# Rotationless F2L (Video)



## samkli (May 21, 2012)

42 cases, 4 angles, 0 rotations.



Spoiler



F2L 1 0:07

FR: U R U' R'

BR: r' U' R U M'

BL: U L U' L'

FL: F' r U r'


F2L 2 0:38

FR: r U R' U' M

BR: U' R' U R

BL: U2 r2 B' r' U r'

FL: U' L' U L


F2L 3 1:13

FR: U r' R2 U' R' U M'

BR: R' U' R

BL: U l' L2 U' L' U M

FL: L' U' L


F2L 4 1:51

FR: R U R' 

BR: U' r R2 U R U' M

BL: L U L'

FL: U' l L2 U L U' M'


F2L 5 2:26

FR: U' R U R' U2 R U' R'

BR: U r' U R U' R' U' r

BL: U' L U L' U2 L U' L'

FL: U l' U L U' L' U' l


F2L 6 3:08

FR: U' r U' R' U R U r'

BR: U R' U' R U2 R' U R

BL: U' l U' L' U L U l'

FL: U L' U' L U2 L' U L


F2L 7 3:47

FR: U' R U2 R' U2 R U' R'

BR: U r U R' U R U' R' U' r' U' F R F'

BL: U' L U2 L' U2 L U' L'

FL: U l U L' U L U' L' U' R' F' U r B'


F2L 8 4:32

FR: r' U2 R2 U R2 U r

BR: U R' U2 R U2 R' U R

BL: l' U2 L2 U L2 U l

FL: U L' U2 L U2 L' U L


F2L 9 5:12

FR: U r U R' U' R2 r' U' R'

BR: U R' U' R U' R' U' R

BL: U l U L' U' L2 l' U' L'

FL: U L' U' L U' L' U' L


F2L 10 5:53

FR: U' R U R' U R U R'

BR: U' r' U' R U R2 r U R

BL: U' L U L' U L U L'

FL: U' l' U' L U L2 l U L


F2L 11 6:34

FR: U' l F U' RU l' U R'

BR: R U2 R2 U' R2 U' R'

BL: U' r B U' L U r' U L'

FL: L U2 L2 U' L2 U' L'


F2L 12 7:11

FR: R' U2 R2 U R2 U R

BR: U l' B' U R' U' l U' R

BL: L' U2 L2 U L2 U L

FL: U r' F' U L' U' r' U' L


F2L 13 7:47

FR: R U' R' U R' F R F' R U' R'

BR: U R' U R U' R' U' R

BL: L U' L' U r' U r B' L U' L'

FL: U L' U L U' L' U' L


F2L 14 8:21

FR: U' R U' R' U R U R'

BR: R' U R U' l U' R' U R' F R

BL: U' L U' L' U L U L'

FL: L' U L U' L F' L' F L' U L


F2L 15 8:55

FR: U R' F R F' U R U R'

BR: U' r' U' R U' R' U2 r U' R' U' R

BL: L U2 L' U L U L' U L U' L'

FL: U' l' U' L U' L' U2 l U' L' U' L


F2L 16: 9:29

FR: U M' U R U' r' U' R U R'

BR: R' U2 R U' R' U' R U' R' U R

BL: U' r U R' U R U2 r' U' L U L'

FL: L' U2 L U' L' U' L U' L' U L


F2L 17 10:07

FR: R U2 R' U' R U R'

BR: R B' R' B R' U R U' R' U R

BL: L U2 L' U' L U L'

FL: L F' L' F L' U L U' L' U L


F2L 18 10:36

FR: R' F R F' R U' R' U R U' R'

BR: R' U2 R U R' U' R

BL: r' U L U' r U' L' U L U' L'

FL: L' U2 L U L' U' L


F2L 19 11:09

FR: U R U2 R' U R U' R'

BR: U R' U R2 B' R' B R' U R

BL: U L U2 L' U L U' L'

FL: U L' U L2 F' L' F L' U L


F2L 20 11:47

FR: U' R U' R2 F R F' R U' R'

BR: U' R' U2 R U' R' U R

BL: U' L U' L2 B L B' L U' L'

FL: U' L' U2 L U' L' U L


F2L 21 12:24

FR: R U' R' U2 R U R'

BR: r' U r U2 r' U' r

BL: L U' L' U2 L U L'

FL: F R U2 R' F'


F2L 22 12:56

FR: r U' r' U2 r U r'

BR: R' U R U2 R' U' R

BL: l U' l U2 l U l'

FL: L' U L U2 L' U' L


F2L 23 13:30

FR: U2 R2 U2 R' U' R U' R2

BR: U2 R' F' r U' L' U2 B' l

BL: U L U' L' U' L U' L' U L U' L'

FL: U2 r' U' R U' R' U2 F' r 


F2L 24 14:07

FR: U' R U R2' F R F' R U' R'

BR: U2 r' U' R U' R' U2 r R' U' R

BL: U2 r U R' U R U2 B r'

FL: U2 R' U' R U' R' U2 R r' F' r


F2L 25 14:47

FR: U' F' R U R' U' R' F R

BR: r' U' r U2 r' U' r U2 r' U r

BL: L' U' L' U' L' U L U L 

FL: U' L' U L F' r U r'


F2L 26 15:28

FR: U R U' R' U' F R' F' R

BR: R U R U R U' R' U' R'

BL: l U l' U2 l U l' U2 l U' l

FL: r U r' U' r' F r F'


F2L 27 16:10

FR: R U' R' U R U' R'

BR: R' U2 R' F R F' R

BL: L U' L' U L U' L'

FL: L' U2 r' U L U' r


F2L 28 16:45

FR: R U R' U' F R' F' R

BR: R' U R U' R' U R

BL: L U2 L F' L' F L'

FL: L' U L U' L' U L


F2L 29 17:19

FR: R' F R F' U R U' R'

BR: R' U' R U R' U' R

BL: r' U r B' r' U r B'

FL: L U' L U L' U' L


F2L 30 17:58

FR: R U R' U' R U R'

BR: l U' l' B l U' l' B

BL: L U L' U' L U L'

FL: r U' r' F r U' r' F


F2L 31 18:34

FR: U' R' F R F' R U' R

BR: R' U R' F R F' R

BL: L U' L F' L' F L'

FL: U L F' L' F L' U L


F2L 32 19:08

FR: U R U' R' U R U' R' U R U' R' 

BR: U' R' U R U' R' U R U' R' U R

BL: U L U' L' U L U' L' U L U' L'

FL: U' L' U L U' L' U L U' L' U L


F2L 33 19:50

FR: U' R U' R' U2 R U' R'

BR: U' R' U' R U2 R' U' R

BL: U' L U' L' U2 L U' L'

FL: U' L' U' L U2 L' U' L


F2L 34 20:26

FR: U R U R' U2 R U R'

BR: U R' U R U2 R' U R

BL: U L U L' U2 L U L'

FL: U L' U L U2 L' U L


F2L 35 21:03 

FR: U M' U R U' r' R U' R'

BR: U' r' U r U r' U' r U R' U' R

BL: U2 L U L' l U L' U' M'

FL: U' l' U l U l' U' l U L' U' L


F2L 36 21:46

FR: U2 R' F R F' U2 R U R'

BR: U2 R' U' R r' U' r U M'

BL: U l U' l' U' l U l' U' L U L'

FL: U' M' U' L' U l L' U L


F2L 37 22:23

Solved!


F2L 38 22:26

FR: R' F R F' R U' R' U R U' R' U2 R U' R'

BR: l U' R' U l' U2 R U2 R' U2 R U2 R' U R

BL: r' U L U' r U2 L' U2 L U2 L' U2 L U' L'

FL: L F' L' F L' U L U' L' U L U2 L' U L


F2L: 39 23:14

FR: R U R' U' R U R' U2 R U' R'

BR: R' U R U' R' U2 R U' R' U R

BL: L U' L' U' L U L' U2 L U' L'

FL: L' U L U' L' U2 L U' L' U L


F2L 40 23:50

FR: R U' R' U R U2 R' U R U' R'

BR: R' U R U R' U' R U2 R' U R

BL: L U' L' U L U2 L' U L U' L'

FL: L' U L U L' U' L U2 L' U L


F2L 41 24:30

FR: r U' r' U2 r U r' R U R'

BR: R' U R r' U r U2 r' U' r

BL: l U' l' U2 l U l' L U L'

FL: L' U' L l' U l U2 R' F' R


F2L 42 25:11

FR: R U' R' r U' r' U2 r U r'

BR: r' U r U2 r' U' r R' U' R

BL: L U' L' l U' l' U2 l U l'

FL: l' U l U2 l' U' l L' U' L


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## Rpotts (May 21, 2012)

Awesome vid so far, haven't finished it yet. 

F2L 7 - BR - r U2 R2' U' R2 U' r' --- 7 HTM shorter

F2L 13 - FR - M' U' R U R' U2 R U' r'

F2L 16 - BR - M' U' r' U r U M --- 4 ETM shorter

F2L 24 - FR - F U R U' R' F' R U' R'

F2L 34 - BR - U R' F R' F' R U' R


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## samkli (May 21, 2012)

Rpotts said:


> Awesome vid so far, haven't finished it yet.
> 
> F2L 7 - BR - r U2 R2' U' R2 U' r' --- 7 HTM shorter
> 
> ...


 
Wow, thanks!


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## samehsameh (May 21, 2012)

F2L 3 1:13
BL: U l' L2 U' L' U' M

F2L 3 1:13
BL: U l' L2 U' L' *U* M


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## jeff081692 (May 21, 2012)

F2L 2 BL I use B r' U' r. I think that is faster. Great video though I will check this when I want a alg with no rotations.


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## Godmil (May 21, 2012)

Pretty cool video. Thanks for posting.
Only watched the first 5mins so far... but for F2L 3-FR I really think F' U' F is worth practicing, it's pretty quick.


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## Robert-Y (May 21, 2012)

Where did you get these algs from? Were all of them taken from Macky's site? Did you find any of them yourself? Can you tell me some algorithms which you found?

Whilst watching the video I noticed some terrible algs.

You didn't even include F U F' or F' U' F. Instead you suggested U r' R2 U' R' U M' and U' l L2 U L U' M'.


You even suggested these algs:

F2L 38 22:26

FR: R' F R F' R U' R' U R U' R' U2 R U' R'

BR: l U' R' U l' U2 R U2 R' U2 R U2 R' U R

BL: r' U L U' r U2 L' U2 L U2 L' U2 L U' L'

FL: L F' L' F L' U L U' L' U L U2 L' U L

They are all 16 or 19 quarter turns! Why use an algorithm this long for an F2L case just to avoid a rotation? Most PLLs are shorter and nicer than these algs! I can't believe you decided to include F2L algorithms which are (obviously) worse than PLL.

The reason why people try to avoid rotations is to *save time*. I'm fairly certain that these algs will waste time compared to the regular algs. Please tell me you've considered the algorithms before you made the video. If you haven't, why not?

One last thing, I don't really see the point of the video. I think people can read the algorithms and learn the algorithms without watching the video. I don't think you've shown any complicated algorithms which are difficult to execute, that require a video to show the necessary finger tricks to perform the algortihm quickly.


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## Zaterlord (May 21, 2012)

For case 1 BR I would use U f R' f' instead of r' U' R U M', because it's shorter and for some people the slice turns takes more time than the usual turns.

f moves can be used in all of the cases where you otherwise would need B moves or really long algs


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## samkli (May 21, 2012)

Robert-Y said:


> Where did you get these algs from? Were all of them taken from Macky's site? Did you find any of them yourself?



The most common ones are from the wiki, a few of them are from Macky's site, a few of them are from jskyler's F2L videos and I came up with some of them.




Robert-Y said:


> You didn't even include F U F' or F' U' F. Instead you suggested U r' R2 U' R' U M' and U' l L2 U L U' M'.


 
I personally don´t like F U F' of F' U' F and I know that others don´t like them aswell, so that´s why I included U r' R2 U' R' U M' and U' l L2 U L U' M' instead. And if you don´t agree on that it´s up to you. I have nothing against that.



Robert-Y said:


> You even suggested these algs:
> 
> F2L 38 22:26
> 
> ...


 
That was the best that I could find for those cases. Would you´ve been happier if I included all cases except for case 38 just because I couldn't find any short and good algs for that cases?



Robert-Y said:


> One last thing, I don't really see the point of the video.



The point of this whole thread is to show that every single F2L case can be solved without a rotation in a _relatively_ good way. I´m not even using all of these algs in my regular solves, and I know that som algs is a bit long and bad, but it was the best that I could find. And if you find the video unnecessary, don´t watch it. The only reason why I made a video is because I know that some people are to lazy to set up the cases and try out all the algs by themself.


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## Escher (May 21, 2012)

Just reading Rob's comments, sounds like it would be a good idea for you to check here:

http://www.opticubes.com/cubing/f2l/

It seems a lot of people don't know about/use this any more.


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## foolish (May 21, 2012)

What about d and d' turns or do you consider them as rotations?

For example F2L 2 - BL:

Instead of _U2 r2 B' r' U r'_ I would do d' R' U R


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## Zaterlord (May 21, 2012)

For case 7 BR I would use U' f R2 f' U2 f R' f' (8 moves) instead of the 14 move algorithm

Case 19 U f R2 f' U f R' f'


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## Kirjava (May 21, 2012)

You say rotationless F2L like it's a good thing


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## Robert-Y (May 21, 2012)

samkli said:


> The most common ones are from the wiki, a few of them are from Macky's site, a few of them are from jskyler's F2L videos and I came up with some of them.


Which ones did you come up with? Can you give me some examples?



samkli said:


> I personally don´t like F U F' of F' U' F and I know that others don´t like them aswell, so that´s why I included U r' R2 U' R' U M' and U' l L2 U L U' M' instead. And if you don´t agree on that it´s up to you. I have nothing against that.


F U F' and F' U' F are twice as short. It's not a complicated or long algorithm to get used to.



samkli said:


> That was the best that I could find for those cases. Would you´ve been happier if I included all cases except for case 38 just because I couldn't find any short and good algs for that cases?


Ok without looking at any other sources, I used cube explorer 5 and found this: R' U R' U2' B' R2 B U2 R2 for F2L 38 BR. It's the second solution which it give me. I don't even need to manipulate the algorithm. It's not difficult to find a good algorithm for this case. I would have been happier if it's quite clear you tried to find something decent, at least with an algorithm finding program like CE5.



samkli said:


> The point of this whole thread is to show that every single F2L case can be solved without a rotation in a _relatively_ good way. I´m not even using all of these algs in my regular solves, and I know that som algs is a bit long and bad, but it was the best that I could find. And if you find the video unnecessary, don´t watch it. The only reason why I made a video is because I know that some people are to lazy to set up the cases and try out all the algs by themself.


Well we can show that every single F2L case can be solved without a rotation _without_ a video. If some people are too lazy to set up the cases and try out all the algs by themselves, then we should be discouraging their behaviour. I don't really feel they deserve help in that case. To me it's like:

Person1: Hey can you give me a good algorithm for this case?

Person2: Ok. R U R' U' R U R'.

Person1: Oh wow, can you make a video for me please? I'm too lazy to set up the case and try it out.

I don't think this should be tolerated.


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## sa11297 (May 21, 2012)

Anyone want to try a similar video (or algorithm list) for empty slots? or EO control? or to manipulate bad pairs? Actually, its probably been done already. Can anyone link me if so?


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## jeff081692 (May 22, 2012)

sa11297 said:


> Anyone want to try a similar video (or algorithm list) for empty slots? or EO control? or to manipulate bad pairs? Actually, its probably been done already. Can anyone link me if so?


 
http://www.cubefreak.net/speed/advancedf2l/standard.php


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## peterbone (May 23, 2012)

Can I ask that everyone with rotationless F2L algs add them to the wiki if they're not there already. It's so much easier to see them next to the picture.


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## Godmil (May 23, 2012)

Robert-Y said:


> If some people are too lazy to set up the cases and try out all the algs by themselves, then we should be discouraging their behaviour. I don't really feel they deserve help in that case....
> I don't think this should be tolerated.



That's rather harsh don't you think.
The two main times I have a chance to learn new cubing things isn't actually when I'm cubing (I tend to cube while walking to and from work). But I can watch videos 1) at work and 2) on my iPod while waiting with my kids as they fall asleep, both times I'm unable to actually have a cube in hand.
It's very easy to learn new algs, or at least work out if they're worth learning, by watching someone perform them on video...
But you don't think I 'deserve' to learn new things?

Given that he also typed all the cases out, as well as making the video, I don't get how you can criticise him for putting in more effort than most would.


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## Robert-Y (May 23, 2012)

Well I guess you're not too lazy in that case? You are just too busy? That's fine IMO.

I recently created a table with OLLCP algs for all cases. If I have enough time, I would happily make videos to show people how to perform some of the algorithms quickly because I don't think it's obvious in some cases. I wouldn't make the videos if the main reason was that people are too lazy to try the algorithms themselves. This is slightly off topic but Breandan made a video on how he executes his PLL algs. I thought that creating the video was definitely a good idea since he can sub 1 all of them and most people cannot.

Most if not, all of the algorithms in the video are really not that hard to perform. Is anyone finding *a lot* of difficulty in executing any of these algs?

I think it's great to try and contribute to the community but I don't really see anything new and useful in this video.

Similar to what Kirjava said, I don't know why it seems that rotationless F2L is being promoted as a good thing. Rotating can be a good thing, it allows you to look ahead at other slots and find pieces. I really don't care if the algorithms I use for F2L are rotationless, I only care about how fast they can be done, and I don't think I'm alone in what I'm saying.


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## Godmil (May 23, 2012)

Robert-Y said:


> I really don't care if the algorithms I use for F2L are rotationless, I only care about how fast they can be done, and I don't think I'm alone in what I'm saying.



It's funny, until very recently I never really saw anyone on the forums saying that rotations were anything but bad. but clearly something like y' R' U' R is going to be faster than U l' L2 U' L' U M. I think the phrase "avoid doing so many cube rotations" has just been taken too far in some peoples minds. Having said that through some of the 5 move inserts I find can be quicker than doing a rotation + 3/4 RU moves. It's always worth experimenting... just as long as you keep your eye on the correct goal.


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## jeff081692 (May 23, 2012)

Interesting. I have been making a table of my F2L algs by copying the Absolute F2L page into a word document and inserting the algs I use for each case as if I were to get it in a real solve and the cases that I haven't finished are the ones that give me the most trouble. When going through the table it is often clear to see which cases you need to work on and compare with another site or cuber. I think I will add how fast I can execute each alg after I finish my table and then consider if I should change things or not.


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## Godmil (May 23, 2012)

Sounds like a good idea, any chance you could share the document when you're finished?


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## jeff081692 (May 23, 2012)

Godmil said:


> Sounds like a good idea, any chance you could share the document when you're finished?


 
I could do that but I also encourage people to try this exercise for themselves to at least capture what you currently do so you are not biased to change to something when it could have already been good. I have also been looking at reconstructions of a few top cubers and putting their solve time next to the particular alg (it helps me feel confident when I see a sub 10 cuber used a rotation here too.) The difference between this document and other alg sites is that eventually it will have a collection of algs for each case that has been used by a sub 10 cuber and not just optimal algs that reduce rotations. 

That said, this started off as a personal attempt to improve my F2L and I wasn't thinking of releasing it unless I somehow become a notable cuber when there would probably be a little demand. But I will figure out how to put it into a google doc within the next few days and then let you know and you can just keep checking back until it is finished.


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