# My reflection on the evolution of F2L style (+ task for the community)



## macky (Jul 13, 2010)

This post attempts to describe the line of reasoning that inspired the recent effort on my advanced F2L page. I held off writing this up then to avoid cluttering that thread, but it seems more appropriate now, after Feliks's new WR average, as several people mentioned the "style of the future." Let me know whether or not you're convinced.



A little background. While I was in Europe this spring, a number of cubers remarked on my unique fingertricks. My fingers stay very close to the cube, and I often use not the tips but more inner parts of my fingers. During the F2L, I frequently use double layer turns, tilts (often to left cross), or even some wrist turning. For example, instead of LU2'L'U'LUL', I often tilt the cube slightly to x' and z while moving my whole right hand to hold the BUL sticker with the index, FU with thumb, and BU-BUR with the rest; do L with the right index while moving the whole left hand to hold the B center with thumb and F with the rest; pull back the left hand for Dw2'; then continue with right-handed R'U'RUR'.

I started speedcubing in 2002. Back then, since there were less F2L algorithms that avoided whole cube turns (no R'FRF'RU'R' or R'FRF'R'U'R yet), the faster tilts and double layer turns were natural ways to speed up the F2L. Since double layer turns also help with recognition, I took this to an extreme as in the example above to smoothen my F2L. Another explanation is that cubes from this period POPed when turned too fast with a slight inaccuracy. I avoided the problem altogether by concentrating on UR turns. While I don't think that other top cubers through 2006 used double layer turns to this extent, many of the first sub-15 cubers used an F2L style consistent with the slogan, "go slow, and look ahead."

Then, in 2007, came the Japanese cubers (because I don't really count).* They used whole cube turns. They had a choppier F2L. And they turned fast. Their F2L almost seemed to be pairs being "processed" one after another--in a way, not unlike OLL/PLL. Turning speed and lookahead are the two ever-conflicting essences of F2L. My impression is that the majority of top cubers since 2007 have stressed the former at a slight cost of the latter, with spectacular success; rather than gradually increasing the turning speed while maintaining a complete lookahead, turning speed now drags along lookahead.

(*I'm obviously greatly simplifying the story here by skipping over a number of major historical cubers. Perhaps there was a gradual shift towards the eventual evolution that I describe. Honestly, I haven't carefully watched enough videos from this period to judge.)

The recent development in hardware certainly supports this evolution. With anti-POP mechanisms and lighter cubes, today's top cubers are better equipped than ever to pursue increasingly high tps. Whole cube turns, which once helped to solidify lookahead, are now the biggest hindrance to turning speed. For some F2L cases, the problem has already been solved: U'L'ULDwRU'R' was first replaced by R'FRF'RUR', and then by F'RUR'U'R'FR. But even for this case, different starting angles and target slots still often require a whole cube turn.

It was under such considerations that I set out to compile a collection of rotationless F2L algorithms. To address the issue, I needed to consider every target slot for each pair pattern, plus AUFs as appropriate. Thus, for pair pattern V1 to target slot FL, I noted the old but not often used FRU2'R'F' and also proposed (U2)FLw'ULwF2' (with left index push for the first F) as an alternative to the traditional (U2)yRUR'URU'R'. As for empty-slot cases, Joël's recent contribution of RU2'R'UR'U'R demonstrated that there were even simple alternative reductions waiting to be found. After adding mirrors and rotations of existing F2L tricks from various sources, I explored variants of existing algorithms for as yet undocumented ones. The result is what should be a fairly comprehensive list that I myself have yet to sift through.

My list is not meant to be a final word on F2L. Rather, it is made as thorough as possible so that the community can judge the merits of each algorithm, comparing with traditional ones. It is also meant to encourage further explorations; to this end, the right index push for F' should be essential to many fast rotationless algorithms. It is my strong belief that a thorough review of F2L, optimizing algorithms for the new style, should be one of the main tasks for today's CFOP community.

macky


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## 4Chan (Jul 13, 2010)

Extremely fascinating.

I too noticed the change during the japanese cubers' styles.


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## Kirjava (Jul 13, 2010)

macky said:


> the right index push for F' should be essential to many fast rotationless algorithms




I bet this gives rowan a boner.


Thanks for the read, macky!


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 13, 2010)

Good read.

The last layer has been researched and processed so much now, that any change/improvement that is made now will be doing such a little effect on their solves. The great thing about knowing/learning F2L tricks like these is that you can use them multiple times within the same solve.

I never before noticed how fast that F' can be - I shall use that increasingly now when CFOPing. 

I would suggest that a really nice wiki page were made, and we could just work on that, but when a thread is bumped, it reminds people to think about it.
So I kinda that it would be best if we were to have a nice wiki page, in a grid much like yours, where each row had the 4 angles, and we could edit, etc, and when someone made an edit, to just post about it in the other thread quick. Agreement at all?


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## amostay2004 (Jul 13, 2010)

Rowan must be proud


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## blah (Jul 13, 2010)

Stachuk1992 said:


> I never before noticed how fast that F' can be - I shall use that increasingly now when CFOPing.


I don't see how that's any faster than thumb :/


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 13, 2010)

blah said:


> Stachuk1992 said:
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> 
> > I never before noticed how fast that F' can be - I shall use that increasingly now when CFOPing.
> ...


When you're going into an R.
Like in the CLS F' (R U2 R' U' R U' R') F

Actually, hrm, they are about the same, now that I try both after each other.

Yet another edit - actually, I seem to be locking up less with the pointer finger, but if executed correctly, same speed.


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## macky (Jul 13, 2010)

Stachuk1992 said:


> I would suggest that a really nice wiki page were made, and we could just work on that, but when a thread is bumped, it reminds people to think about it.
> So I kinda that it would be best if we were to have a nice wiki page, in a grid much like yours, where each row had the 4 angles, and we could edit, etc, and when someone made an edit, to just post about it in the other thread quick. Agreement at all?



(lolgrammar)

My job is to sell the idea to the community, so I'd be happy to transfer control if we can get the format worked out and there are enough new contributions to make me busy. Someone will need to set up a similar skeleton on the wiki, customizable color scheme for VisualCube like on my site (currently not working, by the way, because of server-side issues). I'm configuring my page with CSS, but I don't know how to fine-control the format on wiki, leaving the possibility for future changes.



blah said:


> Stachuk1992 said:
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> 
> > I never before noticed how fast that F' can be - I shall use that increasingly now when CFOPing.
> ...



In the J-perm that starts RUR'F'R..., for example, I find that right index push for F' more naturally leads to R.




Stachuk1992 said:


> When you're going into an R.
> Like in the CLS F' (R U2 R' U' R U' R') F



With thumb, F'RU2' is fine for me, but not F'RU2. No choice of direction for the J perm.


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## Vincents (Jul 13, 2010)

I saw this de facto presentation in person yesterday... and as much as I've been ingrained in the really old style of slow TPS/super look ahead, I have to say that I'm going to attempt to train myself like this from now on (or at least after US Nationals...)


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## Robert-Y (Jul 13, 2010)

macky said:


> blah said:
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For this algorithm I've started to do the F' by pushing the DFR cubie upwards with my index finger because I've practised OH enough with my right hand that it's kinda easy  (Just an alternative)

Unfortunately I cannot do this with my left hand very easily, but I guess with enough practice, I might be able to do it...


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## macky (Jul 13, 2010)

Robert-Y said:


> For this algorithm I've started to do the F' by pushing the DFR cubie upwards with my index finger because I've practised OH enough with my right hand that it's kinda easy  (Just an alternative)


This, I've never heard of! Intense!

David Calvo showed me the OLL L'U'LU'L'ULULF'L'F with right index push for the first U'. No regrip. For the mirror, I do find the left index flick for the first U pretty comfortable. Human hands are amazing.
[Edit] I suppose this could also be used in Sune and double Sune. Right now it seems a bit lidicurous.


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## Anonymous (Jul 13, 2010)

Is there anyone in particular who you're referencing when you say "the Japanese cubers"? (Sorry for my ignorance)

This was actually really interesting to read, and when you compared the "modern" style of F2L to OLL/PLL, I started to become curious- am I wrong that the consensus is that intuitive F2L is superior to algorithmic? I've been under the impression that it was.


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 13, 2010)

macky said:


> Stachuk1992 said:
> 
> 
> > I would suggest that a really nice wiki page were made, and we could just work on that, but when a thread is bumped, it reminds people to think about it.
> ...


If you ever feel like handing off the job, I'd be open for such, but I'm probably not the best person for it, as I'm not very good at F2L. :/

I seldom do U2', and that's fine for me. Hmm.


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## Kirjava (Jul 13, 2010)

Anonymous said:


> am I wrong that the consensus is that intuitive F2L is superior to algorithmic?




They're essentially the same thing.


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## macky (Jul 13, 2010)

Anonymous said:


> Is there anyone in particular who you're referencing when you say "the Japanese cubers"? (Sorry for my ignorance)
> 
> This was actually really interesting to read, and when you compared the "modern" style of F2L to OLL/PLL, I started to become curious- am I wrong that the consensus is that intuitive F2L is superior to algorithmic? I've been under the impression that it was.



Especially Yu Nakajima, Mitsuki Gunji, Yumu Tabuchi (before he started pwning!).


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## Robert-Y (Jul 13, 2010)

macky said:


> David Calvo showed me the OLL L'U'LU'L'ULULF'L'F with right index push for the first U'. No regrip. For the mirror, I do find the left index flick for the first U pretty comfortable. Human hands are amazing.
> [Edit] I suppose this could also be used in *Sune* and double Sune. Right now it seems a bit lidicurous.



!!!

Wow now I can do the mirrored sune without changing my grip from start to finish!

Thanks for that suggestion Macky!


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## amostay2004 (Jul 13, 2010)

I've always found Faz's sune execution in this vid pretty interesting. I'm not sure if this is how he normally does it though. Left index push for the first U, and a leftie double flip for the U2.






Forward to about 0:43


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## pjk (Jul 13, 2010)

macky said:


> Stachuk1992 said:
> 
> 
> > I would suggest that a really nice wiki page were made, and we could just work on that, but when a thread is bumped, it reminds people to think about it.
> ...


I've been unable to resolve why it stopped working in the first place. anyway, I've found a quick fix for it and have updated the announcement thread here.


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## macky (Jul 13, 2010)

pjk said:


> macky said:
> 
> 
> > customizable color scheme for VisualCube like on my site *(currently not working, by the way, because of server-side issues)*.
> ...



Oh. I meant that the customizable color scheme functionality on my site isn't working right now. Didn't know speedsolving.com's wasn't working. Could you set up the color scheme cookies?


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## Escher (Jul 13, 2010)

macky said:


> David Calvo showed me the OLL L'U'LU'L'ULULF'L'F with right index push for the first U'. No regrip. For the mirror, I do find the left index flick for the first U pretty comfortable. Human hands are amazing.
> [Edit] I suppose this could also be used in Sune and double Sune. Right now it seems a bit lidicurous.



Mmm, yes, I've been doing that OLL in a similar way for a while now, it's very convenient!
I also use the inverse, executed like:

F' r U r' U' r' F' r U r' F r

You'll notice that the r' F' r leaves the RH index in a wonderful place to execute the next U and F 

In fact the vast majority of traditionally LU algs I use now look a lot more like <r, F, U> algorithms. Take for example L perm:

L' U' L F L' U' L U L F L2 U L

For me looks a lot more like

x r' U' r U r' U' L U r U' r2 F R.
Though since I don't spend much time with cubers irl these days I've no idea whether this is standard or not!


Btw, although I seem to have popularised the use of index finger push on RFU for F', it's Jude Wright that showed me it in the first place.

(Also, when it's not 3 in the morning I'll write a proper reply to the OP topic, I've been having a lot of thoughts about f2l development recently too...)

EDIT: Actually after looking at Robert's video, I'm executing the W OLL more like r' F' (push on RFU) r than the L' U' (flick from FRU) L start.


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## teller (Jul 13, 2010)

Robert-Y said:


> macky said:
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> > blah said:
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Wow...I hadn't thought of that. Fascinating...

Ya know, I used crappy Rubik's brand cubes filled with cement for 25 years...I think part of the reason I'm attracted to fingertricks is because I always wanted to do cool flippy things, but the cube just wouldn't do it. Today, with a Sheng En or Haiyan Memory I'm like a kid in a candy store. I had these heavy barbells strapped to my fingers all those years, and now they're off. I should shoot some more video...


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## Edward (Jul 13, 2010)

teller said:


> Robert-Y said:
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> > macky said:
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Yes, please do!
I love your obscure style, with all the cool flippy things and what not.


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## teller (Jul 13, 2010)

Edward said:


> teller said:
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Thank you...I will do it...I do have some juicy ones ready.


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## jms_gears1 (Jul 13, 2010)

teller said:


> Edward said:
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i <3 your finger tricks. MOAR VIDS


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## JTW2007 (Jul 13, 2010)

macky said:


> "go slow, and look ahead."



Whoa. I seriously don't think I've heard that in years. Didn't it used to be the default answer to "how do I get faster at F2L"?

Anyway, that was very interesting. I'll have to check out that F2L page more in the coming weeks.


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## jms_gears1 (Jul 13, 2010)

JTW2007 said:


> macky said:
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> > "go slow, and look ahead."
> ...



lolyears.


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## JTW2007 (Jul 13, 2010)

jms_gears1 said:


> JTW2007 said:
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Have I just been missing it?


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## trying-to-speedcube... (Jul 13, 2010)

Left index > right index


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## cmhardw (Jul 13, 2010)

Wow, Macky that's a very interesting post! It's always really neat to hear of the perspective of the evolution of speedcubing from one of the masters himself 

I think this idea is a very good one, and very interesting. It's as if we are taking the 40 some odd cases for F2L pairs and increasing that to maybe between 100-200 algorithms. Of course the logic behind why each alg works would be understood by the cuber, but each and every case could be executed in a brain-dead way by sheer muscle memory.

I also think it would be a good idea to consider the simpler ZBF2L cases that are either super fast to execute, or conveniently easy to spot while solving. There are perhaps 20-30 algs (Chris Tran, can you confirm or better this?) that are just really neat and fast, or really useful, and would be a worthwhile addition to any cuber's F2L tool kit. Good examples of these are:
R' D' L F' L' D R2 U R'
M' U' M U2 L F' L'
F R U' R' F' L' U' L
F R U2 R' F' L' U' L
R l U' R' U l'

Of course I know not everyone would agree with including these algs in the first place, and even if they could agree on that it's hard to agree on which algs to include. Still, I think that having a couple of ZBF2L "gems" in the toolkit would not hurt for the standard CFOP solver. What do others think about this?

Chris


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## joey (Jul 13, 2010)

macky: *claps* Great post.


Makes me think that I've hardly put any effort into my F2L nor fingertricks.
Lot of people seem to have tricks and nice ways to do algs.. but I just try turn quickly with disregard to execution style.
I think it may be the next step to my improvement.


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## oskarasbrink (Jul 13, 2010)

amostay2004 said:


> I've always found Faz's sune execution in this vid pretty interesting. I'm not sure if this is how he normally does it though. Left index push for the first U, and a leftie double flip for the U2.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


no, the first U is right index


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## rubiknewbie (Jul 13, 2010)

Anonymous said:


> Is there anyone in particular who you're referencing when you say "the Japanese cubers"? (Sorry for my ignorance)
> 
> This was actually really interesting to read, and when you compared the "modern" style of F2L to OLL/PLL, I started to become curious- am I wrong that the consensus is that intuitive F2L is superior to algorithmic? I've been under the impression that it was.



It is the general consensus but at very advanced level, some cubers like Breandan Vallance and Escher use some very advanced algorithms to avoid cube rotations. Some of them are totally non-intuitive.


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## joey (Jul 13, 2010)

They be non-intuitive.. but they are still easy to follow when you see them.


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## dada222 (Jul 13, 2010)

Thanks a lot for the link. It's about time I learned something new!


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## Dene (Jul 13, 2010)

Well I don't know about you guys, but anyone with short fat fingers is not going to be able to F' with right index with any deliberation.


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## Kirjava (Jul 13, 2010)

Dene said:


> Well I don't know about you guys, but anyone with short fat fingers is not going to be able to F' with right index with any deliberation.




That means we shouldn't mention or attempt the technique at all.

>_>


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## keemy (Jul 13, 2010)

Dene said:


> Well I don't know about you guys, but anyone with short fat fingers is not going to be able to F' with right index with any deliberation.



FALSE.

Also I have been using this as long as I can remember (F' push with right index). But recently someone told me it was bad technique and that I should be using left index w/o re grip to pull down the ULF sticker because pushes are inherently slower than pulls.


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## Anonymous (Jul 13, 2010)

Kirjava said:


> Anonymous said:
> 
> 
> > am I wrong that the consensus is that intuitive F2L is superior to algorithmic?
> ...



That's true for experienced cubers, I guess.


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## jazzthief81 (Jul 13, 2010)

macky said:


> It was under such considerations that I set out to compile a collection of rotationless F2L algorithms.
> 
> [...]
> 
> ...



This is a list I compiled a few years ago, when I started practicing solving F2L on the bottom. Maybe it can be of help to you in completing your list. It also gives you an example of how you can organize it: 

http://www.cubezone.be/completef2l/index.html

Although I dubbed it "The complete F2L" it's not actually complete.  However I did fully explore the following 4 groups of cases:

*Insert pair with edge oriented*
*Insert edge with edge oriented*
*Insert corner with edge oriented*
*Insert corner with edge flipped*
Each group has 48 cases because there 3 corner orientations, 4 ways to position the edge/corner/pair and 4 possible target slots. 

For each of those 48 cases I may have several solutions listed, some of which may exploit an empty slot. In that case the algorithm starts with the position of the empty slot in between square brackets, eg. [FL].

The trickiest group in the bunch is *Insert corner with edge flipped*. For the other 3 groups it's easy to come up with good rotationless algorithms since they can be solved with R, U and L moves, but for this group you need to bring F/F' or rotations into the equation. For most cases I tried to come up with a good rotationless algorithm and a good algorithm that uses a rotation.

As for the groups I didn't explore: *Insert pair with edge flipped* can be reduced to *Insert pair with edge oriented* by means of a y/y' rotation and the same thing goes for *Insert edge with edge flipped*. This is also what I do on a solve 95% of the time, although I have thought about which of the rotations, y or y', would lead to the most finger-friendly continuation. For example, I'd rather do yLUL' instead of y'RUR' because then I can keep my hands in "the neutral position", meaning thumb on F and ring/middle/index/fingers on B. I find that this increases flow.

I never got around doing the *Move pair* cases, although I know the basic ones from all angles, like the ones where the pair is in it's target slot or where the pair is fully matched but in the wrong slot. I think it would be useful to investigate these a bit further in order to have some contingency plan in case there is no F2L piece in the top layer. (I should probably start with reading your Jeff2L page, Macky )

I also have to note that my list is not kept up to date because I printed it out a long time ago and have kept updating the algorithms on the printed sheet ever since.

Just my 2 cents on this topic. I always found optimizing F2L cases one of the most intriguing parts of cubing and I still put quite a bit of effort in to it. It's so much fun!


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## Edward (Jul 13, 2010)

Anonymous said:


> Kirjava said:
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> > Anonymous said:
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Not an experienced cuber here: Intuitive F2L is basically the same thing as algorithmic FL2, except you don't purposely try to memorise agls, they just kind of end up being memorised by sheer practice.


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## Anonymous (Jul 13, 2010)

Edward said:


> Anonymous said:
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Yeah, I figured that's what he meant.


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## pjk (Jul 13, 2010)

macky said:


> pjk said:
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I talked to Conrad and he said the latest version he has does. Additionally, you can also place arrows on the generated images.

And to not get too off-topic, very nice reflections on the evolution of the F2L. Interesting observations.


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## macky (Jul 13, 2010)

pjk said:


> I talked to Conrad and he said the latest version he has does. Additionally, you can also place arrows on the generated images.



Right, sorry, I forget that the script description page has it at the bottom because I set up my own cookie setter.




cmhardw said:


> I also think it would be a good idea to consider the simpler ZBF2L cases that are either super fast to execute, or conveniently easy to spot while solving. There are perhaps 20-30 algs (Chris Tran, can you confirm or better this?) that are just really neat and fast, or really useful, and would be a worthwhile addition to any cuber's F2L tool kit. Good examples of these are:
> R' D' L F' L' D R2 U R'
> M' U' M U2 L F' L'
> F R U' R' F' L' U' L
> ...



I didn't know the first two (the rest I've considered even without edge control). I'm not sure if edge-control algs should go in a separate section, but the good ones are definitely worth knowing.




jazzthief81 said:


> This is a list I compiled a few years ago, when I started practicing solving F2L on the bottom. Maybe it can be of help to you in completing your list. It also gives you an example of how you can organize it:
> 
> http://www.cubezone.be/completef2l/index.html



I didn't know this existed! I'll go through it to add to my list (after I divide it into several pages), crediting your site. I've got bunch of nice flipped edge cases, including a couple I think have not been documented before.
(copying from the other thread)
RwR'URU'Rw'U'RUR'
RwR'URU'Rw'RU'R' / RB'RBR'UR'
RBLU'L'B'R' (the only bad case with edge oriented)
RUR2'FRF'RU'R'
RU'R2'FRF'RU'R' by JUN
R'FRF'RU'R'URU'R' by Sinpei
RwUR'U'Rw'R2U'R'
RwU'R'URURw' by Dave Orser


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## Dene (Jul 14, 2010)

Kirjava said:


> Dene said:
> 
> 
> > Well I don't know about you guys, but anyone with short fat fingers is not going to be able to F' with right index with any deliberation.
> ...



Of course it doesn't, and I would never say so.



keemy said:


> Dene said:
> 
> 
> > Well I don't know about you guys, but anyone with short fat fingers is not going to be able to F' with right index with any deliberation.
> ...



I want proof of someone with short, fat fingers doing F' with right index with efficiency.

Just my own example: When I try it in the J perm (about 20 attempts) not once have I managed to do the full turn.


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## DavidWoner (Jul 14, 2010)

Robert-Y said:


> macky said:
> 
> 
> > David Calvo showed me the OLL L'U'LU'L'ULULF'L'F with right index push for the first U'. No regrip. For the mirror, I do find the left index flick for the first U pretty comfortable. Human hands are amazing.
> ...



Jai has been doing that for aaaagggeeesss. That's how he was getting .3x sunes 2 years ago.


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## Robert-Y (Jul 14, 2010)

Wow Jai can do two sunes almost faster then I can do one...


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## Edward (Jul 14, 2010)

Dene said:


> Kirjava said:
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Tilt the cube a bit?


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 14, 2010)

quick note:

Learning the I and Im cases from CLS can be very beneficial, and it's only 8 or 16 (if you dont' wanna mirror) cases, easily learned. CLS is not just for full MGLS users or Petrus/ZZ users.

For example if you have a http://www.opticubes.com/cubing/f2l/f2l_30.gif case, and it's not your last, just U R U' R', and gogo I/Im later.


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## Matt S (Jul 14, 2010)

This is an interesting thread. The advantages of using all these special algs to avoid cube rotations is obvious, and Breandan and many others have proved that it's very fast. However, Feliks has shown that it's possible to be unbelievably fast even with a relatively high number of rotations. I wonder how it will all play out over the next couple years.



Stachuk1992 said:


> quick note:
> 
> Learning the I and Im cases from CLS can be very beneficial, and it's only 8 or 16 (if you dont' wanna mirror) cases, easily learned. CLS is not just for full MGLS users or Petrus/ZZ users.
> 
> For example if you have a http://www.opticubes.com/cubing/f2l/f2l_30.gif case, and it's not your last, just U R U' R', and gogo I/Im later.



EJF2L isn't worth it if you have to do extra work to orient the edges. Unfortunately, while easiest to learn and use, the I/Im cases are the longest.


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 14, 2010)

Matt S said:


> Stachuk1992 said:
> 
> 
> > quick note:
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"Unfortunately, while easiest to learn and use, the I/Im cases are the longest"
by about 1 move, not counting C. At least for my algs.

And yes - only use if convenient.


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## esquimalt1 (Jul 17, 2010)

This is really cool to read how cubing evolved over the years macky. The new school cubers have no idea how far this stuff has come. I remembered how it was kinda surprising when Yu Nakajima popped out with his super fast turning, and cube rotations and how his times were so fast.


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## macky (Jul 20, 2010)

Just a note that I've done a major reorganization of Advanced F2L. The index is now here. I'll be making incremental improvements in the coming weeks.

With Wiki, you only get partial control of the formatting. Once Lucas Garron gets algnex.us up, I'll probably transfer control of management to him.


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 20, 2010)

macky said:


> Just a note that I've done a major reorganization of Advanced F2L. The index is now here. I'll be making incremental improvements in the coming weeks.
> 
> With Wiki, you only get partial control of the formatting. Once Lucas Garron gets algnex.us up, I'll probably transfer control of management to him.


Looks nice - at this point, what's the best way to help with this?
Also, CLS section.


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## macky (Jul 20, 2010)

Stachuk1992 said:


> > With Wiki, you only get partial control of the formatting. Once Lucas Garron gets algnex.us up, I'll probably transfer control of management to him.
> 
> 
> Looks nice - at this point, what's the best way to help with this?
> Also, CLS section.



Could you recommend the easier CLS cases that a CFOPer should know? You're the most qualified person to do this.

[edit]
More algorithms:
Uw'RU2'R'UwRUR' from Dave Orser
F'RU'R'FRUR'F from me
RU2'R2Uw'R'UwR from Dave Orser
R'FR2U'R'U2'F' from JUN


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 20, 2010)

macky said:


> Stachuk1992 said:
> 
> 
> > macky said:
> ...


Sure, I shall go through now and pick the best.
This will give me a good chance to make my "Learn CLS in this order" page. 
(I don't really like/recommend people to just learn by the I, then Im, +, etc. There are some really nice, easy cases that I think should first be addressed, then get to the grits of each set later)


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## AndyK (Jul 21, 2010)

I've been waiting for something like your advanced F2L page for a long time. Very well done


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 21, 2010)

Stachuk1992 said:


> macky said:
> 
> 
> > Stachuk1992 said:
> ...


Whew, that took long enough.

Basically, I would recommend learning the algs, in order, until one reaches the break. You'll see it. However, if 32 algs seems like a good deal, at least learn the first 12 (really 5, though, because of C)



Spoiler



The order Stachu suggests learning CLS in.

C cases: (7)

R U R' U R U2 R'
R U2 R' U' R U' R'
R U R' U R U' R' U R U2 R'
r U R' U' r' F R F'
R U2 L' U L U2 R' L' U L
R2 D R' U2 R D' R' U2 R'
R U2 R2 U' R2 U' R2 U2 R

Three U-layer corners oriented correctly, in the U layer: (5) 12

L D' L' U L D L' +
L' D2 L U2 L' D2 L -
(U2) R2 U2 R2 U' R2 U' R2 O
x (R U2 R' U' R U' R') (L' U2 L U L 'U L) x' I
[U y] (R U R' U')*2 [L2] (U R U' R')*2 L2 Im

One U-layer corner misoriented in U-layer: (18) 30

d (R' U R) U (R' U2' R) +
(U) (R U2 R') U2 (R U R') U2 (R U2 R')
(U') (R U2' R') U (R U R')
(U2) (R2 U' L') U (R2 U' L)
(U2) (R U2 R') U2 (R U R' U') (R U R')
U (R U2 R') U2 (R U R') U (R U' R')

(R U R' U') (R U' R') U2 (R U2 R') -
(R U2 R') U' (R U' R') 
(R U R' U') (R U' R') U (R U' R')
(U) (R U2 R') U' (R U R') [U (R U2 R')]*2
(U') (R U' R') U' (R U2 R')
(U) L U' R U L' U' R'

(U2) (R U' R') U (R U R') U (R U' R') O
(U) (R U R') [U (R U' R')]*2 U2 (R U R')
(U) (R U2 R' U')*3
(U') (R U R' U') (R U R') U (R U' R')
(R U R') [U (R U2 R')]*2 U (R U R')
(U2) R U2 R U2 R2 U' R2 U' (R' U R')

Quick Sunes: (2) 32

(U2) F' (RH anti-sune) F
(U2) F' Sune F

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now's where you start learning CLS to actually learn CLS, not just "easy cases"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Remainder of I cases: (7) 39

(R U R' U')(R U2 R') U'(R U R')
U2 (R U' R') U' (R U R')U2 (R U' R')
(R U2 R' U2) (R U2 R') U' (R U R')
(R U' R') U' (R U R' U') (R U2 R')
U (R U' R') U' (R U R') U2 (R U R' U') (R U R')
(R U' R') (U2 R U' R')*3
(R U2 R' U2 (R U R' U'))*2

Remainder of Im cases: (7) 46

(R U' R') U (R U2 R') (U R U' R')
U' (R U R') U2 (R U' R') U (R U R')
(R U2 R') U (R U' R') U (R U R')
(R U2 R') [U (R U' R')]*2 U' (R U' R')
(R U' R') U (R U2 R') U2 (R U2 R')
U (R U R') U R2 U R' U R U2 R2
(R U' R') U2 (R U2 R') U (R U' R') U2 (R U2 R')

Other Pretty Fast cases: (23) 69

(U) (R U R') U2 (R U R') +
U (R U' R') U (R U R' U') (R U R')
(U') (R U2' R') U (R U R')
(U2) (R U' R') U (R U' R') U' (R U R')
(U') (R U2 R') U (R U' R') U' (R U' R')
(U2) (R U' R') U2 (R U R') U (R U R')
d R' U (R U2 R') U R 

(U') (R U' R') U2' (R U' R') -
R U' (R U2 R') U' R U' R2
(R U' R') U2 (R U R') U2 (R U R' U') (R U R')
(R U2 R') U R2 U2 (R' U' R) U' R2
(U2) (R U' R') U2 (R U2 R') U2 (R U' R')
(R U' R2) U2 (R U R') U R2 U R'
R2 U2 (R U' R') U R2 U' R U' (R' U R')
(U') (R U' R') U' (R U' R') U (R U2 R')
(R U R') U (R U R' U') (R U' R') U2 (R U R')
(U) R2 U (R' U R) U2 (R' U R')

(R U R' U')*3 O
(R U R' U')*2 (R U2 R' U)*2
(U) (R U R' U') (R U2 R') U (R U' R')
[U (R U' R')]*2 U (R U R' U') (R U' R')
U' (R U R') U (R U' R') U2 (R U R')
(U) (R U2 R') U' (R U2 R') U2 (R U' R')

Finish off O: (13) 82

(R U2 R') U' (R U' R') U (R U' R') U2 (R U' R')
(U') (R U' R') U' (R U R' U') (R U R') U2 (R U' R')
(U') (R U2 R') U2 (R U2 R') U (R U' R')
(R U R') U2 (R U2 R') U2' (R U R')
(R U2 R') U R' U' (R U' R') U2 R2 U R' 
R U' R2 U' (R U' R') U2 (R2 U R')
(R U2 R') U' (R U' R') U (R U' R') U' (R U2 R')
U2 (R U' R') U' (R U' R') U2 (R U R')
(U2) (R U2 R') U2 (R U' R' U)*2
(U') (R U R' U') (R U R') U2 (R U2 R')
(U2) (R U' R') [U (R U R')]*2 U' (R U' R')
(U' y') R' U2 (R U R') U2 (R U2 R') U R
U (R U R' U') [(R U2 R') U2]*2

Finish off -: (9) 91

(U2) (R U R') U2 (R' U' R) (U' R' U2) (R2 U R')
(R2 U R') U R2 U' R2 U R' U2 R2
(R U' R') U (R' U' R) U' R' U2 R2 U' R'
(U) (R U2 R') U' (R U R') U (R U R')
(U2) (R U' R') U2 (R U2 R') U' (R U2 R')
(U2) R U' R U2 R' U' R' U R2 U2 R2 
(U) (R U R') U (R U R' U') (R U2 R')
(R U R' U') (R U' R') U (R U R') U' (R U' R') 
(U') (R' U R2) U R' U2 (R U R') U (R' U' R)


Finish off +: (14) (105)

(U2) (R U2 R') U (R U2 R') U2 (R U R')
U R' D' (R U R' U') (R U' R') U2 D R
(U) (R U R') U2 (R U2 R') U (R U2 R')
(R' U R) U2 R2 U' R U2 (R' U' R2)
(R U R') U (R U' R2) U2 R2 U (R2 U R)
(U') (R U R') U2 (R U' R') U2 (R U R' U') (R U R')
(R U R') U2 R' U' (R2 U' R2) U2 (R2 U R')
(U) (R U' R') U (R U R' U')(R U' R') U' (R U' R')
(U') (R2 U2 R') U' R U' R2' U (R U R') U
(U2) R U' R2 U2 (R U R') U R U2 (R U' R')
d R' U (R U2 R') U R 
(U2) R U R2 U' (R U' R') U2 R2 U2 R'
(R U R') U (R U2' R') U (R U' R')U2 (R U' R')
L2 D' (L' U L) D L2 U (L U2 L')



That took...a long time.


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## macky (Jul 22, 2010)

Great! Copying the 32(-7) to the CLS page now.

Questions:
(1) 2nd group 2nd alg under "One U-layer corner misoriented in U-layer: (18) 30"
(R U2 R') U' (R U' R') ?
(2) the two "quick Sunes"?
(3) you don't use (U)RULU'R'UL' ?


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 22, 2010)

macky said:


> Great! Copying the 32(-7) to the CLS page now.
> 
> Questions:
> (1) 2nd group 2nd alg under "One U-layer corner misoriented in U-layer: (18) 30"
> ...


editing...

1 - (U') (R U' R') U' (R U2 R') U' (R U2 R') U' (R U' R') sorry about that
2 - Basically, those are just 2 really nice cases that are easy to learn that have sune or anti-sune in them (making them fast/easy to learn)
3 - For OH, yes. Yeah, I know that's backwards. :/

half on-topic: wow. I guess I should bother finishing learning CLS myself, seeing as how I've done so much with it  (algs, papers, multiple threads, this, trainer...)


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## macky (Jul 22, 2010)

done minus the quick Sune cases. Let me know how you want to put up the full list, by the way. I can easily make a separate page for the full list based on your previous post, and that could do until Lucas gets algnex.us up. 

Plan view's good?


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 22, 2010)

macky said:


> done minus the quick Sune cases. Let me know how you want to put up the full list, by the way. I can easily make a separate page for the full list based on your previous post, and that could do until Lucas gets algnex.us up.
> 
> Plan view's good?


Plan view looks much better than "CLS" view, unless one were to choose to recognize each case by that view (it's possible, but I've found it to be a good deal harder - if one wanted a "no-rotation" solve, I guess that might work.)

If it's no trouble, putting up the full list would be nice.
As far as linking to 'me' is concerned, I noticed that you kinda just put an arbitrary link - don't feel the need to link, really. I don't exactly have a base for my stuff, besides this. I'll be updating/fixing/bumping that here within the next few days.


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## macky (Jul 22, 2010)

I'll put the full list separately, here: Stachu's CLS. I'll link it from my MGLS page.

This one doesn't work: U (R U' R') U' (R U R') U2 (R U R' U') (R U R').
And tell me what the quick sune/antisune are.

If you want to edit anything, you can just edit that html and send it to me to upload. Or if you'll be making changes frequently enough, I'll just give you access to my HostGator account.

long live emacs and its keyboard macro!


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 22, 2010)

macky said:


> I'll put the full list separately, here: Stachu's CLS. I'll link it from my MGLS page.
> 
> This one doesn't work: U (R U' R') U' (R U R') U2 (R U R' U') (R U R').
> And tell me what the quick sune/antisune are.
> ...


"Basically, those are just 2 really nice cases that are easy to learn that have sune or anti-sune in them (making them fast/easy to learn)"
quick sunes ^^

I'll figure out that alg in a bit - thanks for letting me know.

I probably won't be needing to make constant changes, but we'll see how things go.


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