# Freestyle Tutorial?



## CubeLord (Jan 18, 2010)

Does anyone have a freestyle tutorial for edges and corners?


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## Muesli (Jan 18, 2010)

Surely Freestyle means you do it anyway you feel like it so you can't make a tutorial.


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## puzzlemaster (Jan 18, 2010)

lolthread.


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## CubeLord (Jan 18, 2010)

CubeLord said:


> Does anyone have a freestyle tutorial for edges and corners?


When I say Freestyle, I mean the one with making up commutators


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## Jokerman5656 (Jan 18, 2010)

Freestyle 
1) Refers to music (usually rap and sometimes techno) where everything is made up as they go along. In rap, people make up lyrics as they go along, but in techno, the DJ improvises beats and mixes songs on the spot.
*2) A move in sports (especially extreme sports) where someone pulls off a stunt that doesnt really follow any guidelines for any regular move.*
Courtesy of Urban Dictionary


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## Stini (Jan 18, 2010)

I guess this might interest you:

http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12268


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## amostay2004 (Jan 18, 2010)

I would actually like a freestyle (BLD) tutorial as well. Yes, freestyle means doing anything you can think of to solve a particular piece/pieces so there can't be a proper method to teach it but it also means there are so many to learn from freestylers out there, since people can view a certain case from different perspectives and use different methods to solve it.

Tutorials, in this context, would just mean example solves of freestyle BLD or at least guidelines on what are the common methods for solving different cases. I say this because I'm also attempting to learn freestyle but I'm not sure if what I know is really sufficient enough. 

I'm sure pro freestylers like Alex Yu and Ville Seppanen have pretty rigid form of freestyling having done thousands upon thousands of solves and it would be really useful to get tips from them.


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## puzzlemaster (Jan 18, 2010)

amostay2004 said:


> I would actually like a freestyle (BLD) tutorial as well. Yes, freestyle means doing anything you can think of to solve a particular piece/pieces so there can't be a proper method to teach it but it also means there are so many to learn from freestylers out there, since people can view a certain case from different perspectives and use different methods to solve it.
> 
> Tutorials, in this context, would just mean example solves of freestyle BLD or at least guidelines on what are the common methods for solving different cases. I say this because I'm also attempting to learn freestyle but I'm not sure if what I know is really sufficient enough.
> 
> I'm sure pro freestylers like *Alex Yu* and Ville Seppanen have pretty rigid form of freestyling having done thousands upon thousands of solves and it would be really useful to get tips from them.



Doesn't Alex just use 3OP?


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## Sakarie (Jan 18, 2010)

If you want to learn freestyle, learn commutators. When you know commutators well enough, you can do freestyle.

Yes, the BH-tutorial may absolutely help, but Chris's list of (move-)optimal commutators for corners helped me more.

http://speedcubing.com/chris/bhcorners.html


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## yoruichi (Jan 18, 2010)

no mang no uso 3op 
3op es para los nubes
la orientacion no es necesario para ganar
ademas no soy un pro freestyler


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## Weston (Jan 18, 2010)

yoruichi said:


> no mang no uso 3op
> 3op es para los nubes
> la orientacion no es necesario para ganar
> ademas no soy un pro freestyler



Yes you are.


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## cmhardw (Jan 19, 2010)

I don't understand why this has to be a "lolthread" :confused:

It reminds me of this:


> Also if you can't solve it, be more intuitive and if you practice hard you will get it



Surely freestyle BLD *must* be more quantifiable than "just be more freestlye and you will get it."

I think what the OP is asking for is specific examples of how to handle specific cases. And don't just go with the now cliche "Well it's freestyle, so like freestyle your way through how totally freestyle it is, and the magic of freestyle is that the freestyle will solve your cube, like totally freestyle."

Chris


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## Mike Hughey (Jan 19, 2010)

I still think BH is the way to go on this. If you want to learn freestyle, a good way to do it is first learn BH (since it's really not that hard to learn). Then optimize. Voilà - freestyle!


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## Escher (Jan 19, 2010)

I suggest to make freestyle easier for yourself, get good at commutating pieces, learn ELL and learn everything in this: http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showthread.php?t=393
Learning BH would be a great idea too.

Clue: specific questions gives you specific answers.


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## Lucas Garron (Jan 19, 2010)

amostay2004 said:


> I'm sure pro freestylers like Alex Yu and Ville Seppanen have pretty rigid form of freestyling having done thousands upon thousands of solves and it would be really useful to get tips from them.


It's well-established that this _is_ BH.

Anyhow, there are quite a lot of freestyle solutions written up in this forum.
Also, I can offer this and this.


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## amostay2004 (Jan 19, 2010)

Lucas Garron said:


> Anyhow, there are quite a lot of freestyle solutions written up in this forum.
> Also, I can offer this and this.



Thanks Lucas! Didn't notice the edge algorithms at your site before, probably because I'm focusing more on corners right now. 

I've also found this to be pretty helpful. Perhaps we should have more of these? Corners are a pain in the [email protected]#$


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## yoruichi (Jan 20, 2010)

hey garron the BH list has some weird algs that arnt fast to do
in conclusion freestyle is just a silly name for 3 cyle except that u can use algs from other places 2.


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## puzzlemaster (Jan 20, 2010)

I understand the basics of BH...however how would you memorize the cycles? I'm used to classic pochmann for corners and M2 for edges...is there a way to utilize letters and visual memo to memorize for BH? Any tips?


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## cmhardw (Jan 20, 2010)

puzzlemaster said:


> I understand the basics of BH...however how would you memorize the cycles? I'm used to classic pochmann for corners and M2 for edges...is there a way to utilize letters and visual memo to memorize for BH? Any tips?



Study all the commutators of the same name type. For example if you look at every case labeled "columns" you will find that you are actually doing the same exact moves, just from a different angle. Study how the pieces move in relation to each other, not which specific turns you apply to the cube.

Daniel and I have intended to write a guide on how to do BH more intuitive style, but alas this has not yet happened. The alg lists will have to suffice for a while.

I can assure you that it is not memorizing algs, but learning how to apply the commutator type (the name) to a different angle.

Chris


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## puzzlemaster (Jan 20, 2010)

cmhardw said:


> puzzlemaster said:
> 
> 
> > I understand the basics of BH...however how would you memorize the cycles? I'm used to classic pochmann for corners and M2 for edges...is there a way to utilize letters and visual memo to memorize for BH? Any tips?
> ...



My apologies. You misunderstood my question and this was probably because of my wording . How do you memorize the cycles when memorizing the cube before solving? (hope that cleared up the confusion)


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## cmhardw (Jan 20, 2010)

puzzlemaster said:


> My apologies. You misunderstood my question and this was probably because of my wording . How do you memorize the cycles when memorizing the cube before solving? (hope that cleared up the confusion)



Oh I gotcha. For me personally the cycle shape is completely disconnected from the memorization aspect. Each piece has a letter, two pieces combine two letters to make either a word or image which I place into a prepared mental route. I don't ever picture the cycle shape or structure. Of course for visual memory you can picture things like triangles or Z shapes or things that you see as if a string is being stretched through the inside of the cube from one piece to the next. I also sometimes thought about it as a journey from one side of a "house" to the other or something silly like that.

I hope I interpreted your question correctly?

Chris


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## puzzlemaster (Jan 20, 2010)

cmhardw said:


> puzzlemaster said:
> 
> 
> > My apologies. You misunderstood my question and this was probably because of my wording . How do you memorize the cycles when memorizing the cube before solving? (hope that cleared up the confusion)
> ...



I'm getting the idea. However for example: lets say that we name URB piece "1", name DRF piece "2", and DLF piece "3". How would you memorize that you need to do THAT cycle? I understand what you mean with a mental route. But for example if you associate that cycle with a tree. You said that all the commutators are just one commutator from each class from a different angle. If the cycle is with a cube rotation, would you picture a tree...on it's side? I'm not understanding exactly how you memorize. Maybe because blind is not my forte but i'd like to get decent at BH. After learning how the commutators work, is there any way that you can teach a way for memorizing it? Maybe like a 3OP memo?

EDIT: Also, for an intuitive tutorial...how about just listing the basic cases? one from each "class"? I'm sure that the rest can be figured out from there.


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## cmhardw (Jan 20, 2010)

puzzlemaster said:


> I'm getting the idea. However for example: lets say that we name URB piece "1", name DRF piece "2", and DLF piece "3". How would you memorize that you need to do THAT cycle? I understand what you mean with a mental route. But for example if you associate that cycle with a tree. You said that all the commutators are just one commutator from each class from a different angle. If the cycle is with a cube rotation, would you picture a tree...on it's side? I'm not understanding exactly how you memorize. Maybe because blind is not my forte but i'd like to get decent at BH. After learning how the commutators work, is there any way that you can teach a way for memorizing it? Maybe like a 3OP memo?
> 
> EDIT: Also, for an intuitive tutorial...how about just listing the basic cases? one from each "class"? I'm sure that the rest can be figured out from there.



Oh ok, I think I definitely understand.

Basically, I don't know what the commutator type is based on memorized letters or image. I mean, some of the harder cases I do know by image, but for the most part I first decode the image to remember what the sticker cycle is. From there I imagine the sticker cycle and I picture all 3 stickers. This brings to mind the commutator type. So for example, once I can visualize the 3 stickers I know what all the "columns" cases look like, or the A9's from that point.

The memorization does not relate to which commutator you have, imagining where the stickers are in relation to each other brings to mind which commutator type you have. The memorization step does not really include this (expect in a very small set of special cases).

Chris


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## CubeLord (Jan 20, 2010)

So I've done 3OP and am now moving on to BH since that is what alot of people said to do. Where would you find a good BH Tutorial.


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## Swordsman Kirby (Jan 20, 2010)

Musli4brekkies said:


> Surely Freestyle means you do it anyway you feel like it so you can't make a tutorial.



I don't know of anyone considering, say, old Pochmann as "freestyle."


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## blah (Jan 20, 2010)

Swordsman Kirby said:


> Musli4brekkies said:
> 
> 
> > Surely Freestyle means you do it anyway you feel like it so you can't make a tutorial.
> ...


You don't know j`ey?


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## puzzlemaster (Jan 20, 2010)

cmhardw said:


> puzzlemaster said:
> 
> 
> > I'm getting the idea. However for example: lets say that we name URB piece "1", name DRF piece "2", and DLF piece "3". How would you memorize that you need to do THAT cycle? I understand what you mean with a mental route. But for example if you associate that cycle with a tree. You said that all the commutators are just one commutator from each class from a different angle. If the cycle is with a cube rotation, would you picture a tree...on it's side? I'm not understanding exactly how you memorize. Maybe because blind is not my forte but i'd like to get decent at BH. After learning how the commutators work, is there any way that you can teach a way for memorizing it? Maybe like a 3OP memo?
> ...



Is there any way that you could list the "basic" commutators needed to successfully do BH for both edges and corners? As far as cube rotations go, I can figure the rest out from there. However can this be done? If it's too much then don't worry about it. I'll learn it some other way.


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## joey (Jan 20, 2010)

blah said:


> Swordsman Kirby said:
> 
> 
> > Musli4brekkies said:
> ...


I just got owned D:


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## cmhardw (Jan 21, 2010)

puzzlemaster said:


> Is there any way that you could list the "basic" commutators needed to successfully do BH for both edges and corners? As far as cube rotations go, I can figure the rest out from there. However can this be done? If it's too much then don't worry about it. I'll learn it some other way.



I could type out a list of one commutator of each type that is easy to visualize or see, but I feel Brian's tutorial is already a good resource for this. Watch his videos, and follow along with his explanations of each type of commutator and see if this helps.

Chris


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## puzzlemaster (Jan 21, 2010)

I get the idea for corners. But there is no tutorial for edges. Could you type the basic algorithms for the edges?


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## cmhardw (Jan 22, 2010)

puzzlemaster said:


> I get the idea for corners. But there is no tutorial for edges. Could you type the basic algorithms for the edges?



Actually yeah, because it does not seem that currently there is a lot of explanation behind the theory of edges.

Just be aware that BH edges tends to be slower than freestyle edges, and Stefan, Joey, and I raced each other with sighted solves at the 2007 WC and realized that I could consistently beat them on corners using BH corners vs. R2 but they consistently beat me on time using M2 edges vs. BH edges. BH edges, IMO, are most powerful on a 5x5x5 or 7x7x7 for BLD.

I started a new thread on this topic.

Hope this helps,
Chris


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## Faz (Jan 22, 2010)

I remember matt had some stuff on freestyle corners, algs, examples.

http://www.youtube.com/rubixcubematt#p/u/8/6bEBHx8FE1k


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