# set-up move restriction in CP & EP



## dondee (Feb 7, 2007)

can anyone give a list of set-up restricted moves in corner and edge permutation.

thanks!


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## pjk (Feb 7, 2007)

What method? Depends on how you are solving really.


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## dondee (Feb 8, 2007)

ei,..am using a cycle method in permuting corners and edges....
I really find it hard in doing set-up moves....


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## tenderchkn (Feb 8, 2007)

Corners are restricted to L2, R2, F2, B2, U and D. Do a corner cycle on L, R, F, or B and you'll see why.

Depending on how you judge edge orientation, either LR or FB turns are restricted to half turns.


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## Me (Feb 16, 2007)

i've been assuming this but have to makes sure: in edges permutation, moves are restricted to R2 B2 L2 F2 and U D, you can also do U' D' or U2 D2? not totally certain.


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## tenderchkn (Feb 25, 2007)

Think about what affects orientation. The definition of an edge being correctly oriented is if it can be solved with a single turn. Since U or D turns never affect orientation, it's unrestricted. (Of course, orientation is always relative.)

Check out the edge orientation section: http://www.cubefreak.net/blindfoldcubing_guide.html

The reason some setup moves are restricted is because they affect orientation, and once you do a three cycle and reverse the setup, you FLIP the first edge, and UNFLIP another, resulting in two pieces incorrectly oriented.


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## Joël (Feb 26, 2007)

> _Originally posted by tenderchkn_@Feb 25 2007, 08:18 PM
> * Think about what affects orientation. The definition of an edge being correctly oriented is if it can be solved with a single turn. Since U or D turns never affect orientation, it's unrestricted. (Of course, orientation is always relative.) *


That's a pretty bad defenition for correct/incorrect orientation of an edge.. 

When the edges are permuted, you can define 'orientation' in different ways. Most blindfold cubers would say an edge is oriented correctly if it can be solved with U, D, R, L, F2 and B2 moves only. The only turns that are not allowed are F and B.

Try to flip an edge doing only U, D, R, L, F, B2 and F2 moves only. You will see this is not possible. The edge can reach all 12 positions in only 1 orientation.

Do RU on a solved cube. The UF edge can't be solved with a single turn now, yet most people would call this edge correctly oriented, because U'R' will insert the edge correctly.


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