# Bad order of doing stages in 5x5 bld ?



## ZalEw (Nov 10, 2011)

Hi, I've been doing 5x5 bld for a long time, I have DNFs with times sub 14 minutes, but I've never got any successful solve. I started to think that maybe my order of doing stages is wrong, so in one of them I spoil rest of the cube.

Corners with BH
Egdes with M2
tcenters with commutators
xcenters with commutators
wings with r2

When I'm doing solve by this with looking I don't have problems with solve it, but I can't really see if any of centers or another pieces goes to differant position.


----------



## rubiksarlen (Nov 10, 2011)

it won't be wrong no matter how you execute it, just make sure you do the right parity fixes.


----------



## Zane_C (Nov 10, 2011)

Order seems fine, providing:
- you don't execute any parity algs before the centers.
- you use pure corner twists and edge flips (ie. don't rotate centers), unless of course you twist/flip pieces after the centers.
- you don't use: M U2 M U2 and its inverse.



rubiksarlen said:


> it won't be wrong no matter how you execute it, just make sure you do the right parity fixes.


Wrong.


----------



## chris w (Nov 10, 2011)

is BH centre safe? Im no expert at all, but for the most part I think people execute corners last, as some algorithms do mess with centres


----------



## ZalEw (Nov 10, 2011)

I used in M2 for edges M U2 M U2 for BD, and U2 M' U2 M' for FU. This is my mistake ?


----------



## Zane_C (Nov 10, 2011)

chris w said:


> is BH centre safe? Im no expert at all, but for the most part I think people execute corners last, as some algorithms do mess with centres


Some non-commutator 3-cycles might rotate centers, but BH is 100% center safe.


ZalEw said:


> I used in M2 for edges M U2 M U2 for BD, and U2 M' U2 M' for FU. This is my mistake ?


Sorry I posted the wrong alg, I meant "M U2 M U2" and its inverse. 

This is not center safe, I made the same mistake for a while after I started 5BLD.


----------



## ZalEw (Nov 10, 2011)

so I should do M2 F R U R' E' R U' R' E F' and on the and flip the edges ? (btw. I don't know notation for E slice, I don't know if alg is ok )


----------



## Zane_C (Nov 10, 2011)

ZalEw said:


> so I should do M2 F R U R' E' R U' R' E F' and on the and flip the edges ? (btw. I don't know notation for E slice, I don't know if alg is ok )


You should already be using M2 F R U R' *E* R U' R' *E'* F', it's for the cycle DF>BD. And of course its inverse works for DF>FU.
As for notation, the E slice follows the D-layer. (E = D and E' = D')

What you should be changing is M U2 M U2 and U2 M' U2 M'. 

Center safe 2-cycles are:
DF>UF: M2 M U2 M' D2 M U2 M' D2 cancels to M' U2 M' D2 M U2 M' D2 
DF>DB: D2 M U2 M' D2 M U2 M' M2 cancels to D2 M U2 M' D2 M U2 M

I'm not holding a cube to test these, but they should be right.


----------



## ZalEw (Nov 10, 2011)

Ok thanks, I just got dnf by 6 tcenters with time about 16 minutes so I just do wrong something in comms.


----------



## Zane_C (Nov 10, 2011)

Now, I'm expecting a success from you soon. Also, the times of your attempts are good. :tu


----------



## TMOY (Nov 11, 2011)

rubiksarlen said:


> it won't be wrong no matter how you execute it, just make sure you do the right parity fixes.


 
The parity fixes you use are irrelevant because none can be centers-safe anyway. if you want to fix any parity before centers, you have to know the exact effect of your alg on them and either take it into account when you solve centers or use a setup which allows you to permute only centers of the same colour(s) while fixing parity.


----------



## patrickbruce (Nov 11, 2011)

5x5 solve order.....centers (all of them), then edges (the 3x1), in the second step-solve all parity there, and then solve as a 3x3....this setup gives me sub 12 min


----------



## ZalEw (Nov 11, 2011)

I prefer doing 3x3 first, because I memorize egdes visually and corners with audio which would be hard if I was solving it at the end.


----------



## Mollerz (Nov 11, 2011)

Zane_C said:


> You should already be using M2 F R U R' *E* R U' R' *E'* F', it's for the cycle DF>BD. And of course its inverse works for DF>FU.
> As for notation, the E slice follows the D-layer. (E = D and E' = D')
> 
> What you should be changing is M U2 M U2 and U2 M' U2 M'.
> ...


 
Wellp, this explains why I keep DNFing as well, good thing to know a day before competition! These aren't really hard to learn either which is good.


----------



## ZalEw (Nov 12, 2011)

DAMN ! 15:06.80 DNF by two xcenters ;/ This is soooo annoying


----------

