OLL is done
> Pretty Handy Method
> 
> Hey LACuber, waiting for your next video. You 24x7 on internet ??



Well, this is the normal OLL method, you were just doing it wrong before. 

The MoYu Weisu review is coming soon, why don't you subscribe to not miss it?


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## UB (Feb 20, 2014)

AmazingCuber said:


> Well, this is the normal OLL method, you were just doing it wrong before.
> 
> The MoYu Weisu review is coming soon, why don't you subscribe to not miss it?


I am already subbed... so how to solve the oll and pll in a 4x4 cube ??



brian724080 said:


> Use OLL parity three times?
> 
> 
> Confirmed
> ...



So how to solve the 4x4 oll and pll with doing the oll and pll from a 3x3 cube


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## AmazingCuber (Feb 20, 2014)

UB said:


> I am already subbed... so how to solve the oll and pll in a 4x4 cube ??
> 
> 
> 
> So how to solve the 4x4 oll and pll with doing the oll and pll from a 3x3 cube



How you solve it now is correct and normal, it doesn't avoid any parity.

Oh yeah thanks for subbing!


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## brian724080 (Feb 20, 2014)

UB said:


> I am already subbed... so how to solve the oll and pll in a 4x4 cube ??
> 
> So how to solve the 4x4 oll and pll with doing the oll and pll from a 3x3 cube



Here's how you do it (easiest way - pretty much what you're doing right now):

Perform OLL parity if an odd number of edges are oriented
Perform the OLL algorithm
Perform PLL parity if the case does not belong in PLL
Perform the PLL algorithm

As for the thumbnail - try cycling the edges according to your diagram...


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## UB (Feb 20, 2014)

There are OLL Algs and PLL algs for 4x4 ??
Can someone refer me to a website ?? for the algs

And Brian: Thanks, I think I did understand a little what you said


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## brian724080 (Feb 20, 2014)

UB said:


> There are OLL Algs and PLL algs for 4x4 ??
> Can someone refer me to a website ?? for the algs
> 
> And Brian: Thanks, I think I did understand a little what you said



You just use the last layer algs as you do for a 3x3, because all the centers and edges are paired up to basically simulate a 3x3.


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## mark49152 (Feb 20, 2014)

Is it just me, or is that video just a confusing mess of misinformation?


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## Stefan (Feb 20, 2014)

mark49152 said:


> Is it just me, or is that video just a confusing mess of misinformation?



It's just you. The video is groundbreaking.


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## XTowncuber (Feb 20, 2014)

And all this time I've been doing OLL parity three times. Not.


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## mark49152 (Feb 20, 2014)

brian724080 said:


> Here's how you do it (easiest way - pretty much what you're doing right now):
> 
> Perform OLL parity if an odd number of edges are oriented
> Perform the OLL algorithm
> ...


I find that recognition is easier and faster to do it as 4LLL:-

Perform one of two OLL parity algs resulting in EO
Perform OCLL
Perform CPLL
Perform EPLL with extra algs for parity cases
See these: OLL and EPLL.

Sometimes of course an easy-to-recognise OLL or PLL pops up and there's no need for 2-look, which is great, but if not, I'd rather do the above with no pause than waste 1-2 secs trying to recognize a parity-struck PLL (and maybe getting it wrong).


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## brian724080 (Feb 20, 2014)

mark49152 said:


> I find that recognition is easier and faster to do it as 4LLL:-
> 
> Perform one of two OLL parity algs resulting in EO
> Perform OCLL
> ...



Good point, I just do PLL parity if I don't see a PLL case. I don't quite understand your first step, would you care to elaborate?


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## TDM (Feb 20, 2014)

brian724080 said:


> I don't quite understand your first step, would you care to elaborate?


If you have a non-OLL parity case, do normal OLL for steps 1+2, or just orient the edges with F/f sexy F'/f'. If you have parity, you can orient edges through either the OLL parity alg or B' R' OLL parity R B. That's one look to orient all the edges.
Mark, you could also combine steps 2 and 3 with COLL, which is a useful alg set to learn. Just a suggestion


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## mark49152 (Feb 20, 2014)

brian724080 said:


> Good point, I just do PLL parity if I don't see a PLL case.


Generally, negative recognition is slower than positive recognition. So if you see an F-perm and positively recognise that as an F-perm in 0.3 seconds then great, job done, no need to think further, just execute your F-perm alg. But recognising by process of elimination that your PLL is a parity case takes longer - "I don't recognise that, could be a G-perm but that edge looks wrong, hang on, let me check the back, nope, that's definitely parity".

Corner cases are never affected by parity though so recognising and executing an A- or V-perm (or whatever you prefer) can be done really quickly leaving you with a much easier to recognise EPLL case. 

It is of course possible to positively recognise PLL parity just by looking at the edges, but for some reason I find this hard when the corners aren't solved, and besides, 2-look also has the advantage that you don't need to master as many LL algs for bigger cubes - most of my 3x3 PLLs I find much harder to finger trick on 4x4+. No more G-perms 



brian724080 said:


> I don't quite understand your first step, would you care to elaborate?


Assuming you mean EO, there are two parity cases - either 1 or 3 edges misoriented. When one edge is misoriented, just do your regular parity alg to flip it. When three are misoriented, the "normal" approach would be to flip one so that you now have 2 or 4 edges oriented (or 0 if you really screw it up ). Then you do a regular OLL, but of course, you don't really know what OLL case you're going to get and it could be a longer one or one that's not big-cube friendly. 

However, with a simple 2-move setup, you can make your parity alg flip 3 edges instead, so that after parity you always have all edges oriented. Then you know you'll always get an OCLL case.

Edit:


TDM said:


> Mark, you could also combine steps 2 and 3 with COLL, which is a useful alg set to learn. Just a suggestion


Indeed, I know 1-2 of the Pi/H cases, but I only have so much memory capacity


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## TDM (Feb 20, 2014)

mark49152 said:


> Indeed, I know 1-2 of the Pi/H cases, but I only have so much memory capacity


I found the U cases very easy to learn. One is two sunes, one is R2 D' R U2 R' D R U2 R, one is the front/back mirror, one is very similar to R2 D' R U2 R' D R U2 R: it's *x* R2 *D2* R U2 R' *D2* R U2 R, and one is R' Y perm R. The other one I use F sexy F' then ELL for; I don't know how to do it as a COLL.


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## brian724080 (Feb 20, 2014)

Thanks for the thorough explanations, I'll start dealing with parity that way.


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## yoshinator (Feb 20, 2014)

Since this has essentially turned into a discussion about how to recognize PLL+PLL parity (thank god), I'll just say that I know every case, and with the exception of O perms, can one-look (2 alg) PLL even if I have parity.


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## brian724080 (Feb 20, 2014)

yoshinator said:


> Since this has essentially turned into a discussion about how to recognize PLL+PLL parity (thank god), I'll just say that I know every case, and with the exception of O perms, can one-look (2 alg) PLL even if I have parity.



Do you have the list of algorithms anywhere?


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## mark49152 (Feb 20, 2014)

TDM said:


> I found the U cases very easy to learn.


A while ago after I did my OLL move count study, I also looked at COLL and compared move counts of EOLL/COLL/EPLL to OLL/PLL. My conclusion was that the move count was only significantly better in a handful of cases. There are other pros and cons though, like increased chance of PLL skip and the extra look required. (Of course if you're doing ZZ or anything else that pre-orients edges, it's a different question.)

If I get time I will dig out that study and rework it for 4x4. It may well be that it gives enough of an advantage to make more of the cases worthwhile.


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## Stefan (Feb 20, 2014)

ChickenWrap said:


> You cannot just "avoid" parity!



Yes you can (avoid OLL parity, haven't thought about PLL parity, but probably is reasonably possible as well).


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## TDM (Feb 20, 2014)

ChickenWrap said:


> True. I meant edge parity, sorry. But the video doesn't even explain how to avoid anything! You would assume that since the video said "for cubes 4x4 - 7x7" that he would talk about avoiding edge parity.


I would assume that since the title talks about "OLL and PLL parity" that he would talk about OLL and PLL parity.


brian724080 said:


> Do you have the list of algorithms anywhere?


Parity PLL.doc


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## TDM (Feb 20, 2014)

ChickenWrap said:


> Since when do 5x5 and 7x7 have OLL or PLL parity though?


My exact thought when I saw the video title. They don't.


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## kcl (Feb 20, 2014)

Well, they have parity but you solve it during edge pairing rather than OLL.


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