# Im quitting BLD forever.



## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

Yeah im not sure if anyone here actually even really know THAT much who i am or if they even care but i have decided to quit BLD Forever. i dont know if anyone even cares if am but if anyone does then if you wanna say something, then sure thanks. Something just happened recently and i just dont really wanna talk about it but i realized a lot of things now and i just know there is no point in even doing BLD anymore, so im Done.

Thanks for reading this nonsense.

Derrick Eide.


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## Lofty (Apr 18, 2008)

what I am not even a BLD solver and i know that you cannot stop solving BLD! That would be like be quitting OH...
This isn't like Jason's thread is it...


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

hehe out of all people i would never have expected you to be the one to post here hehe. but yeah im just really discouraged and hard to explain but something happened lately that made me realize that im just never going to be good enough and It's just too much for me and i cant take it anymore so why even bother? of course you should NEVER quit OH. Congrats on the sub 20 avg man! beat Takumi and Higo man.


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## Harry (Apr 18, 2008)

Ehm, I don't understand why you want to quit BLD. It is very good you know!! I want you not to quit. I am not a blindfolded player btw, but i am learning and it is like the idol is just left the competition. You understand what I mean? I you do then don't quit!!

Thank You


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## joey (Apr 18, 2008)

Just change method! Old pochmann is a difficult method to get fast with, you should try M2.


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## Lofty (Apr 18, 2008)

Well my sub-20 is good but I mean come on Takumi has a 16.19! and Higo is close behind, don't be discouraged by others times! Anything they can do you can do better! I was pretty down on myself when I saw Takumi's 16.19 since at the time I was at around a 21 average but I didn't stop when I saw Rama and Gilles averaging sub23 and I was barely sub60 so Im not going to stop now!
Never give up never surrender!
p.s. I will keep harassing you until you keep BLD solving
Edit: We are both number 9 in the UWR in our respective fields  race to number 1?


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

Lofty said:


> Well my sub-20 is good but I mean come on Takumi has a 16.19! and Higo is close behind, don't be discouraged by others times! Anything they can do you can do better! I was pretty down on myself when I saw Takumi's 16.19 since at the time I was at around a 21 average but I didn't stop when I saw Rama and Gilles averaging sub23 and I was barely sub60 so Im not going to stop now!
> Never give up never surrender!
> p.s. I will keep harassing you until you keep BLD solving
> Edit: We are both number 9 in the UWR in our respective fields  race to number 1?



oh wow.. Thanks for the inspiring words Brian. I cant believe your actually making me consider NOT quitting BLD!!  still not sure yet but wow, that really did help make me feel better about the whole situation, i may have to change the title of this topic from Quitting BLD forever, to Quitting BLD "For a bit". Thanks.


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## tim (Apr 18, 2008)

Derrick Eide17 said:


> but yeah im just really discouraged and hard to explain but something happened lately that made me realize that im just never going to be good enough and It's just too much for me and i cant take it anymore so why even bother?



M2? Freestyle? Commutators?


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## Lofty (Apr 18, 2008)

Glad I am able to help lift your spirits 
Haha I hear breaks can be good for you but I have never listened to that advice to find out


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

Lofty said:


> Glad I am able to help lift your spirits
> Haha I hear breaks can be good for you but I have never listened to that advice to find out



haha i have the exact same problem, the word BREAK to me is just not in my cubing vocabulary whatsoever


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## Lofty (Apr 18, 2008)

yea me neither, I am thinking of taking a break from OH for about a week after Stetson tho because the past two days I have had to stop due to pain in my pinky joint and surrounding muscle...
Maybe I will pick up BLD that week  I don't remember your speedsolve times but maybe you could try that to get your turn speed up?


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## masterofthebass (Apr 18, 2008)

Derrick, I too have basically quit BLD. I find it kind of pointless, so I just do it once in a while. W/E your decision is, good luck, and I wish you well.


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## Mike Hughey (Apr 18, 2008)

And speedcubing isn't pointless? Come on - the only thing that makes any of this worthwhile is that there are multiple people who enjoy it. And there are plenty of people who don't feel like you do about BLD. As long as people who enjoy BLD are around, BLD is no more pointless than speedcubing, or juggling, or any of a number of other things that I also enjoy.

Derrick, I don't have a chance of ever getting in the top 50 at BLD, but I doubt I'll ever give up on it. It's fun, and that's all that matters. (Especially big cubes BLD.) I believe that 50 years from now, if I live that long (I would be 96 then), I'll still be regularly doing 4x4x4 BLD solves at least, even if there is no world cubing association anymore. If nothing else, it should help ward off Alzheimer's. You're 14th in the world, and you're improving. So why give up?


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## Leo (Apr 18, 2008)

Okay if I follow what you're doing Derrick, I may as well quit just about every puzzle I solve. What's the point? I'll never beat these Yu Nakajima, Erik Akkersdijk, Edouard Chambon guys. 

I mean come on I haven't seen anybody do a faster solve than you with old pochmann, I can't imagine what would happen if you moved to M2!


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

Lofty said:


> yea me neither, I am thinking of taking a break from OH for about a week after Stetson tho because the past two days I have had to stop due to pain in my pinky joint and surrounding muscle...
> Maybe I will pick up BLD that week  I don't remember your speedsolve times but maybe you could try that to get your turn speed up?



speedsolving in what OH? yeah sadly im horrible in OH too and i quit that just a few weeks ago too but then i decided to give it one more try but just ended up doing even more horrible again. maybe you could be my tutor? 





masterofthebass said:


> Derrick, I too have basically quit BLD. I find it kind of pointless, so I just do it once in a while. W/E your decision is, good luck, and I wish you well.



Thanks 







Mike Hughey said:


> And speedcubing isn't pointless? Come on - the only thing that makes any of this worthwhile is that there are multiple people who enjoy it. And there are plenty of people who don't feel like you do about BLD. As long as people who enjoy BLD are around, BLD is no more pointless than speedcubing, or juggling, or any of a number of other things that I also enjoy.
> 
> Derrick, I don't have a chance of ever getting in the top 50 at BLD, but I doubt I'll ever give up on it. It's fun, and that's all that matters. (Especially big cubes BLD.) I believe that 50 years from now, if I live that long (I would be 96 then), I'll still be regularly doing 4x4x4 BLD solves at least, even if there is no world cubing association anymore. If nothing else, it should help ward off Alzheimer's. You're 14th in the world, and you're improving. So why give up?



not speedcubing just the thing that i keep failing and failing at and i dont see my ever being good enough (BLD, OH), its just REALLY discouraging for me and lately I just kinda hit rock bottom on BLD and i am just too fed up. Brians words have been very inspiring though to me  and the fact i thought no one would even care if i quit BLD and yet people are stiill showing their support. so HUGE thanks for that.


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

Leo said:


> Okay if I follow what you're doing Derrick, I may as well quit just about every puzzle I solve. What's the point? I'll never beat these Yu Nakajima, Erik Akkersdijk, Edouard Chambon guys.
> 
> I mean come on I haven't seen anybody do a faster solve than you with old pochmann, I can't imagine what would happen if you moved to M2!



I know its just, theres kinda more to it then that, and i like really practice ALL the time and when i see people like Nakajima, and others practice an event for like just literally a few months they almost instantly become better then me, and i've been waiting for something that i could be the best at and i just dont see it happening. i would never quit cubing in general because it really is my LIFE but BLD perhaps, although im feeling a little different now after everyone's great support.

so thanks for that


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## Lofty (Apr 18, 2008)

Of course I could help you with whatever you need in OH  
And yes Nakajima is just good at everything... Maybe we should all practice speedsolving to the point we are sub-12 so our look-ahead and turning speed are that high. I blame Yu's advantage on the fact he has really good people in each event to help him. With Najakima practicing all events and us only practicing one event we'll get faster eventually  
I wonder if you practice BLD more than I practice OH?


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

Lofty said:


> Of course I could help you with whatever you need in OH
> And yes Nakajima is just good at everything... Maybe we should all practice speedsolving to the point we are sub-12 so our look-ahead and turning speed are that high. I blame Yu's advantage on the fact he has really good people in each event to help him. With Najakima practicing all events and us only practicing one event we'll get faster eventually
> I wonder if you practice BLD more than I practice OH?



hm who knows, but not just Nakajima in particular but its just always like everyone always becomes better then me no matter how much i practice.

and yeah i dont know about BLD lately cause like i said i've been REALLY discoraged,but cubing in general i practice all day, every day  i just can never stop cause i wanna practice to be the best, but when i practice so hard, and im not rewarded like now, its VERY hard for me to keep going. 

Also i've never gotten a single sub 20 OH solve ever  and so many people have. how long did it take u too get a sub 20 single solve OH? maybe it might lift my spirits


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## Lofty (Apr 18, 2008)

Well I started cubing over a year ago and have been solving OH ever since like two weeks into it.. I don't remember how long it took to get to my first single but to get to this average over a year... so one year to Yu's few weeks but its not quite teh same Yu was already a master at the method when he started OH.
I literally practice only OH and at times would do 100-200 solves a day. I think I will take a break after Stetson to practice speed and BLD...
ahhh oh no i am going to be late for class!!!


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

im always just stuck around the same time and if not i just get WORSE  i have done avgs of 100 before and i practice TONS so i know practice is not the problem  what else?


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## Mike Hughey (Apr 18, 2008)

I don't understand how you could be discouraged about not improving with BLD when you just in the last couple of days got your new personal best!?! My current personal best with 3x3x3 BLD was almost two months ago, and I'm now trying to learn M2, and it's pretty frustrating - accuracy is bad and speeds are all over the place - I sometimes go over 5 minutes on some solves! But some solves are really good and they show promise - I think I'm close to beating my personal best, and sub-2 seems achievable finally for me. So I'm not giving up, even though it's currently frustrating.

Of course, I'm not nearly as good as you, so maybe it's not the same. But I would think that if you can get 1:06 with old Pochmann, you can probably go very much sub-1 with a more modern method. Although you'll probably go through the same kind of pain as I'm going through learning M2 on the way, and that has certainly been frustrating for me.


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## Lofty (Apr 18, 2008)

Derrick Eide17 said:


> im always just stuck around the same time and if not i just get WORSE  i have done avgs of 100 before and i practice TONS so i know practice is not the problem  what else?



so I assume you are talking about OH since averages of 100 for BLD would be crazy lol. And I am not just talking about a couple averages of 100 I am talking about averages of 100 everyday! Like i have practiced OH so much I get 2H amnesia and the cube feels more comfortable in OH than 2....so you can always practice more... also I have tried like 9821561765 algs for each PLL and only 237486 for each OLL case in order to find the best one for me for OH.
Edit: Can you video chat on anything I'll teach you OH and you teach me BLD


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## joey (Apr 18, 2008)

Lofty said:


> so I assume you are talking about OH since averages of 100 for BLD would be crazy lol.


It's been done


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

Mike Hughey said:


> Although you'll probably go through the same kind of pain as I'm going through learning M2 on the way, and that has certainly been frustrating for me.



oh you have NO IDEA.. lmao i hate M2 with a BURNING passion. lol.



Lofty said:


> so I assume you are talking about OH since averages of 100 for BLD would be crazy lol. And I am not just talking about a couple averages of 100 I am talking about averages of 100 everyday! Like i have practiced OH so much I get 2H amnesia and the cube feels more comfortable in OH than 2....so you can always practice more... also I have tried like 9821561765 algs for each PLL and only 237486 for each OLL case in order to find the best one for me for OH.
> Edit: Can you video chat on anything I'll teach you OH and you teach me BLD



oh wow... i never knew someone practiced as much as i do in cubing.. maybe.. even more...   well for OH anyway, but 3x3 and SOME other things i work my ASS off as well so im glad to see others just as determined as me  and its like every post by you Brian gives me another shot of inspiration  thanks. sorry dont have webcam though or that stuff, but i added you on msn, are u on much? 




joey said:


> Lofty said:
> 
> 
> > so I assume you are talking about OH since averages of 100 for BLD would be crazy lol.
> ...



Oh yes it has  by only ONE PERSON ever. and I have him on my msn!


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## Lofty (Apr 18, 2008)

I was unaware I had msn lol whats my account name?


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## joey (Apr 18, 2008)

Noo lofty, we are talking about a certain someone who did a BLD average of 100!


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## Lofty (Apr 18, 2008)

Yes I know the last line was about someone else but int he paragraph above it he said he added me on msn.
And I downloaded msn and there was already an email in it so i logged on lol.


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

Yeah a certain SOMEONE that names starts with R :   


also u dont have msn Brian?  awww was looking forward to chatting with you. i added ur email though on my msn [email protected] correct? OMG wait you have googletalk?!?! cause i do too! ill add you!! 


Edit: So you HAVE msn now? XD


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## Lofty (Apr 18, 2008)

haha yes i have msn now
i don't have google talk lol...
I logged on to msn with [email protected]. I guess since i have xboxlive and that is microsoft I use the same account and password for everything..


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

hooray! im busy for a few min but after that im definetly going to add you! its time for you to help me achieve my FIRST EVER sub 20 OH solve!!!


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## Lofty (Apr 18, 2008)

ok well how long is a few minutes? I have class again and have to leave in 20-30 minutes.
and if i am getting you that OH time what do I get in Bld  like a sub 2? sub 1:30?


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

hehe darn yeah ill be gone for like 20-30 mins EXACTLY lmao. so i guess later then  and as much i even hate to THINK about BLD lately now I'll try my best of course, but you know you can learn from a LOT better people then sucky old me lol.


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## Mike Hughey (Apr 18, 2008)

Lofty said:


> ok well how long is a few minutes? I have class again and have to leave in 20-30 minutes.
> and if i am getting you that OH time what do I get in Bld  like a sub 2? sub 1:30?



A sub-20 OH solve has got to be worth at least a sub-1:30 BLD, the way people are now improving at BLD. I suspect by the end of the year it might take a sub-2 BLD just to be in the top 100 in the world. (Which is why I'm afraid I might not make it.) Right now sub-2 is top 30. See if it isn't 40 or more after this weekend.


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## Cubie Newbie (Apr 18, 2008)

Derrick, perhaps your slow progress is caused partly by the attitude that you want to quit? Just as taking a break sometimes helps psychologically, having a mindset like this may also be hurting you. 

There was this one saying that was: Jack of all trades but master of none.
I would say that you're a master of BLD. Certain people that have been alluded to in this thread could be considered to be a jack in all "trades" or actually BLD, 2H, OH, feet, etc. 

The main thing is, though, that, if Einstein as a child looked at all the leading scientists at that time and concluded that he could never be as smart as them because he wasn't as smart as them at that time, he would have given up science and math and never become the famous scientist he was. 

Don't give up! Keep cubing, but if you need a break take one. Just please don't make that break infinitely long...


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 18, 2008)

Cubie Newbie said:


> Derrick, perhaps your slow progress is caused partly by the attitude that you want to quit? Just as taking a break sometimes helps psychologically, having a mindset like this may also be hurting you.
> 
> There was this one saying that was: Jack of all trades but master of none.
> I would say that you're a master of BLD. Certain people that have been alluded to in this thread could be considered to be a jack in all "trades" or actually BLD, 2H, OH, feet, etc.
> ...



Very inspiring, Thanks


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## Dene (Apr 19, 2008)

Well I must admit I don't see any reason to give up, you and Mr. Strehlau are the only reasons I'm sticking with Old Pochmann!! (not that I BLD much anyway....)


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## niKo (Apr 19, 2008)

What works best for me when cubing is to make sure I don't have any sort of expectation of myself - I just let it flow and try to get everything else out of my mind. Whenever I succeed at doing that, cubing seems so much easier,and I get my best times. That might be something to consider. Kind of going along with "Cubie Newbie"s suggestion of attitude.

-niKo


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## cmhardw (Apr 19, 2008)

Derrick the way I see it, if you're going to quit do it for a good reason like "I don't like BLD cubing anymore." Don't do it for a stupid reason, for example "I'm not fast enough" or something to that affect. Also, if you're really going to quit then just quit. Don't whine about it to everybody.

Having said that I hope you don't quit, but if you really must then don't do it for a stupid reason.

Chris


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## fanwuq (Apr 19, 2008)

Derrick not fast?! But you are the fastest with Old Pochmann!
I wish I can just sub-5min on a BLD solve. 
Perhaps learn turbo?


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## Lofty (Apr 19, 2008)

ok one day on MSN and Derrick already broke his PB! 21.59! He'll be sub-20 soon! Then for my sub-1:30 think you can do that for me this quickly?
p.s. add me on msm [email protected]!


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 19, 2008)

fanwuq said:


> Derrick not fast?! But you are the fastest with Old Pochmann!
> I wish I can just sub-5min on a BLD solve.
> Perhaps learn turbo?



haha thanks i talked to dennis before and learned about Turbo/pochmann edges, it is nice but the setup moves are a KILLER so probably not using turbo, and like i said i hate M2 with a passion lol  

and yeah sorry Chris if it seemed like whining i was just fed up with myself and couldnt handle it anymore, if its whining i did i apologize, so im sorry then.




Lofty said:


> ok one day on MSN and Derrick already broke his PB! 21.59! He'll be sub-20 soon! Then for my sub-1:30 think you can do that for me this quickly?
> p.s. add me on msm [email protected]!



Oh i want sub 20 OH solve so bad!! lol 

and sub 1:30 BLD that quickly hmmm seeming as how you have never really done BLD that much before it doesnt seem possible what so ever XD who knows though! maybe ur really a BLD master! and you just dont know it!


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## Stefan (Apr 19, 2008)

I'm with Chris. Stop whining publicly. Drama queen.

Why do you hate M2? I don't mind if you do, but if there are drawbacks I'd like to know about them so they can be addressed and maybe rectified.


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## Inusagi (Apr 19, 2008)

You said something about you're not going to be good enough. You can still BLD even though you are not close to the WR. You can still cube even though you don't get the WR. You can still walk even though you're not having the WR in going fastest. You can still live even though you're not having a WR in being best person.


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## Cubie Newbie (Apr 19, 2008)

Yes, Inusagi has a great point that I think I alluded to in my "Einstein" analogy. Even if you're not the best at BLD, you can still do it for the experience. If you enjoy it, which is truly up to you to decide, you should keep BLDing, even if you aren't WR. I enjoy 2H, but I, a 25-35 second cuber, am definitely not going to achieve a world record anytime soon. You, on the other hand, are an already amazing BLD cuber anyway.

My point is, if you really enjoy the experience of BLDing, regardless of your times, you should keep going.

BTW, are you looking at the glass as 1/100 empty or 99% full?


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## Pedro (Apr 19, 2008)

StefanPochmann said:


> I'm with Chris. Stop whining publicly. Drama queen.
> 
> Why do you hate M2? I don't mind if you do, but if there are drawbacks I'd like to know about them so they can be addressed and maybe rectified.



I talked to him about M2 yesterday, and (hopefully) explained what he was doing "wrong", hence not liking the method...

but he still says memorising in pairs is not something he's used to... :/


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## hait2 (Apr 19, 2008)

this thread reeks of attention whoring


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 19, 2008)

StefanPochmann said:


> I'm with Chris. Stop whining publicly. Drama queen.
> 
> Why do you hate M2? I don't mind if you do, but if there are drawbacks I'd like to know about them so they can be addressed and maybe rectified.






hait2 said:


> this thread reeks of attention whoring



OMG what? did i like do something to offend you in anyway? geez no sorry im not WHINING or doing this for attention, i just thought i wanted to post about something i was very upset about and like i said i didnt even think anyone would CARE or mention anything if i was quitting BLD so it definetly was not for attention. anyway if im still doing SOMETHING wrong like i said, IM SORRY okay?


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## hait2 (Apr 19, 2008)

Derrick Eide17 said:


> StefanPochmann said:
> 
> 
> > I'm with Chris. Stop whining publicly. Drama queen.
> ...


yes, see below


Derrick Eide17 said:


> geez no sorry im not WHINING or doing this for attention, i just thought i wanted to post about something i was very upset about and like i said i didnt even think anyone would CARE or mention anything if i was quitting BLD so it definetly was not for attention.


your logic doesn't add up. if you didn't think anyone would care you wouldn't have posted. if you wanted to quit, instead of listening to other people telling you not to quit, you wouldn't have posted


Derrick Eide17 said:


> anyway if im still doing SOMETHING wrong like i said, IM SORRY okay?


being an attention whore isn't wrong. it's just annoying (to me at least)

you can have the last word, i don't mind. there's nothing more that needs to be said from my side


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 19, 2008)

hait2 said:


> this thread reeks of attention whoring



OMG what? did i like do something to offend you in anyway?[/quote]
yes, see below


Derrick Eide17 said:


> geez no sorry im not WHINING or doing this for attention, i just thought i wanted to post about something i was very upset about and like i said i didnt even think anyone would CARE or mention anything if i was quitting BLD so it definetly was not for attention.


your logic doesn't add up. if you didn't think anyone would care you wouldn't have posted. if you wanted to quit, instead of listening to other people telling you not to quit, you wouldn't have posted


Derrick Eide17 said:


> anyway if im still doing SOMETHING wrong like i said, IM SORRY okay?


being an attention whore isn't wrong. it's just annoying (to me at least)

you can have the last word, i don't mind. there's nothing more that needs to be said from my side[/QUOTE]

well really you dont know what my logic is, i just thought if anyone cared enough to know i was quitting i could let them know, i know there is hardly anyone who does care, but for the people who do i just wanted to let them know, so yes my logic does make sense i believe  not doing it for attention.

and sorry i dont mind if i have the last word im just replying to your response with my own answer.


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## Dene (Apr 20, 2008)

Pedro said:


> StefanPochmann said:
> 
> 
> > I'm with Chris. Stop whining publicly. Drama queen.
> ...



Why do you have to memorise in pairs? M2 is just a cycle like Old Pochamnn, isn't it??:confused:


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## Pedro (Apr 20, 2008)

Dene said:


> Pedro said:
> 
> 
> > StefanPochmann said:
> ...



because of the centers moving

so if you have to shoot to DB, but it's the second part of a pair, you shoot to UF instead, which is where the DB position actually is


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## Dene (Apr 20, 2008)

But it's still a continuous cycle, the only thing to worry about is the M slice which should be done last. Unless I've got it all completely wrong >.< . You shouldn't need to memo in pairs, instead just do a normal cycle, and when it comes to the M slice figure out what you need to do to finish it. Of course, this has never worked for me (just the last bit), so maybe I should try memoing in pairs, although I don't really BLD much.


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 20, 2008)

lol welcome to the wonderful, confusing, frustrating, weird, irritating, and messed up world of M2 Dene!!! lol isn't it just GREAT? XD 

GOD i hate M2 lol.


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## Dene (Apr 20, 2008)

I've been familiar with M2 for quite a while now, and I can do all edges except for the last 3...


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## cmhardw (Apr 20, 2008)

Although it's not true M2, I've been starting to incorporate M2 algs into my commutator solving.

For example the cycle UB->DB->UL I used to do with S' D2 S U' S' D2 S U but I think it's much faster with D M2 D' L2 D M2 D' L2 and not to mention it's still turn optimal (and thus ok to use for the BH method) :-D

So although I'm not an M2 solver, I think the idea of M2 is worthwhile to use even in commutator solving.

Derrick I don't understand why you hate M2. It's *exactly* the same idea as old Pochmann, only the algorithm is simply the turn M2 rather than a cumbersome PLL alg. The side effect is to switch centers and 2 other M2 edges, but the side effect of old Pochmann is to switch 2 pieces of the type you aren't solving also. Either way you get a side effect and use setup moves to avoid disturbing the side effect.

The switching algorithm is much faster, and it uses the same idea. Plus, if you really don't like the algs that move edges to another location on the M layer then just use commutators. There are only 192 pure cases for these commutators which will probably break down into only 3-4 commutator types, and will all be intuitive to understand. If you think that's too many to learn, full BH method is 2204 algorithms, but of course these also break down into far fewer commutator types and are all 100% intuitive.

To me it sounds like you're very fast with your current method, and you've realized that you are at a barrier for old Pochmann and are too lazy to switch to another method to get faster.

My question to you is how badly do you want to get faster? I do not mean to slam old Pochmann, I think both you and Dennis have shown that it can be very fast. But I think the theory behind M2 is so convincing in terms of Pochmann style solving, that I don't understand why a Pochmann solver wouldn't switch to it. Forgive my ignorance in Pochmann style solving if that sounds stupid, but with what little knowledge I have of old Pochmann and M2 I don't understand why M2 is not very clearly seen as the superior method.

Chris


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 20, 2008)

cmhardw said:


> Derrick I don't understand why you hate M2. It's *exactly* the same idea as old Pochmann, only the algorithm is simply the turn M2 rather than a cumbersome PLL alg. The side effect is to switch centers and 2 other M2 edges, but the side effect of old Pochmann is to switch 2 pieces of the type you aren't solving also. Either way you get a side effect and use setup moves to avoid disturbing the side effect.
> 
> The switching algorithm is much faster, and it uses the same idea. Plus, if you really don't like the algs that move edges to another location on the M layer then just use commutators. There are only 192 pure cases for these commutators which will probably break down into only 3-4 commutator types, and will all be intuitive to understand. If you think that's too many to learn, full BH method is 2204 algorithms, but of course these also break down into far fewer commutator types and are all 100% intuitive.
> 
> ...



Lol well one reason I first hated M2 when i started cause it seriously took me almost like a YEAR to fully understand and learn and i went OUT OF MY MIND trying to learn it LOL. and then i hear people who like learned it in 2 or somethings days and im like GRR lol  but thats just a small reason but i do HATE IT because it even took so long to learn, and even after that i dont see it as such a simple method, it just REALLY confuses me, there is SO MUCH to keep track of in my opinion. for example, Parity, Taking care parity, unoriented edges (knowing what edges you have to orient at the end), keeping track of centers, restricted memo because u have to memo in pairs which is VERY WIERD for me because i love the way i memo currently atm and being restricted to pairs WHILE keep track of centers really confuses me, if there IS parity then even IF you memo in pairs the center will now be the OPPOSITE of the way they were if there wasnt parity so after every pair the centers arent solved etc, and also taking care of the M slice edges is also sometimes confusing depending how they are. its just with ALL THOSE THINGS making M2 so weird and frustrating is why i hate it so much, when i can just use a simple method such as old pochmann. also no im not lazy, i have practiced M2 and the memo is just too bad for me and too many things make me slow down and i stall a lot in memo and execution.

i think my best with M2 before was like 1:43 i got one night but after that never could get close to that again lol. (I get a LOT of DNF's with M2.)


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## joey (Apr 20, 2008)

You DON'T need to memo in pairs. Just when you come to UF/DB (or their flipped equivalents), you need to see if you have done an odd or even number of swaps. If odd, you know you need to memo the opposite alg.

For example:
UR -> UF
I would see that I had done an odd number of swaps beforehand, so would memo DB instead of UF.

Personally I would also learn the algs to shoot to FU and BD, OR like chris, you can just do simple comms. (again, you need to see if you have done an odd or even number of swaps)

By the way, I can't remember if I've actually got a success with M2!! I probably have at some point (pretending to be Alex Yu or Kai or Konrad)
It *is* a lot faster than old pochmann, it uses WAAAYYY less moves.
Timing some BLD execution (sighted, not memoed), I got some sub-40 executions. I can't see that happening with old pochmann, unless you have like 9tps!
I'm glad I switched from Old Pochmann.


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## Stefan (Apr 20, 2008)

Derrick Eide17 said:


> i wanted to post about something i was very upset about


Well you didn't. You posted about your reaction to it.


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## fanwuq (Apr 20, 2008)

So which is less move count, better times, etc: M2 or TuRBo edges? I really wanted to learn M2 after understanding 3 cycle. Then, a few days ago, I some how arrived at TuRBo when trying out something.


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## Derrick Eide17 (Apr 20, 2008)

oh yeah of course no doubt M2 IS definetly better than Old pochmann i never disagree about that, but for me it isnt because the memo is just so WEIRD for me and keeping track of all those things just makes me panic during memo so i take a lot longer, and its not like i just simply tried it a few times and gave up, i practised and almost like NEVER improved memo.


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## Mike Hughey (Apr 21, 2008)

Mike Hughey said:


> A sub-20 OH solve has got to be worth at least a sub-1:30 BLD, the way people are now improving at BLD. I suspect by the end of the year it might take a sub-2 BLD just to be in the top 100 in the world. (Which is why I'm afraid I might not make it.) Right now sub-2 is top 30. See if it isn't 40 or more after this weekend.



I guess I need to eat my words. Nobody new went sub-2 this whole weekend. I'm totally shocked by that.


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## Tyson (Nov 10, 2008)

Derrick Eide17 said:


> Yeah im not sure if anyone here actually even really know THAT much who i am or if they even care but i have decided to quit BLD Forever. i dont know if anyone even cares if am but if anyone does then if you wanna say something, then sure thanks. Something just happened recently and i just dont really wanna talk about it but i realized a lot of things now and i just know there is no point in even doing BLD anymore, so im Done.
> 
> Thanks for reading this nonsense.
> 
> Derrick Eide.



Thanks for letting us know. This information will have great impact on the cubing community. It is with a sadden heart that I read that the greatest pirate hunter in the world is retiring from cubing.


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## Derrick Eide17 (Nov 10, 2008)

Tyson said:


> Derrick Eide17 said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah im not sure if anyone here actually even really know THAT much who i am or if they even care but i have decided to quit BLD Forever. i dont know if anyone even cares if am but if anyone does then if you wanna say something, then sure thanks. Something just happened recently and i just dont really wanna talk about it but i realized a lot of things now and i just know there is no point in even doing BLD anymore, so im Done.
> ...



aww thanks.
same goes to you to and your BLD cubing efforts mr BLD WR holder  

also tyson show me where i said quitting cubing itself?


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## ThePizzaGuy92 (Nov 10, 2008)

i quit BLD forever after my offical PB set at UCSD summer.

although, not entirely, I still do 2x2x2 BLD occasionally :]


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## Derrick Eide17 (Nov 10, 2008)

lol thanks to tyson we revived this topic that didnt need reviving.

Thanks? xD


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## DavidWoner (Nov 11, 2008)

well since it was tyson who revived it I think I am going to go ahead and say something in case you ever try to do something like this again:

Derrick, quitting is not your style. If you are not satisfied with your BLD times, the I would expect you to do 2000 BLD solves in a week until you got better.

My turning speed is not outstanding, and I don't expect to ever be a sub-13 3x3 solver. However, I still practice practice practice to be the best that I can possibly be.

Anytime you start to doubt yourself just say "I'm Derrick Eide, I Love cubing" over and over until you remember why you are cubing in the first place.


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## Derrick Eide17 (Nov 11, 2008)

Vault312 said:


> well since it was tyson who revived it I think I am going to go ahead and say something in case you ever try to do something like this again:
> 
> Derrick, quitting is not your style. If you are not satisfied with your BLD times, the I would expect you to do 2000 BLD solves in a week until you got better.
> 
> ...




that is the weirdest post i have ever read in my life xD
ur scaring me 

thanks?


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## shelley (Nov 11, 2008)

Derrick, did you even end up quitting forever, or are we discussing something that was made irrelevant 7 months ago?


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## Derrick Eide17 (Nov 11, 2008)

shelley said:


> Derrick, did you even end up quitting forever, or are we discussing something that was made irrelevant 7 months ago?



I quit, was depressed, got more depressed, and got a little hope from lofty, and ended up not quitting in the end.

but dont blame me though this topic was done for good.
tyson brought it back for some reason?


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## Erik (Nov 11, 2008)

Are we really going to discuss this again?
Tyson: I don't know why you brought this thread up, did you have any new insights in the matter of this thread?  It seems like you don't actually.
Derrick: it's still a lousy claim which says nothing, and knowing you better than most cubers here, I dare to say that you'll never do things like this anyway.

I'm quite sure that nothing new is posted here, besides asking Derrick if he really quited or not which he didn't (he's actually doing quite good in BLD I have to say)
Case closed or...?


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