# can you sub-2 all of your pll's



## rock1313 (Dec 15, 2010)

I just want to know if you can. I can sub-2 all of my pll's besides a stupid N perm.


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## Erzz (Dec 15, 2010)

try these Ns


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## qqwref (Dec 15, 2010)

I *can*. I usually don't.

I perform my N perms by first doing a z rotation and then doing the normal alg with U, R, and D moves.


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## rock1313 (Dec 15, 2010)

Erzz said:


> try these Ns



one of them is the one I already know and I can sub 2 it sometimes but the other one is preety good. way better than my other one. I may look foward to that in the future.


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## Faz (Dec 15, 2010)

Breandan said:


> I can sub-1 all of my pll's besides a stupid N perm.





Maybe he's done sub 1 on it, not sure.


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## Kian (Dec 15, 2010)

This is one of the many reasons I am slow. Not even close with the Ns, probably no G's (maybe on a rare occasion the RUR' one). Neither R is much better than 2. And E is my nemesis.


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## oprah62 (Dec 15, 2010)

Yes, my slowest is my Vperm at about 1.7x, and most of my G's are 1.6x. Most of the rest are sub 1.5,1.4, etc.


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## DavidWoner (Dec 15, 2010)

2 of the Gs are the only ones I can't sub-1.5


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## frogmanson (Dec 15, 2010)

I can for 2H, I'm working on sub-2 for all of my OH PLL right now.


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## BigSams (Dec 15, 2010)

Stupid Z perm.


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## ruff48 (Dec 15, 2010)

BigSams said:


> Stupid Z perm.


 
Uh, if you do it right it can be the second fastest one, as long as your cube has good M slice turns.


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## Zeat (Dec 15, 2010)

yeah, except N perms.
my faster pll is U and H = sub 1.
My slower pll is N and V = 2-3 sec :S


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## Ranzha (Dec 15, 2010)

Yes: UUHZAATJLRRY
No: EVFNN
Meh: GGGG


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## BigSams (Dec 15, 2010)

ruff48 said:


> Uh, if you do it right it can be the second fastest one, as long as your cube has good M slice turns.


 
My ring finger is like attached to my middle or something so I need wide turns T_T


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## Andreaillest (Dec 15, 2010)

Nope. Never really time my plls, but I'm sure I can't sub 2 them yet.


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## cmhardw (Dec 15, 2010)

BigSams said:


> My ring finger is like attached to my middle or something so I need wide turns T_T


 
On both hands? Can't you just use your other hand for the ring-middle combo?


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## Ranzha (Dec 15, 2010)

cmhardw said:


> On both hands? Can't you just use your other hand for the ring-middle combo?


 
Personally, I do a double-ring. It's nicer, imo.


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## rowehessler (Dec 15, 2010)

these are my plls at my fastest:
U: .85
U: .85
H: .85
Z: 1.1
A: .85
A: .85
T: .85
Y: 1.1
E: .85
J: .9
J: 1.1
R: 1.2
R: .95
G: 1.2
G:1.2
G: 1.2
G: 1.2
V: 1.3
F: 1.3
N: 1.4
N: 1.4

my Z perm sucks....and its kinda weird how my lefty R perm is faster than my right...


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## ~Phoenix Death~ (Dec 15, 2010)

Nope.


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## AvGalen (Dec 15, 2010)

Lots of people complaining about Z-Perm. It is one of my favorite, although I think I do it backwards from most:
R' U' R U'
R U R U'
R' U R U
R2 U' R' (U2)

(it is one of very few PLL's that I CAN do sub 2)


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## ~Adam~ (Dec 15, 2010)

I've got sub-2 singles on all but F, E and N's.


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## oyyq99999 (Dec 15, 2010)

rowehessler said:


> these are my plls at my fastest:
> U: .85
> U: .85
> H: .85
> ...


 
I can do one N-perm faster than you but the other twice your time.


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## irontwig (Dec 15, 2010)

BigSams said:


> My ring finger is like attached to my middle or something so I need wide turns T_T


 
I can sub-2 Z and I do it in RrU.


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## RCTACameron (Dec 15, 2010)

Although I can't always get this fast, I have been able to do all except F sub-2 just then.


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## rock1313 (Dec 15, 2010)

AvGalen said:


> Lots of people complaining about Z-Perm. It is one of my favorite, although I think I do it backwards from most:
> R' U' R U'
> R U R U'
> R' U R U
> ...



yea I like z perms too but their not my fastest


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## Dene (Dec 15, 2010)

I put all except 2-6 of them. Not sure exactly but I'm pretty sure most I can sub2 on a good go.


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## gasmus (Dec 15, 2010)

fazrulz said:


> Maybe he's done sub 1 on it, not sure.



nope:/ still stuck on 1.09

PLL single times:


Spoiler



(time attack order)
U- .6x
U- .7x
A- .7x
A- .7x
Z- .8x
H- .6x
E- .7x
T- .8x
V- .9x
F- .9x(not so sure about this one though, only done it a couple of times)
R- .9x
R- .8x
J- .7x
L- .6x
Y- .9x
G- .9x
G- .8x
G- .8x
G- .8x
N- .8x
N- 1.09

During solves my execution average is probably around 1.2 (w/o recognition time)


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## amostay2004 (Dec 15, 2010)

lol I see you managed to sub-1 one of the Ns  During UK Open you still couldn't sub-1 any of them right?


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## Cyrus C. (Dec 15, 2010)

I can't even sub-2 my H perm... my PLL takes 4 seconds in an average solve.


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## maxiovane (Dec 15, 2010)

U: 0.8
U: 0.8
H: 0.8
Z:0.9/1
T: 0.7
Y: 0.9
J1:0.8
J2: 0.9
A: 0.8
A2:0.8
G3:1.3
G4:1.2
F:1.0
V:1.2
E: 1.1
R1:1.1
R2:1.1
N1: 1.3
N2: 1.5
G1:1.16
G2:1.16


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## EricReese (Dec 15, 2010)

What m slice algorithm do you guys use for Z? Mine is not very good. I use M2 U2 M2 U2 M' U2 M2 U2 M' U M2 U' M2

Terriible. Z perm is my least favorite right along side N perm with the 2 pieces on the left side (If that makes sense). N(b) is the name?


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## ben1996123 (Dec 15, 2010)

Accw: 1.33
Acw: 1.42
E: 1.05
H: 0.97
Z: 1.45
Ucw: 0.66
Uccw: 1.17
R(good): 1.30
R(bad): 1.37
J(good): 0.98
J("sexy"): 1.10
T(awesome 13 move alg): 0.97
F: 1.59
Y: 1.49
V: 1.87
N'ccw': 1.61
N'cw': 1.92
Ga: 1.20
Gb: 0.92 
Gc: 1.62
Gd(rotationless): 1.49

All sub 2, all but 5 sub 1.5


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## James Ludlow (Dec 15, 2010)

I voted yes to all MY plls. I don't know full PLL though.


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## Reinier Schippers (Dec 15, 2010)

I'm stuck with E perm F perm and V perm does someone have a good alg for me ?


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## EricReese (Dec 15, 2010)

F perm is a nice case. I do R' U' F' then do T perm. But instead of F' at the end. Do U R. Its pretty dang easy to sub 2


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## cmhardw (Dec 15, 2010)

I can't sub-2 many of my PLLs, but Z perm is definitely one of the sub-2 ones. I use the MU alg when the U layer is mis-aligned by a U2, but otherwise I use the Dan Knights': l U' R' U (D R' D U') R' U R (D2 F). This is definitely a fast sub-2 alg, depsite the wristing effects.


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## EricReese (Dec 15, 2010)

Which MU alg is that? I know there are about 3 of them. I think Stachu told my brother of one. Then theres badmephs alg which is (If I remember correctly) different then that. Then I know the one I posted a few posts above. Thank you for your time.


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## cmhardw (Dec 15, 2010)

EricReese said:


> Which MU alg is that?


 
Again, I only use this when the U layer is already misaligned by a U2:
M2 U M2 U M' U2 M2 U2 M'


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## Rpotts (Dec 15, 2010)

I would recommend using the same alg chris posted, but with ' turns on all M2s and Us. 

It would read M2' U' M2' U' M' U2' M2' U2' M' (U2') 

I perform the M2's with my right hand, ring then middle finger double trigger. All the U's are with my left index (sometimes I do the U2's with left index-middle trigger)


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## cmhardw (Dec 15, 2010)

Rpotts said:


> I would recommend using the same alg chris posted, but with ' turns on all M2s and Us.
> 
> It would read M2' U' M2' U' M' U2' M2' U2' M' (U2')


 
I actually use both this alg and the version with clockwise U's, depending on how my grip was before seeing the Z perm. So I also use:
M2' U M2' U M' U2 M2' U2 M'


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## StachuK1992 (Dec 15, 2010)

No one else uses
M2' U M2' U M U2 M2 U2 M U2?
If you "push" the Ms and double trick the underlined M2, it's really nice, at least for me.


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## cmhardw (Dec 15, 2010)

StachuK1992 said:


> No one else uses
> M2' U M2' U M U2 M2 U2 M U2?
> If you "push" the Ms and double trick the underlined M2, it's really nice, at least for me.


 
Wow that is fast actually. I've never though to "push" M turns like that to be honest. That's cool!


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## StachuK1992 (Dec 15, 2010)

cmhardw said:


> Wow that is fast actually. I've never though to "push" M turns like that to be honest. That's cool!


 (I feel like I'm quoting you a lot recently...)
[youtubehd]wPxlpKqF_as[/youtubehd]
Pure 4-flip with the "pushing" from a few days ago. My favorite alg to perform.


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## cmhardw (Dec 15, 2010)

StachuK1992 said:


> (I feel like I'm quoting you a lot recently...)
> [video]
> Pure 4-flip with the "pushing" from a few days ago. My favorite alg to perform.


 
Wow that is fast! Even for that alg I've been using a longer version with only M' turns. I've been using:
(M' U)*3 (M')2 (U' M')*3

I can see how, after practice, using the push for the M turns can be very fast!


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## porkynator (Dec 15, 2010)

Am I the only one who uses R U R' U R' U' R' U R U' R' U' R2' U R U2 for Z perm?


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## Sa967St (Dec 15, 2010)

approximate singles:

A(a): 0.75
A(b): 0.90
E: 1.60
F: 1.30
G(a): 1.20
G(b): 1.25
G(c): 1.35
G(d): 1.15
H: 1.25
J(a): 0.60
J(b): 0.75
N(a): 1.45
N(b): 1.75
R(a): 1.65
R(b): 1.30
T: 0.85
U(a): 0.75 
U(b): 0.80
V: 1.50
Y: 1.45 
Z: 1.15 

All sub 1.8. :/


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## a small kitten (Dec 15, 2010)

> Accw: 1.33
> Acw: 1.42
> E: 1.05
> H: 0.97
> ...



lol these make so much sense next to your 17-18 avgs in comp.


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## oprah62 (Dec 15, 2010)

a small kitten said:


> lol these make so much sense next to your 17-18 avgs in comp.


 
Well, the A's do .


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## Cyrus C. (Dec 15, 2010)

For Z I like M' U' M2 U' M2 U' M' U2 M2.


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## waffle=ijm (Dec 15, 2010)

all my PLLs are sub-1. and I'm serious.


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## ~Adam~ (Dec 15, 2010)

For Z I do M2' U2' M' U' M2' U' M2' U' M' but I use make left hand quite a lot during solving.


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## uberCuber (Dec 15, 2010)

waffle=ijm said:


> all my PLLs are sub-1. and I'm serious.


 
knew this would come eventually..


but anyway, my PLL's suck and I am nowhere near being able to consistently sub-2 them all.


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## waffle=ijm (Dec 15, 2010)

correction. I can sub-0.60 all my PLLs

M2 U2 M2 - .47
E2 M' E2 M - .55
U2 M' U2 - .54
U2 M U2 - .56

all avg of 12


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## RyanReese09 (Dec 16, 2010)

StachuK1992 said:


> No one else uses
> M2' U M2' U M U2 M2 U2 M U2?
> If you "push" the Ms and double trick the underlined M2, it's really nice, at least for me.


 
Silly statue, I use it too! You did teach me it at Pton .


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## XXGeneration (Dec 19, 2010)

Does no one else use the RU alg for Z?


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## Sa967St (Dec 19, 2010)

XXGeneration said:


> Does no one else use the RU alg for Z?


 
I do! My RU Z perm is faster than my MU H perm. 



Sa967St said:


> H: 1.25
> Z: 1.15


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## FatBoyXPC (Dec 19, 2010)

StachuK1992 said:


> No one else uses
> M2' U M2' U M U2 M2 U2 M U2?
> If you "push" the Ms and double trick the underlined M2, it's really nice, at least for me.


 
I use it  I used to use the one that Joel Van Noort uses, with very similar fingertricks, but my MU one is much faster!


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## Erzz (Dec 19, 2010)

XXGeneration said:


> Does no one else use the RU alg for Z?


 
I use the mirror since I'm left handed.


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## ~Phoenix Death~ (Dec 20, 2010)

A, H, J, and Z


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## Daniel Wu (Dec 20, 2010)

I now can. Everything consistently except F and Gc, where I bounce around 1.9x to 2.2x.


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## Rpotts (Dec 20, 2010)

I think everything other than N and E. : (

Not 100% consistent on F, Gc/d


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