# How long it takes the Organizer have to reply the competitor by e-mail.



## Crazycubemom (Nov 22, 2011)

Hello cuber,

I feel very strange that more than 2 months a go or for exact when The Competition just announced. I have registered myself @ Munich Open 2011 and 3 days a go I received email from the organizer about The venue is too small and the competitors already out of limit  last month I saw the competitors < 40 and now 81 competitors.

I feel okay if the organizer confirming or rejecting competitor not too long after the competitor filled in the Register form.

Sorry if I don't know where I have to post about it.


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## Jakube (Nov 22, 2011)

Crazycubemom said:


> I feel very strange that more than 2 months a go or for exact when The Competition just announced. I have registered myself @ Munich Open 2011 and 3 days a go I received email from the organizer about The venue is too small and the competitors already out of limit  last month I saw the competitors < 40 and now 81 competitors.


 
Exact the same as by me. I registered for Munich Open 2 months ago, and got the E-Mail two or three days ago.

The organization team could have handle this better. But it was not a big problem for me, because some days later I saw on the homepage of the MO, that there are already 81 competitors and I´m not one of them.


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## Crazycubemom (Nov 22, 2011)

When I saw Munich Open 2011 , my thought goes to a BIG city and of course a big competition and the venue must be enough for what you called a name of a Big city.
Actually they should call this competition Munich Friends competition, only the organizer friends welcome and for sure I won't registered myself though I love Munich so much.


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## anders (Nov 22, 2011)

Crazycubemom said:


> Sorry if I don't know where I have to post about it.



If you are unhappy with an organiser, the first point of contact is the WCA Delegate of that competition. If you still feel unfairly treated, you can appeal to the WCA Board or contact the Independent Advisory Committee lead by me.

Contact information: http://www.worldcubeassociation.org/node/12

/Anders


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## Crazycubemom (Nov 22, 2011)

Thank you Anders, 
I hope it helps to another Rejected competitor(s) and Bad organizer.


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## noiusli (Nov 22, 2011)

It's annoying and strange what has happened to both of you and the cause is indeed a big mistake by the organizers and they should correct it. But maybe when you registered the list was already full and they didn't say anything to you. I said this because of what happened to me last year @ Munich open. I registered very very early (maybe 4-5 months ahead) and was included in position 4 in the list of participants, but the organizers took quite a lot of time in sending me the message of confirmation and to my surprise they said that there was no clock (the puzzle I am better at) although originally was included in the list of categories, but afterwards they deleted it (they had included it by mistake, they said). I was quite dissapointed by that.
Anyway, I think you both could write again to the organizers complaining about the situation and trying to be included. Good luck!!


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## TMOY (Nov 22, 2011)

noiusli said:


> But maybe when you registered the list was already full and they didn't say anything to you.


I guess that's actually what happened... It's a problem which is specific to German competitions (at least I haven't witnessed it in any other country I have competed in): when a new comp is annonced the German speedcbing community instantaneously goes crazy and the list of participants gets filled up in no time. I didn't register for that comp, but I readd the discussion about it on the German forum and there were people making complaints about how it was already impossible to register even on the very first day...


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## Crazycubemom (Nov 22, 2011)

@ TMOY, that's why they should call their competitions is "Just for friends competition" I'm happy if I'm able to come to Dusseldorf Open , Aachen Open and German Open and German National. 

I think WCA must do something about what is Open competitions ( The venue must enough for > 100 competitors ) and specially if you use a Big city name. Or maybe I will organize The Haque Open in my house only my friends welcome. If it continue every times just like a cheap competition ( not fair/ Open )


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## Crazycubemom (Nov 22, 2011)

noiusli said:


> It's annoying and strange what has happened to both of you.
> Anyway, I think you both could write again to the organizers complaining about the situation and trying to be included. Good luck!!


 
I have no more passion after I received email from the Organizer and he said that I have to understand that the venue is too small. How can I understand about it even people with IQ below 75 still confuse if they got email like that after more than 2 months waiting and last month was < 40 competitors and now already 81 without my name ? . And till now no declaration or reply from the organizer and I'm tired if WCA delegate do nothing if it already 3 people complaining , or Germany needs more WCA delegate to make those competitions more smooth and Fair and Open . I have tried to reply E-mail from The Organizer but I couldn't reply it 

I can't imagine IF I already paid the hotel and paid the transport to Munich and I'm not able to compete :/


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## tim (Nov 23, 2011)

Crazycubemom said:


> I can't imagine IF I already paid the hotel and paid the transport to Munich and I'm not able to compete :/


 
You've never been on the competitor's list, have you? Sure, they could've informed you earlier that you won't make it from the waiting list to the competitor's list, but you make it sound like they've kicked you out of the competition. That wasn't the case...


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## Sebastien (Nov 23, 2011)

Maria, please stop beeing ridiculous.

The competition has been announced in the beginning of July already and since some days later there have always been ~80 competitors on the website's competitor's list as there have been ~100 registrations within the first day! So if you say there were <40 competitors listed a month ago, then this is simply wrong!

Some of you obviously don't understand how a competition's registration works: You register and as long as you register soon enough *and only then* you get accepted and a confirmation mail. *Also only then* you are listed among the online competitor's list and can call yourself _registered_. If you get no confirmation and are not listed online, then you are obviously not accepted because the competition is already too full and you land on a waiting list. If you don't understand this by yourself, then this is rather your fault and not the organiser's mistake.

In that particular case: There have just been ~100 people that registered earlier than you, just deal with that!

Well, of course an organiser could have immidiately send out mails telling people, that they are on the waiting list, but I don't really see that they should have done that.

Eventually the organiser was kind enough to send out a mail to all those, that still didn't make it after some unregistrations, simply to avoid misunderstanding (obviously there are a lot of them). This could not have been done earlier, because you can never be sure how many unregistrations you have! So everyone on the waiting list could still be accepted until some days before the competitions where no further changes are made!

The claim that a competition having "a big cities name" in it should need to have a large capacity is simply ridiculous, sorry.

@Jesus: Considering last year, clock has never been on the time schedule. Clock was probably listed in on the events list on the WCA site, which was then my fault when I sent the competition details for the anouncement or the fault of the person on WCA's side that simply made a click too much when handling the anouncement. So blaming the organisers for this makes no sense.


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## tim (Nov 23, 2011)

Sébastien_Auroux said:


> If you get no confirmation and are not listed online, then you are obviously not accepted because the competition is already too full and you land on a waiting list. If you don't understand this by yourself, then this is rather your fault and not the organiser's mistake.


 
She has a point, though. The lack of a confirmation email doesn't imply that you are on some kind of waiting list (emails get lost, inboxes are full and most importantly the organizer might not be able to accept people for several weeks). There really should be some kind of a "Hey, unfortunately you only made it to our waiting list. So don't expect to be able to compete, but if there'll be enough space, we'll let you know." email sent to these people.


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## Sebastien (Nov 23, 2011)

You're probably right that there should be some kind of mail like this. 

But I don't see this beeing part or reason of Maria's complaints.


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## Bryan (Nov 23, 2011)

http://cube.hackvalue.de/muc11/s/en/competitors

Can you explain what "As this is one of the few competitions in southern Germany, we feel free to prefer local competitors (Munich area)." means? Do Munich people get priority over non-Munich people?


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## Sebastien (Nov 23, 2011)

No priority in general. The sponsor asked if it is possible to give the last 10 spots to local competitors (same for last year). In 2010 I asked Ron if this is ok and got a possitive response.


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## Crazycubemom (Nov 23, 2011)

@ My 100 points goes to Tim.

Sébastien, I don't think I'm a ridiculous in this case, If you were in my place what you gonna do ? Just smiling ? And you don't calling me as ridiculous, take a look at this case honestly and I'm not the only person who really disappointed. And I registered more 2 and half months a go, and you are so sure that 100 competitors already registered at the first day, why they still open the registered form? :/ They should closed the register at the first day if it only 80 competitors allowed.

Of course " use a Big city name " makes the competitions more exiting ( that's why I do like to come to compete and sigh seeing).

By the way I always open and read about WCA competitions list everyday.


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## noiusli (Nov 23, 2011)

Sébastien_Auroux said:


> @Jesus: Considering last year, clock has never been on the time schedule. Clock was probably listed in on the events list on the WCA site, which was then my fault when I sent the competition details for the anouncement or the fault of the person on WCA's side that simply made a click too much when handling the anouncement. So blaming the organisers for this makes no sense.



Yes, that's what happened. Clock was listed in on the events list on the WCA site, so I thought it would be in the open and I didn't check the web of the open to confirm it. And when the organizers told me that clock was not in I thought that there was their fault.


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## shelley (Nov 23, 2011)

From the registration website:



> Registration will be closed as soon as we reach registrations for 70 competitors!



Did this happen? If I see this, then click through to the registration page and see that it's still open, I would assume that, well, registration is still open and I can still get a spot. In this case, a clarification email saying "sorry, you registered too late and didn't get a spot" would be in order, preferably before competitors make actual plans to travel and attend.


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## fw (Nov 24, 2011)

Hi Maria,

please don't take such things personally. The organizers of Munich Open (Björn and Cubikon) don't have that much experience (compared to people like Ton, Ron, Sebastien, etc., who organized many more competitions). Of course, people make mistakes. It's not against you personally, I'm sure.

Regarding the missing emails. I agree. And that is partly my fault (because I wrote the software that is used to organize all german competitions). In the next version (so this applies to the next german competition which does not have a website yet), I will add a feature to send emails to everybody who TRIES to register and not just emails to people that are actually accepted. I hope this will help to prevent such situations in the future.

See you
Flo

PS: Tim agreed to share some of his mad programming skills with me, so we will do a rewrite of large parts of my organization software which is used in Germany. If you are missing other features than the email thing, now would be a good time to let us know.


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## Sebastien (Nov 24, 2011)

Crazycubemom said:


> Sébastien, I don't think I'm a ridiculous in this case



1. Your repeated statement that there were <40 people on the competitors list a month ago which is just wrong.
2. Your claim that a "Munich" Open would need to have more capacity than for 80 people, only because Munich is a big city and part of the competition's name.



Crazycubemom said:


> If you were in my place what you gonna do ?


 
There is no way that I would be in your place. As I have already stated it is totally natural to me that I only feel registered for a competition if I am listed on the website and/or got a confirmation mail. Neither of those happened for you. I really can't understand how you got surprised by that latest newsletter, because it only said what should have been obvious before.



Crazycubemom said:


> I'm not the only person who really disappointed.



Beeing disappointed if you can't go to a competition you wanted to go to, because it is already full, is very natural and so there are definetely lots of disappointed people. 
Making ridiculous complaints because of this is a different story.



Crazycubemom said:


> And I registered more 2 and half months a go



you registered 4 and a half months before to be precise.



Crazycubemom said:


> you are so sure that 100 competitors already registered at the first day, why they still open the registered form? :/ They should closed the register at the first day if it only 80 competitors allowed.



No, because people use to cancel and then the next people not beeing activated are in. If you woud just close the registration after 80 registrations you would eventually have 50 competitors only.



shelley said:


> Did this happen? If I see this, then click through to the registration page and see that it's still open, I would assume that, well, registration is still open and I can still get a spot. In this case, a clarification email saying "sorry, you registered too late and didn't get a spot" would be in order, preferably before competitors make actual plans to travel and attend.


 
We probably have different definitions on what is a "closed registration". Just because you can still fill in a registration form doesn't mean that you can still register.
Also please don't ignore, that every registration, no matter how late it comes, has still a chance to be accepted. That's the principle of a wainting list.
The mail you mention was actually send - some days ago. That's the origin of this Thread's complaints. 
Eventually I can't help people that just fill registration forms and then already make travel plans without getting any confirmation. That's just not how life works.


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## Crazycubemom (Nov 24, 2011)

@ Flo, thank you for your nice words, that's why I never complain about Aachen Open  because you are a very good to Organize competition in Germany.

@ Sébastien, so true this thread is about my COMPLAIN that I have registered my self @ Munich Open 2011 more than 2 months a go even worse More than 4 months a go and last weekend I just received E-mail from The Organizer that The Venue is too small. Complain not allowed in the WCA competitions? Complains = Ridiculous?


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## Sebastien (Nov 24, 2011)

Crazycubemom said:


> Complains = Ridiculous?


 
nope. I have already listed the 2 points that made me call your behaviour ridiculous.


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## Crazycubemom (Nov 24, 2011)

Sébastien_Auroux said:


> 1. Your repeated statement that there were <40 people on the competitors list a month ago which is just wrong.
> 2. Your claim that a "Munich" Open would need to have more capacity than for 80 people, only because Munich is a big city and part of the competition's


 
I see, those of them in your opinion are Ridiculous. 

In my Opinion a Ridiculous person(s) who Organize @ Munich Open 2011.


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## Crazycubemom (Nov 24, 2011)

and you are not Ridiculous to protecting a bad organizer?


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## Sebastien (Nov 24, 2011)

I see no bad organiser, just a very delicate competitor.


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## Crazycubemom (Nov 24, 2011)

Sébastien_Auroux;674214[B said:


> ]I see no bad organiser[/B], just a very delicate competitor.


 
It is the same as you said about me that I'm ridiculous person to me It is a Bad Organizer. I find it Ridiculous that you do not understand that informing competitors 4 month after pre-registration that I am not registered, that people will complain. And even more ridiculous if you know the competition is full after one-day to keep the registration open. I had hoped that you would learn and improve , but instead you find me ridiculous.


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## hcfong (Nov 24, 2011)

Maria and Sebastien,

With all due respect, I know I have no right to interfere in this discussion or tell anyone off but could you take this discussion to a more private environment please? I don't think it's contributing to anything now and has basically become an argument between two people now. As I see it, both parties are partly to blame and could have done things differently to avoid this situation. Maria should not have assumed that we was registered until she got a firm confirmation from the organiser in the form of an email or her name appearing on the competitor's list, and the organiser should have sent an email informing her she didn't make it on the competitors' list at this stage a lot earlier. anyway, it's happened now and the competition is full. There are many more competitions to come so I don't see a problem with it. It's a learning point for the future. But as I said before, I have nothing to do with situation and have no right commenting on this, so please feel free to ignore me if you wish, but I think it's time to take this discussion to a private setting.


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## Crazycubemom (Nov 24, 2011)

Thank you mister Fong, Yes indeed I have learned something new about a competition.


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## Sebastien (Nov 24, 2011)

Crazycubemom said:


> It is the same as you said about me that I'm ridiculous person



I have never said so.



hcfong said:


> I don't think it's contributing to anything now and has basically become an argument between two people now.


 
You're totally right, I just completely missed that everyone else was dropping out of the discussion. Sorry for this.


A last thing I want to emphasize (and what hopefully contributes to the discussion): At other competitions the organisers just never inform people that are not accepted. And then noone complains. So everyone who does now should think about that.


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## Crazycubemom (Nov 24, 2011)

we will see.


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