# Programmers out here?



## ahmedkl (Mar 25, 2011)

Just wanted to know if there are people here who love programming  .
Which languages do you work on ? Any cool projects you have done ?
And just for the sake of being bored , why don't we start a community project


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## Kirjava (Mar 25, 2011)

68kASM / C


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## Olji (Mar 25, 2011)

I like programming, I just started with it in school though >_>, only know a little C# and even less Actionscript >_>


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## deepSubDiver (Mar 25, 2011)

Fluently F#, C#, Java (historically conditioned) and a lot of different languages which I'm not too good at. Community project? I guess everything that requires team work already exists. Though, if there's a nice idea, I'll contribute.

Thom: May I harass you in the IRC channel with ASM questions?


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## VReality (Mar 25, 2011)

C++

I make video games. Most of them you've never heard of, but some of the more recognizable titles are Medal of Honor, GoldenEye, Tiger Woods, and XCom.


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## ben1996123 (Mar 25, 2011)

I know some really basic actionscript 2. But I don't really do much of it. Do hardly any at school in free time, for 2 reasons:

1. School computers have _*Macromedia*_ flash 7
2. I got banned from programming last year, because "it attracts attention and it's pointless"


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## Kirjava (Mar 25, 2011)

deepSubDiver said:


> Thom: May I harass you in the IRC channel with ASM questions?


 
Sure. What's your nick? Never seen you in there before (I don't think).


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## deepSubDiver (Mar 25, 2011)

Kirjava said:


> Sure. What's your nick? Never seen you in there before (I don't think).


deepsubdiver or bassrael. I'm not really sure, I'm not in regularly.


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## Kirjava (Mar 25, 2011)

VReality said:


> I make video games. Most of them you've never heard of, but some of the more recognizable titles are Medal of Honor, GoldenEye, Tiger Woods, and XCom.


 
What company? Rare? Activision?


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## eastamazonantidote (Mar 25, 2011)

I know some Python, some Objective-C, very little C, and I can make my TI-84 do anything I want.


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## VReality (Mar 25, 2011)

Kirjava said:


> What company? Rare? Activision?


 
For Medal of Honor and GoldenEye, I worked at EA. For Tiger Woods and XCom I contracted for EA and 2K, respectively.


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## MaeLSTRoM (Mar 25, 2011)

Little bit of C++, C#, PHP and SQL
Haven't really done much with it though.


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## collinbxyz (Mar 25, 2011)

Why not make a community speedsolving app with the forums, a timer, scrambles, etc. I started to learn a little HTML, but that's not good for apps...anyway, I think it would be cool.


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## Keroma12 (Mar 25, 2011)

I like programming but I've never got round to learning anything except my TI-83 plus calculator. I'm making a blackjack game on it  which includes splits and double down and all that. Are there any good websites out there to learn more advanced programming?


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## danthecuber (Mar 25, 2011)

A little python and BASH


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## tx789 (Mar 25, 2011)

I'm learning in an option HTML coding


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## Zarxrax (Mar 25, 2011)

Keroma12 said:


> I like programming but I've never got round to learning anything except my TI-83 plus calculator. I'm making a blackjack game on it  which includes splits and double down and all that. Are there any good websites out there to learn more advanced programming?


 
I mostly learned programming on my TI-83 back in the day by printing out programs that were written in TI-BASIC and typing them in by hand.
After that, I took some programming classes in college, but it was always really confusing and I hated it. 
I find that the best way to learn (for me), it to just start working on an app that you want to make. If you don't know how to do something, you go on google and start searching around until you can figure out how to do it.


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## PatrickJameson (Mar 25, 2011)

My first real language was Perl. I dabbled a bit in C and C++ but never got too into it. Then I learned Java, as I had to for both the AP Computer Science course at my school and the Robotics team which, this year, used Java. Now that the robotics season is basically over, I'm sticking to Python and C for a good while. If you want to count JS, JQuery, etc, I'm sufficient in those as well.


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## teller (Mar 25, 2011)

C# and TSQL these days.

I once wrote a forum, not unlike speedsolving.com, using Classic ASP.


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## collinbxyz (Mar 25, 2011)

Keroma12 said:


> I like programming but I've never got round to learning anything except my TI-83 plus calculator. I'm making a blackjack game on it  which includes splits and double down and all that. Are there any good websites out there to learn more advanced programming?


 
http://www.w3schools.com/


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## Litz (Mar 25, 2011)

C, C++, C#, Assembly, Java, Scheme, Python and SQL I think. Might be missing some. My "main" language is C++ but I use all of those listed except Scheme and Python on a daily basis.


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## Jedi5412 (Mar 25, 2011)

Visual Basic FTW XD




umm the list..

JavaScript VBS HTML C# MSDOS script stuff uhhhh


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## mr. giggums (Mar 25, 2011)

I know Java, Scratch, TI-83+, and HTML (if it counts) all fluently and I know a little C++ and Javascript. I also know mindstroms NXT, easyC, and robotC for robotics.

EDIT: and visual basic


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## bluecloe45 (Mar 25, 2011)

VReality said:


> For Medal of Honor and GoldenEye, I worked at EA. For Tiger Woods and XCom I contracted for EA and 2K, respectively.


 

Cool, I am playing goldeneye right now


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## ben1996123 (Mar 25, 2011)

bluecloe45 said:


> Cool, I am playing goldeneye right now



lolhen.


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## JTW2007 (Mar 26, 2011)

I know a very small amount of both Python and Objective-C; I'm going to finish them both over the summer as well as learn Java and potentially Perl.


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## brunson (Mar 26, 2011)

HTML is not a programming language.


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## FatBoyXPC (Mar 26, 2011)

brunson said:


> HTML is not a programming language.


 
Depending on if you want to play technicalities, neither is PHP, SQL (and variants), Batch (MSDOS), Bash (*nix), Perl, Python, etc. Some would even say Java is not.

In fairness though, HTML and XML are by far the easiest out of those mentioned to learn, as there isn't any sort of programming logic to learn.


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## RyanReese09 (Mar 26, 2011)

HTML is a markup language, not programming..

I do HTML/CSS/Javascript/PHP/SQL/Java.

Got CSS guru of the year award for 2009 at sitepoint.com (if you do web development you should know what that site is)


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## PatrickJameson (Mar 26, 2011)

Hehe, HTML is a Markup Language. As in, Hyper-Text Markup Language.


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## joey (Mar 26, 2011)

fatboyxpc said:


> Depending on if you want to play technicalities, neither is PHP, SQL (and variants), Batch (MSDOS), Bash (*nix), Perl, Python, etc. Some would even say Java is not.
> 
> In fairness though, HTML and XML are by far the easiest out of those mentioned to learn, as there isn't any sort of programming logic to learn.


Wait, how are those that you stated.. not programming languages?


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## Rinfiyks (Mar 26, 2011)

Anyone here interested in the Google AI Challenge?
Here's an example of last year's:


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## Owen (Mar 26, 2011)

Visual C#. I used to know a little bit of Ruby, but I forgot it. I'm currently re-learning it with object oriented programming.


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## ahmedkl (Mar 27, 2011)

well anyone here developing games ? I am really interested but i just can't find a spot to start . Other then that i am really good with C++ and Java , and have worked in C# , Actionscript3.0 , ASM , Python , C , PHP


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## Owen (Mar 27, 2011)

Game development? I haven't done any, but I guess Java would be your best bet.


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## 300SpartanX (Mar 27, 2011)

C++, i used to use it to make some graphics demos/games, but i felt like i wasnt getting anywhere with it, so i quit. i may restart again.


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## JustinJ (Mar 27, 2011)

ahmedkl said:


> well anyone here developing games ? I am really interested but i just can't find a spot to start . Other then that i am really good with C++ and Java , and have worked in C# , Actionscript3.0 , ASM , Python , C , PHP


 
Check out FlashPunk, it's what I use, and it's really awesome


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## antoineccantin (Mar 27, 2011)

HTML, CSS, Javascript and BASH.


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## andreccantin (Mar 27, 2011)

I know:

HTML, BASH (Bourne Again SHell), some Commodore BASIC V2 (I have a C64 emulator on my PDA), some visual basic and I can figure out, modify and add to my brother (antoineccantin) 's CSS and javascript.


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## FatBoyXPC (Mar 27, 2011)

joey said:


> Wait, how are those that you stated.. not programming languages?


 
If you do some researching, you'll see that some people get real technical about what is a programming language or not. I might paraphrase this incorrectly, but PHP, SQL, Perl, etc are Scripting languages, not programming languages. The argument is that a programming language can compile and send directly to the processor, whereas Perl, SQL, PHP, Batch, Bash, etc cannot. They send messages to an interpreter which then sends messages to the processor. Again, I might have paraphrased this wrong, but do some googling on it, and you'll it's basically a huge nerd war and that with some languages it really is a technicality (such as PHP, since you can still build desktop applications for it. Asterisk VOIP uses PHP for it's phone menus, or at least did at one point in time if it does not anymore).


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## ahmedkl (Mar 27, 2011)

JustinJ said:


> Check out FlashPunk, it's what I use, and it's really awesome


 
is this some gaming engine made in flash? and if you have made any game in it then can you show it to me please


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## hic2482w (Mar 27, 2011)

Am I the only one here who knows Lua? Not much, just enough to do some basic functions.


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## Johannes91 (Mar 27, 2011)

Zarxrax said:


> I find that the best way to learn (for me), it to just start working on an app that you want to make. If you don't know how to do something, you go on google and start searching around until you can figure out how to do it.


This. Works best for me, too.



fatboyxpc said:


> I might paraphrase this incorrectly, but PHP, SQL, Perl, etc are Scripting languages, not programming languages. The argument is that a programming language can compile and send directly to the processor, whereas Perl, SQL, PHP, Batch, Bash, etc cannot.


It honestly sounds like you just made that argument up. PHP and Perl are programming languages, period.



hic2482w said:


> Am I the only one here who knows Lua?


Nope!


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## Litz (Mar 27, 2011)

ahmedkl said:


> well anyone here developing games ? I am really interested but i just can't find a spot to start . Other then that i am really good with C++ and Java , and have worked in C# , Actionscript3.0 , ASM , Python , C , PHP


 
If you're good with C++, I suggest you go from there. When I started writing games I used SDL which is pretty simple to use and made some nice 2D games. You could just start learning OpenGL/Direct3D or something but it can be a bit overwhelming when you're just getting started.


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## Bryan (Mar 27, 2011)

fatboyxpc said:


> If you do some researching, you'll see that some people get real technical about what is a programming language or not. I might paraphrase this incorrectly, but PHP, SQL, Perl, etc are Scripting languages, not programming languages. The argument is that a programming language can compile and send directly to the processor, whereas Perl, SQL, PHP, Batch, Bash, etc cannot. They send messages to an interpreter which then sends messages to the processor. Again, I might have paraphrased this wrong, but do some googling on it, and you'll it's basically a huge nerd war and that with some languages it really is a technicality (such as PHP, since you can still build desktop applications for it. Asterisk VOIP uses PHP for it's phone menus, or at least did at one point in time if it does not anymore).



Perl has a compile and runtime phase. And I have no idea who uses the type of applications a language can make in arguing whether or not it's a programming language.


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## FatBoyXPC (Mar 27, 2011)

Bryan said:


> Perl has a compile and runtime phase. And I have no idea who uses the type of applications a language can make in arguing whether or not it's a programming language.


 
This was me not understanding Perl :/. Would you also say Java is flat out a programming language by the same definition? Java still has an interpreter which is one of those criteria people rule it against. Java also have a compile and runtime phase though. That's why I said depending on technicalities.



Johannes91 said:


> It honestly sounds like you just made that argument up. PHP and Perl are programming languages, period.


 
Did you bother googling this? I have a few friends who are big into programming (as well with PHP) and the discussion comes up quite often.

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=is+php+a+scripting+or+programming+language

http://www.google.com/search?source...=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=91f35080109ff7ec


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## Stefan (Mar 27, 2011)

Whether to call something a _"programming language"_... who cares, and why?


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## JustinJ (Mar 27, 2011)

ahmedkl said:


> is this some gaming engine made in flash? and if you have made any game in it then can you show it to me please


 
It's a 2D library for AS3 that lets you use raster graphics instead of vector ones, it's really good if you have a history using Game Maker, but it's easy to use regardless. This is one I made for a game jam a while back, and this I got sponsored.

The first one took 48 hours to make, and the second took about a week, although if I was dedicated I could have finished it way quicker.


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## VReality (Mar 27, 2011)

*Re: Programing vs. Scripting Languages*

There are both compiled and interpreted programming languages. And in fact some, like C#, are both at the same time. It's compiled into an intermediate language, which is then interpreted at run-time. 

Really, the thing that determines whether or not a language is a programming language is whether or not it can be used for writing programs.

For instance, one thing that keeps a language from being a programming language is lack of flow control. If the language doesn't have a facility for conditionally branching logic, then you can't use it for programming. Hence a mark-up language (HTML, XML, etc.) is not a programming language because there's no way to write a program with it.

Another thing that keeps some languages from being programming languages is that they are only used to control the behavior of other programs. Some scripting languages have many of the features of programming languages, but they can't be used to to make programs, simply because there exists no stand-alone compiler or interpreter for doing so, and they have no input/output features apart from interacting with the program they are designed to control.

And there's plenty of gray area. JavaScript, for instance, is an object oriented language with flow control that can be used to write applications that interact with users in arbitrary ways. 

It's called a script because it works within the context of a web browser, and can be seen as purely controlling the features of the browser. But from another point of view, a web-browser is a general enough environment, which is ubiquitous enough amongst end-users, that web-applications can certainly be considered programs/applications in their own right, and not just browser scripts. 

So in some instances, the distinction is about the language lacking programming capabilities by nature, and in others its more of a technicality of the situations in which the language can actually be used.


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## AvGalen (Mar 28, 2011)

collinbxyz said:


> http://www.w3schools.com/


 
My first response was that w3schools isn't any good for advanced programming, but that seems to have changed a bit. I still wouldn't recommend it for advanced programming though as it is clearly aiming only at the web and mostly at beginners

The more advanced programs I wrote aren't actually using any code that is more difficult. They DO have a much better structure so they are easier to change, extend, maintain, test, and work on with multiple people.

(I also see some irony in this url: http://www.w3schools.com/php/default.asp)


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## VP7 (Mar 28, 2011)

andreccantin said:


> I know:
> 
> HTML, BASH (Bourne Again SHell), some Commodore BASIC V2 (I have a C64 emulator on my PDA), some visual basic and I can figure out, modify and add to my brother (antoineccantin) 's CSS and javascript.


 

Lets talk when you start Commodore 64 ML programming.

If you need some books try looking here:
http://www.bombjack.org/commodore/


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## FatBoyXPC (Mar 28, 2011)

AvGalen said:


> (I also see some irony in this url: http://www.w3schools.com/php/default.asp)


 
Haha yes! That is quite awesome AvG!


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## rishabh (Mar 28, 2011)

i know quite a bit action script 3 and slight asm (cant remember which)


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## ahmedkl (Mar 28, 2011)

JustinJ said:


> It's a 2D library for AS3 that lets you use raster graphics instead of vector ones, it's really good if you have a history using Game Maker, but it's easy to use regardless. This is one I made for a game jam a while back, and this I got sponsored.
> 
> The first one took 48 hours to make, and the second took about a week, although if I was dedicated I could have finished it way quicker.


 
nice games . How did you start making the game . Saw any tutorials ? if yes then can you give me some links please


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## VReality (Mar 28, 2011)

Ok, I know it's pointless to complain about at this point, but since I'm among programmers, it has to be said...

Is anyone else driven just a little bit crazy by the cubing community's misuse of the term "algorithm"?


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## masterofthebass (Mar 28, 2011)

How is it a misuse? An algorithm is "a step-by-step procedure for solving a problem or accomplishing some end especially by a computer" I don't know how you think a list of moves to solve a specific case is a misuse of the word.


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## Rinfiyks (Mar 28, 2011)

VReality said:


> Ok, I know it's pointless to complain about at this point, but since I'm among programmers, it has to be said...
> 
> Is anyone else driven just a little bit crazy by the cubing community's misuse of the term "algorithm"?


 
A precise step-by-step plan for a computational procedure that begins with an input value and yields an output value in a finite number of steps.
Computational: calculating or reckoning.
Procedure: a particular method for performing a task.
Input value: the state of a cube.
Output value: another state.
Finite number: obviously.
Steps: which sides to turn and how much to turn them by.

Before reading this, what would you have suggested as a better term to use instead of algorithm?


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## tim (Mar 28, 2011)

Rinfiyks said:


> Before reading this, what would you have suggested as a better term to use instead of algorithm?


 
Move sequence? (At least that's what we use in Germany to avoid the term algorithm)


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## VReality (Mar 28, 2011)

Rinfiyks said:


> Before reading this, what would you have suggested as a better term to use instead of algorithm?


"Sequence" seems perfectly adequate. 

An algorithm is a "decision sequence". 

Technically, you can decide at each point that the state is perfectly predictable so you just do the next move. And so technically, a prescribed sequence of moves, involving no decisions, is an algorithm, in that it meets the denotation of the term. 

But it definitely violates the *connotation* that there are decisions being made at each point, which makes it misleading, since you would presumably have used any word like "sequence", which is both simpler and more accurately descriptive, if that's what you had meant.

"Methods", such as Fridrich, Petrus, Waterman, and Roux would be more appropriate to call algorithms. They involve a sequence of examination, evaluation, decision, and action, which is what "algorithm" is generally used to imply.


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## VReality (Mar 28, 2011)

VReality said:


> Is anyone else driven just a little bit crazy by the cubing community's misuse of the term "algorithm"?


 


Rinfiyks said:


> ...what would you have suggested as a better term to use instead of algorithm?


 


tim said:


> Move sequence? (At least that's what we use in Germany to avoid the term algorithm)



I take this as a "yes". I guess Germans don't like using the term "algorithm" to describe a sequence of moves involving no decisions.


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## teller (Mar 28, 2011)

I knew algs as "series" in the old days. I don't know if Singmaster called them that, but Hofstadter did.


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## Stefan (Mar 29, 2011)

VReality said:


> I guess Germans don't like using the term "algorithm" to describe a sequence of moves involving no decisions.



Germans do say "algorithm" all the time, tim is lying. Nah, not really lying, "Zugfolge" (move sequence) is a good proper term (*) that is indeed used instead. But unfortunately only rarely. Most just adopt "algorithm" without thinking. A few days ago at a meeting there was a reporter and I insisted we don't say "Algorithmus" to her but "Zugfolge" (and I think tim agreed). I don't have any technical issue with using the term "algorithm" (and I'm in computer science, so do know the general meaning). My issue with it is that the media and the general population doesn't really know the word "algorithm", so it makes cubing sound much more complicated and mysterious than it is. When someone tries to explain to a non-cuber how cubing works and says _"you just need some algorithms"_, that doesn't give them a better understanding but a worse one. So it pisses me off whenever someone does that, or when the media parrots it, typically accentuated like _"they use *algorithms* to solve it"_. Among cubers (who already use the term anyway), it still makes me a bit sad, but I find it ok.

(*) Though I might overestimate that, maybe I'm just familiar with that term from playing chess and the general population isn't that familiar with it. But at least it's a descriptive term (Zug=move, Folge=sequence), so unlike "algorithm", people who don't know it still have a good chance to understand it, and it doesn't sound mystical like "algorithm". Similar to the German word for "science", which is "Wissenschaft" and roughly translates to "knowledge creation" (Wissen=knowledge). I think calling it "knowledge creation" would lead to fewer opponents of science than "science".


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## joey (Mar 29, 2011)

A language does not define it's execution. With Rubinius now, a Ruby implementation that can create machine code, and I'm sure others similar to PHP etc, there isn't always that distinction.
You can interpret C, so I guess it can't count as a programming language, etc.

Programming languages are languages your program in. Compiled ones are compiler, interpreted ones are interpreted.


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## VReality (Mar 29, 2011)

Stefan said:


> When someone tries to explain to a non-cuber how cubing works and says _"you just need some algorithms"_, that doesn't give them a better understanding but a worse one.


Exactly.

And since anyone would understand "sequence", "series", or even "combo", I can't think of a good reason to say "algorithm" except to try to confuse people (I mean, of course, other than the fact that it has now become common terminology in the community).


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## Johannes91 (Mar 29, 2011)

fatboyxpc said:


> Would you also say Java is flat out a programming language by the same definition? Java still has an interpreter which is one of those criteria people rule it against.


That can't be a serious question. Anyone can make new definitions for words and put them somewhere google will see them. It doesn't change the commonly accepted meaning.

And yeah it doesn't matter.



joey said:


> You can interpret C, so I guess it can't count as a programming language, etc.


Machine language is also interpreted! (by the hardware)


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## Mr 005 (Mar 30, 2011)

lets see

AS3 is my best I love flash

a bit of C

a bit of VB


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## StachuK1992 (Mar 30, 2011)

I've done 5hrs+ coding with:
VB (6, .NET), C# (.NET), ASP.NET, C, C++, HTML, Java, Javascript, Python, Scheme

Most of what I've done has been C, Java, and Python.

Also, some random BASICs.


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## Jorghi (Jun 25, 2011)

C#, C++, VB.NET, VB6, SQL, PHP, JavaScript

Python -> Never used, Never will.


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## collinbxyz (Jun 25, 2011)

lolbump


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