# Maybe exclusive cliquishness needs to stop.



## aridus (Mar 13, 2011)

I'm seeing this go on lately, and while I realize there are differences between people who "cube" and people who don't, I also see that some people seem to _exhibit excessive tightness of the posterior region_.

I don't need validation from people who don't understand why I solve cubes, and I certainly don't need _yours_ or anyone else's either. Rather do it *entirely alone* than associate with some of the type of people I've seen lately. I could live with that, totally, if that's what it comes down to.


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## PatrickJameson (Mar 13, 2011)

Ironic that you want to create your own exclusiveness to escape some perceived cliquishness and then publicize this exclusiveness to everyone.

lolsoz that was mean. For seriousness, we're not all bad. Come to the chatroom if you want 8).

Edit: Yeah, reading it over and over, your post's structure is completely off. My interpretation is probably wrong.


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## aridus (Mar 13, 2011)

Nah, I was just being very general. It could be applied to a lot of things. I just left it very open as to what I'm talking about.


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## Dene (Mar 13, 2011)

Get over it. There will be cliques wherever you go in life. Like seriously, where do you get the right to go around telling people not to have a group of friends?

The only thing that gives a clique any sort of authority such that you would be compelled to make a thread like this is only a perceived superiority. If you don't perceive any clique as having any sort of authority then they won't. 

Also, any particular clique that you might be having trouble with has probably earned the right to the perceived superiority that they have, for whichever reason. Basically, what I'm trying to say is that respect is given when it has been earned. Therefore it is probably the case that any clique that you may have a problem with has earned the right to be tight-asses. Perhaps you feel that they haven't, but not having the balls to come out and say anything straight makes it extremely difficult for you to do anything about it.


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## aridus (Mar 14, 2011)

Dene said:


> Get over it. There will be cliques wherever you go in life. Like seriously, where do you get the right to go around telling people not to have a group of friends?
> 
> The only thing that gives a clique any sort of authority such that you would be compelled to make a thread like this is only a perceived superiority. If you don't perceive any clique as having any sort of authority then they won't.
> 
> Also, any particular clique that you might be having trouble with has probably earned the right to the perceived superiority that they have, for whichever reason. Basically, what I'm trying to say is that respect is given when it has been earned. Therefore it is probably the case that any clique that you may have a problem with has earned the right to be tight-asses. Perhaps you feel that they haven't, but not having the balls to come out and say anything straight makes it extremely difficult for you to do anything about it.


 
Hey, people can do whatever they want. I can't actually _stop_ anyone. BUT I CAN COMPLAIN ABOUT IT. 

It's not "difficult to do anything about it", its _impossible_. And I know that. Nobody "earns", all ASSUME. Even me. 

Talking is not doing. All I can do is say "hey, I don't like you." Same as anyone else. The difference is some people feel it is justified when they do it and others disagree. The alternative is going around punching people in the face, and I'm not that type of person.


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## Dene (Mar 14, 2011)

Of course it isn't impossible. If you feel you have compelling reason to bring down a clique then you could present your arguments in a logical manner and let other people decide for themselves. The other way to go about it would be to build up your own clique as a "rival" clique and "take over" in a way. 

As for your statement that nobody earns (the perceived authority), I believe that you are wrong. I can assure you that there are cliques of morons around here and they don't have any perceived authority at all. The reason for that is because they are morons, therefore do not earn any perceived authority. You might even say that nobody would _assume_ that they have any authority. So in a sense, earning perceived authority is the same thing as people assuming it.

Like I say, it would be possible to do something about it. I would suggest that instead of making silly threads that only cause neutral observers to perceive you as someone to look down upon, you take the time to integrate yourself into the community so that people come to perceive you as a respectable character, whether alone or as a part of a clique, so that you earn the right yourself to pass your opinions by the community. (In saying this I am not implying that I myself am in this situation; to be perfectly honest I don't give a rats _posterior region_ what anybody thinks of me; I say what I want and how people choose to respond is up to them).


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## aridus (Mar 14, 2011)

Dene said:


> Of course it isn't impossible. If you feel you have compelling reason to bring down a clique then you could present your arguments in a logical manner and let other people decide for themselves.


History disagrees strongly. Politics in practice does as well. Watch any political debate or election. People act no differently here. The only time it has the_ illusion _of working is when groupthink is disguised as "success". 



> The other way to go about it would be to build up your own clique as a "rival" clique and "take over" in a way.


I don't want more rivals. I want less.



> As for your statement that nobody earns (the perceived authority), I believe that you are wrong. I can assure you that there are cliques of morons around here and they don't have any perceived authority at all. The reason for that is because they are morons, therefore do not earn any perceived authority. You might even say that nobody would _assume_ that they have any authority. So in a sense, earning perceived authority is the same thing as people assuming it.


One can only "earn" something in the eyes of another. It clearly depends on the perceptions of people. There is no universal way to say someone earns something, and there is no universal authority. There is only self claimed authority or authority given by others based on _their_ perceptions. "Earning" means "prove yourself to me/us". Who gives the authority to demand such a thing? 



> Like I say, it would be possible to do something about it. I would suggest that instead of making silly threads that only cause neutral observers to perceive you as someone to look down upon, you take the time to integrate yourself into the community so that people come to perceive you as a respectable character, whether alone or as a part of a clique, so that you earn the right yourself to pass your opinions by the community. (In saying this I am not implying that I myself am in this situation; to be perfectly honest I don't give a rats _posterior region_ what anybody thinks of me; I say what I want and how people choose to respond is up to them).


 If it was a group I wanted to be a part of, they'd already be hearing me.


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## AvGalen (Mar 14, 2011)

[mean song]
so you can choose which group you want to belong to (original or hyper):








[/mean song]



Spoiler



We have started a club, for people with an ugly face, you belong in the club, you belong in the club


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## aridus (Mar 14, 2011)




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## FatBoyXPC (Mar 14, 2011)

I think I understand your opinion on some of the cliques here, but I don't think it's right to generalize all of them because of a few (or many, or whatever) cliques have tainted your taste for them.

I strongly agree with you: There are some cliques in the community that the way they act is quite irritating. I also would say though that there are some incredibly friendly cliques. Not all of them are bad. I share your opinion in that at least one group of people like to think they are superior to you and above you, for whatever reason. Their reason need not be justified, but because they hold some sort of popularity with a few others, they feel like they are always in the correct. This doesn't mean they all act this way.

Have you been to any competitions yet? You'll quickly see everybody splits off into groups, but groups mingle quite a bit too. You'll see groups of 5 or so over there, 7 or 8 guys over there, but then you'll see people floating around and what not. You'll often find the same core group of people (Jim, Chester, Shaden, Mike), but anybody is welcome to come hang out.

Cliques here on SS are a bit different, and personalities are just different online anyway.

It appears to me that a decent handful of people think Dene isn't a nice guy, but (to my knowledge) Dene and I seem to get along just fine. I don't think he's mean at all, he tells you how it is, and a lot of times people can't handle that. Of course Dene belongs to a (few) clique(s), but he's pretty approachable.

Complaining about a clique publicly won't get you anywhere either. I had a discussion one evening with Lucas Garron about this, while I was annoyed with how some people were acting.

At best, just find your own group of friends, and ignore those that you don't like (or that don't like you).


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## Kirjava (Mar 14, 2011)

Am I the only one who hasn't noticed any cliques?


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## StachuK1992 (Mar 14, 2011)

Kirjava said:


> Am I the only one who hasn't noticed any cliques?


 nope.

Perhaps it would help if OP listed some cliques?


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## aridus (Mar 14, 2011)

fatboyxpc said:


> I think I understand your opinion on some of the cliques here, but I don't think it's right to generalize all of them because of a few (or many, or whatever) cliques have tainted your taste for them.
> 
> I strongly agree with you: There are some cliques in the community that the way they act is quite irritating. I also would say though that there are some incredibly friendly cliques. Not all of them are bad. I share your opinion in that at least one group of people like to think they are superior to you and above you, for whatever reason. Their reason need not be justified, but because they hold some sort of popularity with a few others, they feel like they are always in the correct. This doesn't mean they all act this way.
> 
> ...


 
Yeah, you're probably right. Maybe it's just the internet being more impersonal and all that. 

I just think it's a bit silly to see what some might consider to be outcasts of outcasts outcasting other outcasts. Not that I consider cubers outcasts at all, but I know of some who would like us to think that. 

Maybe this was just my attempt at pointing out a cruel irony, gone horribly wrong.


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## FatBoyXPC (Mar 14, 2011)

aridus said:


> I just think it's a bit silly to see what some might consider to be outcasts of outcasts outcasting other outcasts. Not that I consider cubers outcasts at all, but I know of some who would like us to think that.




When I was talking about this with Lucas, this was pretty much my thought. You can't avoid cliques though, no matter where you go. People just group together, you'll see it wherever you go. You find people that you get along with and stick with them, that's just how it goes man.

I think had you said what I quoted, instead of ranting, this thread would have gone a bit differently. But all in all, nobody wants to put up with somebody they can't tolerate, so they wouldn't be in a group with those type of people.


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## Dene (Mar 14, 2011)

fatboyxpc said:


> Of course Dene belongs to a (few) clique(s)



Nevar.



fatboyxpc said:


> but he's pretty approachable.



Then I must be doing something wrong.



aridus said:


> One can only "earn" something in the eyes of another. It clearly depends on the perceptions of people. There is no universal way to say someone earns something, and there is no universal authority. There is only self claimed authority or authority given by others based on _their_ perceptions. "Earning" means "prove yourself to me/us". Who gives the authority to demand such a thing?



If this is what you are going to argue for then there is no point to this continuing. It's a completely different debate and has no basis in the social world. Perhaps you should read some Wittgenstein to get an idea of my views on this subject.


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## aridus (Mar 15, 2011)

Dene said:


> If this is what you are going to argue for then there is no point to this continuing. It's a completely different debate and has no basis in the social world. Perhaps you should read some Wittgenstein to get an idea of my views on this subject.


I know about that guy. I don't like him either. 

This should be taken as a joke.


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## Bapao (Mar 15, 2011)

> Am I the only one who hasn't noticed any cliques?



I haven't either. Feel like a dunce for not noticing...


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## crashdummy001 (Mar 16, 2011)

this forum is a clique. if you have 100+ posts, you're immune to everything. You can post garbage, spam, be a postwhore, insult others, be inappropriate, break rules, and do whatever you please without being frowned upon. If you have less than 100 posts, you're treated as a pile of crap no matter what good you do. Everyone looks down upon you and moderators ban you for no reason because they think that every post you make is spam.


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## Kirjava (Mar 16, 2011)

crashdummy001 said:


> this forum is a clique. if you have 100+ posts, you're immune to everything. You can post garbage, spam, be a postwhore, insult others, be inappropriate, break rules, and do whatever you please without being frowned upon.


 
If only.


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## StachuK1992 (Mar 16, 2011)

Let's play a game of name (the person above yours') clique!

New guy that hates old guys.
> was aimed at crashtestdummy001

For Kir:
#rubik, trolls


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## maggot (Mar 16, 2011)

OP: dont be uptight! we are all very cool! there are some characters in our community, but they're all very cool too! i think the clique you are talking of is nothing but a strong bond between senior members and cubers of much skill. a lot of these characters in our community will strike an argument at the drop of a hat over spelling and grammatical errors (cough stefan (even though he's gotten much more calm about it)), stupid stuff! but these characters are some of the most intelligent and interesting people! 

there are millions of inside jokes, things other than cubing in which many people share interest (i.e. math= mike, chris, stefan, etc.). . . it is only natural. . 

at competition, i assume that a lot of the segregation comes from relationships online, ability, and more importantly age groups. maybe im ignorant, but if i went to a comp, even if they were faster than me, i wouldnt be hanging out with a 12 year old kid.

for stachu: #rubik, cool people that make a name for themselves even though they arent WR holders clique, dans little brother clique


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## Andrew Ricci (Mar 17, 2011)

crashdummy001 said:


> this forum is a clique. if you have 100+ posts, you're immune to everything. You can post garbage, spam, be a postwhore, insult others, be inappropriate, break rules, and do whatever you please without being frowned upon. If you have less than 100 posts, you're treated as a pile of crap no matter what good you do. Everyone looks down upon you and moderators ban you for no reason because they think that every post you make is spam.


 
Don't assume so much. You may see a person flaming, spamming, etc. and the moderators say nothing, but if it is reported by someone, that person who posted will most likely be given an infraction. Just because there isn't a big scene doesn't mean nothing has happened and the person won't get consequences. I have accumulated two infractions and I highly doubt anyone has noticed. 

Finally, 100 posts is in no way the threshold for never getting penalized. Both of my infractions were obtained after 200 posts. Spend some more time on the forum, ask, listen, and try not to judge without real proof.


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## StachuK1992 (Mar 17, 2011)

maggot said:


> dans little brother clique


 What?


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## Dene (Mar 17, 2011)

crashdummy001 said:


> this forum is a clique. if you have 100+ posts, you're immune to everything. You can post garbage, spam, be a postwhore, insult others, be inappropriate, break rules, and do whatever you please without being frowned upon. If you have less than 100 posts, you're treated as a pile of crap no matter what good you do. Everyone looks down upon you and moderators ban you for no reason because they think that every post you make is spam.


 
Lolcake.


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## aridus (Mar 17, 2011)

maggot said:


> OP: dont be uptight! we are all very cool! there are some characters in our community, but they're all very cool too! i think the clique you are talking of is nothing but a strong bond between senior members and cubers of much skill. a lot of these characters in our community will strike an argument at the drop of a hat over spelling and grammatical errors (cough stefan (even though he's gotten much more calm about it)), stupid stuff! but these characters are some of the most intelligent and interesting people!
> 
> there are millions of inside jokes, things other than cubing in which many people share interest (i.e. math= mike, chris, stefan, etc.). . . it is only natural. .
> 
> ...


 
Yeah, I realize I was out of line a bit. I'm not very social by nature so I don't always "get it."

I just don't understand how people are some times. I'm pretty tolerant in reality except in extreme cases. I don't have many friends per se, but I can still associate even with people that I dislike in some way. I just don't get some kind of "connection" out of it; that is something I don't truly understand. I may not agree with how some people act, and some annoy me, but that doesn't mean I hate them or can't talk to them.


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## maggot (Mar 17, 2011)

StachuK1992 said:


> What?


 
LMAO i couldnt think of anything ; w; it seems noone is playing your game


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## Dene (Mar 17, 2011)

aridus said:


> I just don't understand how people are some times. I'm pretty tolerant in reality except in extreme cases. I don't have many friends per se, but I can still associate even with people that I dislike in some way. I just don't get some kind of "connection" out of it; that is something I don't truly understand. I may not agree with how some people act, and some annoy me, but that doesn't mean I hate them or can't talk to them.


 
I think you read way too much into comments. I'm pretty sure most people on these forums don't hate others around here. I mean, there would be some people that hate other people for whatever reason they choose, but that would usually be for something more personal that happened. Insulting someone does not mean that one hates that person. Most likely they are completely indifferent to who the person is, and are merely commenting on what they have said and are not too concerned with the person behind the comments.


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## aridus (Mar 17, 2011)

Interesting. I'll try to keep it in mind.


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## miniGOINGS (Mar 17, 2011)

Where can I find an application form? I want to join a clique...


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