# Next step in optimizing ortega?



## stufkan (Jul 4, 2009)

Hello fellow cubers! 

I have just been a week in Russia, and a lot of transportation meant a lot of 2x2 practice.. I have improved, but I am not sure how to improve further from now on. 

I did an average before I went to Russia and after. 

Before: 8,83
After : 8,14

That's a nice upgrade in a week (i think), but I have a hard time finding out how to optimize my times from now on.. Of course I need to practice over and over, but I thought that there could be some fixes to the method.. Currently i use plain ortega with color neutrality and foresee of bar/no bar in first layer during inspect... 


Any suggestions?


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## trying-to-speedcube... (Jul 4, 2009)

1. Learn 2x2-optimised algs.
2. Learn to do PBL's from all angles.
3. Learn a bit of EG if possible.
4. PRACTISE.


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## sru (Jul 4, 2009)

1. i'm sure you can do 1st face faster 
2. look ahead before PLL for finishing cube with U or U' or U2 (helped me a lot)

+ you must know, that you need a loooot solves for example sub-6

(i'm 6.5s avg100 at the moment  )


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## MistArts (Jul 4, 2009)

Inspect first layer and permutation during inspection. Inspect OLL if you have time.


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## stufkan (Jul 4, 2009)

Thanks for the quick answer!

1. I can do all the ones mentioned on Erik's site, are the other, shorter algs?
2. What step is PBL? 
3. Sounds a bit brutal to learn with a 8 sec avg, i think? Which cases do I have to look at in you opinion?
4. I am 

Edit:



> 2. look ahead before PLL for finishing cube with U or U' or U2 (helped me a lot)



I'm not sure i understand what you mean? I have to know if it is a U U' or U2 after the Pll before i execute it? Is it what you mean?



> + you must know, that you need a loooot solves for example sub-6



I sure know, but knowing those small tricks will make me commit myself more to practise more!




> Inspect first layer and permutation during inspection. Inspect OLL if you have time.



I have a hard time inspecting the oll, is there a nice trick?


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## sru (Jul 4, 2009)

> I'm not sure i understand what you mean? I have to know if it is a U U' or U2 after the Pll before i execute it? Is it what you mean?



yes yes  for every pll learn looking ahead (it's easy and you won't lose 0.5s or 1.0s at the end no more)

edit: i remembered one more "trick" now. you must know how many bars you have on your first face, that you won't search for them after OLL and preparing for PLL.


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## brunson (Jul 4, 2009)

Learn Guimond.


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## stufkan (Jul 4, 2009)

> Learn Guimond.



I have considered that one, but is it worth it?


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## Carrot (Jul 5, 2009)

stufkan said:


> > Learn Guimond.
> 
> 
> 
> I have considered that one, but is it worth it?



I'm not sure xD My average with ortega is 7-8 my guimond is 4-6 xD


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## brunson (Jul 5, 2009)

Odder said:


> stufkan said:
> 
> 
> > > Learn Guimond.
> ...


Granted I am particularly slow at 2x2, but I'm reliably slow. I went from ~14 seconds avg with Ortega to ~9 seconds with Guimond in three weeks. My fastest solve in practice with G. is 4.63 seconds.


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## StachuK1992 (Jul 5, 2009)

Just learn CLL.
42 algs, and they're pretty much all easy.

Rowe Hessler uses CLL, and he's decent.


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## blah (Jul 6, 2009)

stufkan said:


> Currently i use plain ortega with color neutrality and foresee of bar/no bar in first layer during inspect...



I use exactly that. I subbed-10 in a night (did 300+ solves that night, still remember ). Average of 100 sub-6 within a month or two, and I think that's just "normal" progress.

I believe most Japanese use that too. And they can probably sub-5 or maybe even sub-4 with that. Stick to it and see how it turns out.


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## Edmund (Jul 6, 2009)

CLL isn't too much at all. It's less than all the OLLs and the algs are short. It's 40 some and they are what makes you fast. Watch Rowe Hessler's videos on it.


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## Escher (Jul 6, 2009)

I average around 4.5 with Ortega:

- lookahead to the next step so that there are no/few pauses

- turn faster

- try to predict OLL type, if you can't predict OLL. It's not that hard to work out whether you'll have none, one or two corners correctly oriented, and whether the two corners will be together (T or U cases) or apart (bow-tie)

- learn more optimal OLL algs if you haven't already

- use T permutations instead of A permutations for PLL if you aren't already

- learn the more optimal Y perm (R U' R' U' F2 U' R U R' U F2). Add an R2 before the last F2 and now you know it on bottom too for if you get a PLL skip. I don't like it for Y on top (i just use the common alg) but the Y on bottom was useful before I learnt CLL.

- like others have said, learn to predict AUF (Adjust U Face). This is easier than it sounds, mess around with doing U turns, and then a PBL, and looking at the difference between different U pre-turns. You'll work it out.

- learn what case each of your OLLs solves (to get a PLL skip) and learn a different one so that you don't get a nasty PLL on bottom and have to rotate (chances are you'll have a T, not the Y you just learnt...)

- Learn some more PBLs. I'll list all of the ones I know or am learning here (I generated many of these, so no stealing without credit ). The F/R/B/L denotes where the bar/s is/are.

Single bar on U
F: R F' R F2 R' F R'
B: R' U R' F2 R F' R
R: (just AUF)
L: F' R U' R2 U R' F

Single bar on D
F: R' U F' R2 F R' F
B: R' F U' R2 U F' R
R: F' R F' R2 F U' R 
L: F' U R' U2 R U' F

2 Bars (together)
F: R2 U R2' U2 y' R2 U R2'
B: R2 U' R2' (U2' y) R2 U' R2'
R: R2 F2 U' R2 U2 F2 U' R2
L: R2 F2 U' F2' U2 R2 U' F2

I don't like the last alg, I just do a cube rotation so that its on B (if anybody has a better alg from that position that'd be great ). I'm also intending to generate algs for that last case so there's no AUF (but the bar will have to be in DB). 

- Do loads and loads and loads of solves for weeks. I didn't have a 3x3 for a month so I just did 2x2 and i got _much_ faster.

- After all this, learn Guimond/CLL, then the other. Both are fast and useful, and don't worry about leaving ortega; you never will, it's still useful in plenty of situations even if you learn other faster methods.

P.S Sorry this is such an essay...


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## Swordsman Kirby (Jul 7, 2009)

Back in the old days, every time 2x2 was mentioned, someone would talk about SS, and three more people would ask for a site. 

Luckily, for me, no one does that anymore. 

Back on topic: Ortega fails compared to CLL.


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## ConnorCuber (Jul 7, 2009)

Swordsman Kirby said:


> Back in the old days, every time 2x2 was mentioned, someone would talk about SS, and three more people would ask for a site.
> 
> Luckily, for me, no one does that anymore.
> 
> Back on topic: Ortega fails compared to CLL.



WATS A SITE 4 SSS PLOX?>!?!?!?!??!?! g


anyway, I use Ortega, and I think I average low 5's without much practice at all.(Probably about an average of 12 per week) But that's just because when I found Ortega, I practiced it a lot. Enough to get to about a 4.3 average. Then I stopped practicing too much.

I guess the point of this post is that all you need to do is practice a lot of ortega.


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## deadalnix (Jul 7, 2009)

Here ths point that help me to get under 6 with ortega (I recently work a lot on 2x2x2) :

1/ Inspect first layer permutation during inspection. Try to inspect OLL if you have enough time.
2/ If the frst layer is type adjacent, then put the two corner to swap on front or right.
3/ Learn spécific ortega OLL like RU'R2'FR2U'R'
4/ Learn ROLL (that allow you to gess the XLL you'll get after OLL).
5/ Learn AUF (so you can execute OLL XLL AUF without any pause).

Here are the easy improvement way. To go faster, you can learn guimond and start with the easiest between guimond and ortega.

If you are very courageaous and want to get realy fast, learn EG or OFOTA


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## rahulkadukar (Jul 7, 2009)

http://rapidshare.com/files/253018588/SS_0_1.pdf.html

SS algos


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## rahulkadukar (Jul 7, 2009)

http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=0026ad72ce98ca0f07258ee67c679e4ad5eaa31b0f91ac34b8eada0a1ae8665a

Same file


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## stufkan (Jul 7, 2009)

Thank you for all the good tips! 
I will look at it all, and of course do a lot of solves!

here do I learn about ROLL?
Are there some specific tips about AUF, or is it just recognition?


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## sru (Jul 7, 2009)

it's just recognition, you will know AUF after 1000 solves of ortega i'm sure 
it just comes in my opinion

i have few questions
what is ROLL?

and I don't understand CLL algorithms :S need help


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## sru (Jul 7, 2009)

and what is SS ?


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## deadalnix (Jul 7, 2009)

ROLL is pretty simple. You can check some information about this on 3x3x3 here : http://pagesperso-orange.fr/absolutemind/roll-angl.html

On 2x2x2 it allow you to predict the permutation case you'll get.

Note, the important point about ROLL is to think about this during the OLL execution, so it's different from CLL recognition.


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## Lucas Garron (Jul 7, 2009)

rahulkadukar said:


> http://rapidshare.com/files/253018588/SS_0_1.pdf.html
> 
> SS algos


Any good reason you don't link to the original URL?

(Also, no warranty on those algs yet.)


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## deadalnix (Jul 10, 2009)

sru said:


> and what is SS ?



I have made some research, and found nothing . . .


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## blah (Jul 14, 2009)

deadalnix said:


> sru said:
> 
> 
> > and what is SS ?
> ...



Sun-Stern. Timothy Sun-Mitchell Stern. Swordsman Kirby-watermelon. It's on Tim's site if I remember correctly.


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## brunson (Jul 14, 2009)

I used to have a link to Tim's site, but the last time I checked he'd taken it down.


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## manyhobbyfreak (Jan 19, 2010)

i use ortega right now and average around 10 second.
i want to be faster before my 2nd comp on 20 februari.
is it worth (and possible) too learn cll in like an month.
i heard that cll needs some practise so i don't now what i should do.


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## Muesli (Jan 19, 2010)

manyhobbyfreak said:


> i use ortega right now and average around 10 second.
> i want to be faster before my 2nd comp on 20 februari.
> is it worth (and possible) too learn cll in like an month.
> i heard that cll needs some practise so i don't now what i should do.


If you do an Average of 2500 you will be at 6 seconds in no time.


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## manyhobbyfreak (Jan 19, 2010)

Musli4brekkies said:


> manyhobbyfreak said:
> 
> 
> > i use ortega right now and average around 10 second.
> ...



is an average of 2500 not a bit too much.
avg of 25 is more likely an good avg for my


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## deadalnix (Jan 19, 2010)

Also, learn ROLL and preinspect the orientation case you'll get after first face.


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## Escher (Jan 19, 2010)

manyhobbyfreak said:


> i use ortega right now and average around 10 second.
> i want to be faster before my 2nd comp on 20 februari.
> is it worth (and possible) too learn cll in like an month.
> i heard that cll needs some practise so i don't now what i should do.



Yes, it's possible to learn all the algorithms for CLL in about a day, but recognition takes a long time to get good at.
You can find CLL algorithms on Rowe Hessler's, Erik Akkersdijk's, and my youtube channel, and on David Woner's and Anthony Brookes' websites.
There are also some in the speedsolving wiki, but most of them aren't very good.

I think that you should practice Ortega first though, and come back to CLL after your next competition. Switching or learning new methods just before a competition (especially for 2x2) is not a good idea - trust me.

You can get sub 6 seconds with Ortega quite easily with a bit of specific practice: 
- When you build your first face, remember the permutation on the bottom (if you have made a layer, if you have a bar on bottom and where the bar is, and if you have a diagonal swap on bottom). 
- Make sure you are colour neutral.
- Learn some good PBLs (from here are the best), and practice them lots. 
- Make sure you are using the best OLLs for each case (R'FR2U'R2FR is one that lots of people don't know, but is amazing).
- and last but not least, turn fast! Lookahead during the solve isn't very important in 2x2, but turning fast, using pre-inspection well and having good recognition are.


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## DavidWoner (Jan 19, 2010)

stufkan said:


> > Learn Guimond.
> 
> 
> 
> I have considered that one, but is it worth it?



Is what worth it? There is barely anything to learn with Guimond.

CLL is fine for some people, but it is not the best method for all. I only use it if the layer is really easy.

SS algs: http://www.dtwoner.110mb.com/index.php?p=1_49_SS

Nobody mentions OFOTA anymore. The algs for the adjacent case are actually pretty good. I haven't generated the diagonal case yet though.


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## manyhobbyfreak (Jan 19, 2010)

Escher said:


> manyhobbyfreak said:
> 
> 
> > i use ortega right now and average around 10 second.
> ...



i am still using 3x3 oll algs, can you post post the algs for each case that you use.


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## Muesli (Jan 19, 2010)

manyhobbyfreak said:


> Escher said:
> 
> 
> > manyhobbyfreak said:
> ...



http://www.blueknightcubing.com/2x2.htm

These are pretty good OLLs.


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## Escher (Jan 19, 2010)

DavidWoner said:


> CLL is fine for some people, but it is not the best method for all. I only use it if the layer is really easy.
> 
> SS algs: http://www.dtwoner.110mb.com/index.php?p=1_49_SS
> 
> Nobody mentions OFOTA anymore. The algs for the adjacent case are actually pretty good. I haven't generated the diagonal case yet though.



^David makes a good point, OFOTA is a great method, as is SS. They both have a good capacity for one-look solves, and despite each having more cases than CLL each algorithm is often much shorter and faster, and are often mirrors/inverses of another.



manyhobbyfreak said:


> i am still using 3x3 oll algs, can you post post the algs for each case that you use.



U: FRUR'U'F'
sune: RUR'URU2R'
anti-sune: RU2R'U'RU'R'
Pi: R'FR2U'R2FR
L: FRU'R'U'RUR'F'
T: RUR'U'R'FRF'
H: R2U2R'U2R2


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## Meisen (Jan 19, 2010)

I just learned Ortega a couple of days ago when i got my ES from cubelagoon 
Within 24 hours i had a sub 9 avg of 12.

I highly recommend learning ortega as the first 2x2x2 method.


On topic: I have nothing to contribute as of yet


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## nlCuber22 (Jan 19, 2010)

manyhobbyfreak said:


> i use ortega right now and average around 10 second.
> i want to be faster before my 2nd comp on 20 februari.
> is it worth (and possible) too learn cll in like an month.
> i heard that cll needs some practise so i don't now what i should do.



I learned half of CLL in two days 
I need to get working on it.


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## miniGOINGS (Jan 19, 2010)

deadalnix said:


> Also, learn ROLL and preinspect the orientation case you'll get after first face.



ROLL?


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## Escher (Jan 19, 2010)

miniGOINGS said:


> deadalnix said:
> 
> 
> > Also, learn ROLL and preinspect the orientation case you'll get after first face.
> ...



http://pagesperso-orange.fr/absolutemind/roll-angl.html


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## miniGOINGS (Jan 19, 2010)

Escher said:


> http://pagesperso-orange.fr/absolutemind/roll-angl.html



I've heard about it, but I had no idea that's what it's called. I was trying to think of what the R could stand for. Thanks.


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## tkcube1 (Jan 19, 2010)

I've gotten a sub 4 average with ortega. That was a bit lucky but sub 6 isn't to hard just practice and get a lanlan. (I don't have on yet though  )


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