# qwr's road to nowhere



## qwr (Feb 7, 2021)

I actually record all my session averages in a spreadsheet so this thread is completely unnecessary
but since everyone makes one I'll do one too



btw in a year or so I'll combine together all my cstimer solves into one epic compilation. it will be the progression to end all progressions


----------



## Pyjam (Feb 7, 2021)

Great title. I wish you plain success.


----------



## abunickabhi (Feb 7, 2021)

Good luck. As long as you are personally improving there is no harm.

Breaking records and getting world class at an event is not mandatory to enjoy cubing.


----------



## qwr (Feb 7, 2021)

Since my practice isn't consistent, maybe I should report my progress in terms of solve index (ex. solve #1000) rather than date


----------



## Deleted member 55877 (Feb 7, 2021)

nic title


----------



## Porcupine01 (Feb 7, 2021)

Love going to nowhere, it’s a nice place


----------



## Pyjam (Feb 8, 2021)

Once arrived nowhere there are chances you'll discover the place is already very busy.


----------



## qwr (Feb 8, 2021)

Pyjam said:


> Once arrived nowhere there are chances you'll discover the place is already very busy.



my goal is to be going nowhere...fast





better audio version


----------



## 2018AMSB02 (Feb 8, 2021)

qwr said:


> my goal is to be going nowhere...fast
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Lol, I thought of meatloaf when I saw the title too


----------



## Pyjam (Feb 8, 2021)

qwr said:


> my goal is to be going nowhere...fast


It was a joke. My apologies if you didn't like it.


----------



## DNF_Cuber (Feb 8, 2021)

qwr said:


> I actually record all my session averages in a spreadsheet so this thread is completely unnecessary


Is that really a great way to start yourself out?


----------



## qwr (Feb 8, 2021)

DNF_Cuber said:


> Is that really a great way to start yourself out?


none of those progression threads are necessary. they should go in their own subforum to reduce clutter


----------



## qwr (Feb 11, 2021)

i've been thinking that just doing timed solves isn't going to help me because it's just practicing my bad habits.
so if I have a (loose) practice schedule, I think it should be half untimed solves working on cross and f2l, then half normal solves as practice.
what do you guys think


----------



## EngiNerdBrian (Feb 12, 2021)

qwr said:


> i've been thinking that just doing timed solves isn't going to help me because it's just practicing my bad habits.
> so if I have a (loose) practice schedule, I think it should be half untimed solves working on cross and f2l, then half normal solves as practice.
> what do you guys think


Defitely. Over the last month or two I've been doing cross only practice (forcing myself to track all 4 edges and solve blindfolded) and using the cstimer cross solved scrambled to practice f2l directly. 

I also realized timed solves was just making me repeat my mistakes or bad f2L solutions. Time for deliberate practice of the individual substeps in your solve!


----------



## qwr (Mar 4, 2021)

EngiNerdBrian said:


> Defitely. Over the last month or two I've been doing cross only practice (forcing myself to track all 4 edges and solve blindfolded) and using the cstimer cross solved scrambled to practice f2l directly.
> 
> I also realized timed solves was just making me repeat my mistakes or bad f2L solutions. Time for deliberate practice of the individual substeps in your solve!


I am getting better at making crosses correctly and efficiently but sometimes I still get a horrendous white cross I just don't want to deal with. So I did a few test runs of trying CN and it's only a little slower than my current solves (~35 sec). I'll practice CN for a bit and see if it helps. (I'm already CN on 2x2 but that is super easy because there's no F2L)


----------



## SH03L4C3 (Mar 4, 2021)

qwr said:


> I am getting better at making crosses correctly and efficiently but sometimes I still get a horrendous white cross I just don't want to deal with. So I did a few test runs of trying CN and it's only a little slower than my current solves (~35 sec). I'll practice CN for a bit and see if it helps.


I gave up learning CN. I dont have time with school, and some top cubers (livia kleiner, luke greisser, ...) are not color neutral.


----------



## qwr (Mar 4, 2021)

SH03L4C3 said:


> I gave up learning CN. I dont have time with school, and some top cubers (livia kleiner, luke greisser, ...) are not color neutral.


if you don't have time for CN, you don't have time for practicing at all?


----------



## SH03L4C3 (Mar 4, 2021)

qwr said:


> if you don't have time for CN, you don't have time for practicing at all?


I guess... I only practice on weekends


----------



## qwr (Mar 4, 2021)

SH03L4C3 said:


> I guess... I only practice on weekends


yeah my practicing is very inconsistent. if I just did like some slow solves and practice every day I think I could improve much quicker.


----------



## EngiNerdBrian (Mar 4, 2021)

qwr said:


> yeah my practicing is very inconsistent. if I just did like some slow solves and practice every day I think I could improve much quicker.


Consistency is the hardest part. I think we all struggle with it. I do try and atleast o some slow F2L practice while checking out at the end of the day. Cubing takes a lot of mental energy so it definitely can be hard to make time for true practice!


----------



## qwr (Mar 4, 2021)

EngiNerdBrian said:


> Consistency is the hardest part. I think we all struggle with it. I do try and atleast o some slow F2L practice while checking out at the end of the day. Cubing takes a lot of mental energy so it definitely can be hard to make time for true practice!


Do you think it's bad I don't even know how to do the tricky f2l cases? I mean like cases with the pair stuck together. I only know a few cases. I feel like if I practice my bad solutions too much, I'll just get used to them.


----------



## GenTheThief (Mar 4, 2021)

qwr said:


> Do you think it's bad I don't even know how to do the tricky f2l cases? I mean like cases with the pair stuck together. I only know a few cases. I feel like if I practice my bad solutions too much, I'll just get used to them.


I would go through and learn at least the LS cases for F2L on somewhere like algdb or speedcubedb and compare what your solution is to what the one posted there is. You don't necessarily need to memorize it then and there, but being familiar with it and learning it intuitively really helps out.
I think the main thing with tricky F2L cases is that you make sure to break them apart in a way that leads to a nicer case (like a split insert) as opposed to just separating the pieces.

Regarding CN, since you're still over 30 seconds, I would definitely invest time in getting comfortable being full CN, as its a real pain to try to make the switch once you get faster. I've heard other people have had success doing things like BLD scrambles and just solving in that orientation to avoid cross bias, even though the whole point is to select the best cross.


----------



## qwr (Mar 4, 2021)

GenTheThief said:


> I would go through and learn at least the LS cases for F2L on somewhere like algdb or speedcubedb and compare what your solution is to what the one posted there is. You don't necessarily need to memorize it then and there, but being familiar with it and learning it intuitively really helps out.
> I think the main thing with tricky F2L cases is that you make sure to break them apart in a way that leads to a nicer case (like a split insert) as opposed to just separating the pieces.
> 
> Regarding CN, since you're still over 30 seconds, I would definitely invest time in getting comfortable being full CN, as its a real pain to try to make the switch once you get faster. I've heard other people have had success doing things like BLD scrambles and just solving in that orientation to avoid cross bias, even though the whole point is to select the best cross.


yeah some cases the split and combine works pretty well, albeit with a rotation if I don't use f or F moves. 

for CN I am not so used to finding good crosses when it's not white but sometimes there'll be a really easy 4 move solution on another color that I can spot (usually involving one or more cross edges already relatively solved)


----------



## EngiNerdBrian (Mar 4, 2021)

qwr said:


> Do you think it's bad I don't even know how to do the tricky f2l cases? I mean like cases with the pair stuck together. I only know a few cases. I feel like if I practice my bad solutions too much, I'll just get used to them.


I feel ya. Starting right around the new year I really started focusing in on my bad F2L cases. I was noticed I’d consistently do something “bad” or inefficient during solves. I definitely think it’s worth the time to deliberately fix those habits if you can can manage it. Having good solutions for the bad cases I’d imagine is one of those small things that takes your solves to the next level.


----------



## Cubing Forever (Mar 4, 2021)

qwr said:


> Do you think it's bad I don't even know how to do the tricky f2l cases? I mean like cases with the pair stuck together. I only know a few cases. I feel like if I practice my bad solutions too much, I'll just get used to them.


with the pair stuck together wrong in the U layer, there's only a few cases which are very intuitive.(considering front right slot is open

you recognize this case as cross color facing the top and the front sticker of the corner is not identical to the top sticker of the edge. To solve this, you separate the pieces using R U2 R' which sets up to R U R'

full solution: R U2 R' U' R U R' (for FR slot)(do not confuse this with an antisune)




This is the mirror of the first case. You notice that the top color of the edge and the front color of the corner both match.
you do R U' R' U' which brings the corner into the bottom layer. you solve the resulting F2L case with R U' R'(which sets up the pair) U R U' R'(insert the pair)

full solution(for FR slot): R U' R' U' R U' R' U R U' R'


These are two important cases for the pair connected wrong cases. There are others but I'm too lazy to gen images and post them here


----------



## GenTheThief (Mar 4, 2021)

Cubing Forever said:


> This is the mirror of the first case. You notice that the top color of the edge and the front color of the corner both match.
> you do R U' R' U' which brings the corner into the bottom layer. you solve the resulting F2L case with R U' R'(which sets up the pair) U R U' R'(insert the pair)
> 
> full solution(for FR slot): R U' R' U' R U' R' U R U' R'



For the second case you posted, there are actually a few better algs for that:
(U) (R' U2 R U R' U R2) (U R') -- back sune, cancel into a split pair
(U') (R' U' R) (U') (R' U2 R2 U2 R') - separate edge, place corner on top, insert both pairs
(U2) (R' U' R) (U' R') (U2 R2 U' R) - hide corner, pair with edge, insert both pairs


----------



## qwr (Mar 4, 2021)

all of those seem about the same

is there a specific f2l case trainer that just shows you a picture case? maybe my poor man f2l trainer wasn't so stupid https://www.speedsolving.com/threads/poor-mans-f2l-trainer.78549/


----------



## qwr (Mar 5, 2021)

Just got a pb single of 22.09 on my first solve of the day on yellow cross. I'm glad I looked because I couldn't pass up the TWO MOVE cross (apparently only a 0.54% chance), and f2l went smoothly.
U' F2 D' L2 F2 R2 U2 F2 D L U R2 F' D' R U' L' F2 U'

Honestly it's kinda crazy. I improved my session avg 2.5 seconds just by doing CN crosses because I have low cross tps and not good planning.


----------



## qwr (May 8, 2021)

PB single 20.94 on a scramble that wasn't even that good. idk what I did but it was green cross and weird but the f2l turned out easy
R D R L' B2 L' D2 B L' U2 B2 R2 B2 R2 U2 D' L2 B2 D B2

also my 2x2 session average of 5.75 is my new best after I started implementing tracking the first layer PBL bar and predicting OLL on easy ortega first face. I'm much more active practicing 2x2 rn and I think getting better PBL algs that don't use D moves (as much) and predicting OLL will help me get sub-5.

I'm technically CN but I have a strong bias towards solving on white or yellow. It's just easier F2L for me.

Edit: actually I got another PB single 20.64 with an easy white cross and I guess lucky f2l
R2 B D R' B' D2 F2 B R' F2 U R2 F2 U' D L2 U' R2 B2 L2
also my first sub-30 session avg which is exciting


----------



## Cubing Forever (May 9, 2021)

qwr said:


> R D R L' B2 L' D2 B L' U2 B2 R2 B2 R2 U2 D' L2 B2 D B2


this is some scramble lol:
M U L2 B //cross
U R U R' U' S' L' S //Pair
U F' U' F U F' U' F //Pair
U F U2 R U2 R2 U' R U' R U' R' U F R U R' U' F2 //stuff
U R U' L' U R' U' L //ZBLL


----------



## qwr (May 9, 2021)

I can't remember my solution any more. It sure wasn't optimal in any way, I just got lucky.

Also I've confirmed a valuable lesson. ALWAYS PLAN CROSS. Sometimes I get lazy and try to wing it for a cross and it usually doesn't end well for my times.


----------



## Cubing Forever (May 9, 2021)

qwr said:


> I can't remember my solution any more. It sure wasn't optimal in any way, I just got lucky.
> 
> Also I've confirmed a valuable lesson. ALWAYS PLAN CROSS. Sometimes I get lazy and try to wing it for a cross and it usually doesn't end well for my times.


Yes that's true. Not planning the cross(cross+1 at advanced levels) results in bad pauses.


----------



## PikachuPlayz_MC (May 9, 2021)

BUTTER MAN


----------



## qwr (May 12, 2021)

I had a good 2x2 session today, practicing optimizing turning for the ortega first face, remembering first layer bar, and starting to practice OLL prediction (mostly on easy first face)

If you are wondering, this is what my spreadsheet looks like. I also save every cstimer time I've ever done (I mean every single time)





PikachuPlayz_MC said:


> BUTTER MAN



Reminder to checkout my youtube channel


----------



## qwr (May 13, 2021)

idk if it's because i'm not good at CN F2L yet, but I find dual CN (white and yellow) to be usually sufficient for cross, while any other cross color slows my f2l.
I won't pass up an easy cross on a different color but maybe dual CN is better for me?


----------



## Cubing Forever (May 13, 2021)

qwr said:


> I had a good 2x2 session today, practicing optimizing turning for the ortega first face, remembering first layer bar, and starting to practice OLL prediction (mostly on easy first face)
> 
> If you are wondering, this is what my spreadsheet looks like. I also save every cstimer time I've ever done (I mean every single time)
> 
> View attachment 15710


why th would you use a wittwo in 2021??


----------



## qwr (May 13, 2021)

Cubing Forever said:


> why th would you use a wittwo in 2021??


for fun ofc 
my times are the same because i'm not fast enough for it to matter.


----------



## PetrusQuber (May 13, 2021)

qwr said:


> idk if it's because i'm not good at CN F2L yet, but I find dual CN (white and yellow) to be usually sufficient for cross, while any other cross color slows my f2l.
> I won't pass up an easy cross on a different color but maybe dual CN is better for me?


Dual CN is never better long-run, although it may seem so to you short-term.
Anything new is slower at first.


----------



## qwr (May 13, 2021)

PetrusQuber said:


> Dual CN is never better long-run, although it may seem so to you short-term.
> Anything new is slower at first.


idk man those chinese kids (and Philipp Weyer) are getting by quite well with dual CN


----------



## Cubing Forever (May 13, 2021)

qwr said:


> idk man those chinese kids (and Philipp Weyer) are getting by quite well with dual CN


that's like riding a bike over the hill instead of around it lol


----------



## qwr (May 13, 2021)

btw I got a new pb single of 20.14 on my second solve of the day with this scramble: L2 D F' B2 D2 R' B2 D2 B2 L U2 F2 L' R' F D2 L D R' F' U'
idk what I did but it doesn't even look like that easy of a scramble.

I got a 24 on F2 R F2 D L2 U2 R2 B2 L2 F2 U B2 U2 R B' U' F' U2 F' R' but more importantly I managed to preserve two easy pairs which is way more advanced than anything I've done before. this should've been the PB scramble but oh well.


----------



## BenChristman1 (May 13, 2021)

Cubing Forever said:


> that's like riding a bike over the hill instead of around it lol


What I would do depends on how big the hill is. CN doesn’t seem like a big hill (in my opinion), so for some people, it’s better to just go over it.


----------



## PetrusQuber (May 13, 2021)

qwr said:


> idk man those chinese kids (and Philipp Weyer) are getting by quite well with dual CN


Doesn’t mean it’s better - if they’d swapped to CN a while back, they might be even faster now.
Your choice though


----------



## qwr (May 13, 2021)

PetrusQuber said:


> Doesn’t mean it’s better - if they’d swapped to CN a while back, they might be even faster now.
> Your choice though


I mean you can speculate that about any technique
the point brought up in the Jayden McNeill blog post is that restricting cross colors may have benefits in reducing recognition time and improving lookahead. One of the strengths of these Chinese cubers is virtually no pausing.


----------



## PetrusQuber (May 13, 2021)

qwr said:


> I mean you can speculate that about any technique
> the point brought up in the Jayden McNeill blog post is that restricting cross colors may have benefits in reducing recognition time and improving lookahead. One of the strengths of these Chinese cubers is virtually no pausing.


Well, whatever you think.


----------



## qwr (May 14, 2021)

19.48 PB. not even good cross, just got lucky in f2l. I did white cross, missing an even easier green cross.
B R' D F D2 R2 D L F2 R2 F L2 B D2 L2 B U2 L2 B2 L2


----------



## qwr (May 17, 2021)

19.22 PB with ridiculously easy white cross and easy f2l first pairs
B D2 F2 U2 F' R2 B' D2 B L2 B L2 U R' F2 R B' U F' U2 F'


----------



## qwr (Jul 1, 2021)

I got a nice 26 AO50 using my GAN M, very nice feeling cube (video soon™)

Also here's a lucky PB 18.36

F2 L F2 L2 D L2 D' R2 U2 R2 B2 U L2 U2 F' R U' L D R2 U2

recon (yes ik the f2l solution with F moves are trash and it's not even that efficient)

y L' B F D F2 // cross
y U2 L U' L'
U R' U R F' U' F
y L U L' U L U' L'
y U L' U' L U' L' U L // F2L
U2 (F U R U' R' F') // OLL
U (R' U R' U' R D' R' D R' U D' R2 U' R2' D R2) // PLL
U2 // AUF

here's another lucky solve (19.30) that should've been my PB with a much better F2L (fewer rotations)

R' B L' D2 R' U' L R2 B2 U2 B' U2 B R2 B' R2 U2 L2 B2 D F'

approximate recon

z2 y' L2 D' R' D' L2 // cross
U' L' U' L U' L' U L
R' U R U2 L U L'
U2 R U' R'
R' U R U y R U R' U2 R U' R' // F2L
U (R U2 R' U' R U R' U' R U' R') // OLL
M2' U M U2 M' U M2' // PLL
U2 // AUF


----------



## qwr (Jul 4, 2021)

So after getting comfortable with E perm, I think it's finally time to learn another PLL

I looked up F perm and it's just J perm but starting with R' U' instead of R U R' and ending with an extra R U R' U R like in sune T perm but starting with R' U' F' and ending with U R instead of F.
This alg is very long at 18 HTM but appears to be the easiest to execute.

The PLLs I have left are Rs, Ns, and Gs


----------



## qwr (Jul 4, 2021)

I decided to try some timed solves on my beloved zhanchi and unfortunately it seems like ever since I improved my turning speed on modern cubes I can't control this zhanchi without locking up a lot. In 30 solves I averaged 32 which is 5 seconds off my normal mean, with best ao5 of 27 and best ao12 of 30. So I can't put these times in my epic cubing progression because they really don't represent my best possible times.


----------



## qwr (Aug 9, 2021)

Since I haven't practiced 2x2 in a while, I did a quick ao50. The average of 5.66 isn't my PB (5.44) but it's close. I used my new plastic dayan (no old plastic dayan... yet) and the lockups and instability mean I have to turn slower (even on normally spam algs like J perm), probably losing me 0.2 seconds or so. At this point I'm only using my old np dayan so I can get it to 1000-2000 solves and see if it changes when broken in. The cube has gotten smoother and has a clacky sound like a zhanchi, though the corner cutting is honestly pretty bad (and I can't loosen the cube any more else it will pop and explode).

Most sessions I like to experiment and this time I tried harder to make full layers or anti-layers (solvable with R2 U2 R2). Sometimes these cost me an extra second or so for 6s and 7s, but sometimes I got the 1/6 PLL skip or easy PBL leading to 3s or 4s. I still use Ortega even when making full layers but I'm too lazy to learn how to predict OLL. Making full or anti layers does let me avoid the nasty bar on bottom cases that are super slow for me (diagonal swap cases aren't fast tho). 

Something crazy is I think I saw at least four scrambles with fully made faces in the first 25 scrambles. Here's a preview of the stats generated by cstimer I will be compiling for each session sometime in the future:


----------



## qwr (Aug 14, 2021)

I did another ao50 with my previous main, the little magic 2x2 non-mag (with lube is a very good beginner 2x2, gliding and clacky) and I only got a crappy 6.02 avg. Part of it was me not being used to the turning after having not used it for so long, but I think my full / anti layer attempts take too many moves, some taking 10+ moves. If I want to work on OLL prediction, I'll have to go for fewer move faces instead of layers first.


----------



## Megaminx lover (Aug 14, 2021)

You message so much I thought your average is 5 or something... until I read this thread.


----------



## hellocubers (Aug 14, 2021)

Nice.


----------



## qwr (Aug 14, 2021)

Megaminx lover said:


> You message so much I thought your average is 5 or something... until I read this thread.


it's easier to post than to practice


----------



## qwr (Aug 23, 2021)

While I'm working in 2x2 and 3x3 I'm strongly considering learning kilomimx properly. I like small puzzles for now though I wouldn't exclude learning 4x4 once I get decent at 3x3.


----------



## Cubing Forever (Aug 23, 2021)

qwr said:


> PB (5.44)


wait a bit...didn't I critique a 5.3 average of yours?


----------



## qwr (Aug 23, 2021)

Cubing Forever said:


> wait a bit...didn't I critique a 5.3 average of yours?


I consider my PB using ao100 avg


----------



## Cubing Forever (Aug 23, 2021)

qwr said:


> I consider my PB using ao100 avg


oh I thought you meant ao5 lol


----------



## qwr (Oct 18, 2021)

random 3x3 pb 17.58: very lucky f2l from okayish cross, then meh ll
D2 U2 L R2 B2 U2 R' U2 R' D2 F' U R' D' U B' F2 L2 D F2

approx recon
y2 D' R' D' L D2 L // cross
y' U L' U L
U2 R U' R'
U L U L'
y U' R U R' U R U R' // f2l
U2 (F U R U' R' F') U2 (R U R' U R U2 R') // 2loll
(R U R' U' R' F R2 U' R' U' R U R' F') U // pll

maybe someone can come up with a much better ll 


this was today's ao50 soundtrack





also I got 3 pll skips within 8 solves lol

ending stats for ao50 (all pb):
best ao5: 22.52
best ao12: 23.51
avg: 25.24


I think i was faster just from good turning on my gan 356 m and ever so slightly getting better f2l "intuition"


----------



## MuaazCubes (Oct 18, 2021)

qwr said:


> random 3x3 pb 17.58: very lucky f2l from okayish cross, then meh ll
> D2 U2 L R2 B2 U2 R' U2 R' D2 F' U R' D' U B' F2 L2 D F2
> 
> approx recon
> ...


For 2-look, you could've used the alg: f R U R' U' f' which would get you a sune case, then a t perm. and save you a couple of moves.
If you knew the 1 look alg for this it would look like, (R U2 R') (R' F R F') (R U2 R'), then get an A perm with U2 AUF.


----------



## qwr (Oct 19, 2021)

MuaazCubes said:


> For 2-look, you could've used the alg: f R U R' U' f' which would get you a sune case, then a t perm. and save you a couple of moves.
> If you knew the 1 look alg for this it would look like, (R U2 R') (R' F R F') (R U2 R'), then get an A perm with U2 AUF.


The cross+f2l was 28 ETM (including rotations) so I thought maybe there was some really nice ZBLL or something that would lead to a 40-50 ETM solution


----------



## qwr (Mar 5, 2022)

lucky scramble my friend gave me that was a 19, could've been better with better cross planning
actually this recon is wrong because in my solve I actually got a different cross oll and ended with z perm but same idea

z2 y D' R F L y' D2 L D2 // cross lolbad
U' L' U L
U' R U R' L U' L'
U' R U' R2' U R
U' R U R' U R U' R' // f2l
F' r U R' U' r' F R // oll
F R U' R' U' R U R' F' R U R' U' R' F R F' // pll

well at least rotationless f2l

a better cross is maybe like z2 y (U D') R F L' F L2 F2 to preserve pair but still seems bad. U D' is something xu ruihang does for some reason.
the basic f2l inserts he can tps very quickly.
there is probably an xcross under 8 moves that makes better further f2l pairs


----------

